"Almost one in 10 young Irish adults believe Holocaust is a myth"

[JoeRoberts]

haven't seen the program yet but from what I can gauge on other reports she raised the matter of concerns in the context of several GAA county boards petitioning for Allianz to be removed?

In doing so, she is delivering public-service broadcasting. She is doing her job!

You need to view it then so. Whoever the "WE" are, essentially asked Rte whether they should join the protest.

 

[JoeRoberts]

Shamefully so, when its in the gift of Western powers to act otherwise.

Talk us through what that process would look like.

 

[Sister Sara]

asked Rte whether they should join the protest

RTE are already in protest against Israel.

 

[Sister Sara]

It is not an issue for a presenter on our national tv to take sides on. She can report on the issue of course but has no right to be involved in it. Neither has any other presenter.

Our national broadcaster is already in dispute against the Israeli apartheid fascist regime.

 

[Sister Sara]

I support the right of Palestinians to live as equal citizens in their own land.

So do I.

Is that an unqualified support?
Does it include attacks in any country which they deem to be their enemy?
Is it okay for them to set of bombs in Europe?
Is it okay for them to set off bombs here?
Do you support their aim to remove Israel from the face of the earth and to kill every Israeli who opposes them (including the Jews who always lived there, LBGT Palestinians who fled there, etc)?
Do you support their ethnic cleansing of Christian and other minorities from the areas they control?
Do you support the mass murder of their political opponents within the lands they control?

Do you support blowing up airplanes?

Do you support blowing up busses full of school children?
How many children can they murder until your support becomes qualified?

I'm not sure if there's anything that I can say I support without qualification.

 

[Purple]

No one currently living in Palestine would be expelled but the right of return would be extended to include Palestinians as well as Jews.

Okay. Should the Jews expelled from their countries across the Arab world and Iran as part of the same process also have the same right to return to those countries?

In the first 25 days after October 7th, it's likely that Israel killed more Palestinian civilians than the number of Israeli civilians killed by Palestinians in the preceding 75 years, including October 7th.
It's obvious which side have behaved like savages and ought to be opposed by all civilised countries.

I agree, but hat doesn't answer any of my questions.

I'm trying to understand where the parameters are in your proposition. What level of violence is justified in order to achieve the outcome you desire?

 

[Purple]

Our national broadcaster is already in dispute against the Israeli apartheid fascist regime.

But not other regimes which are far worse.

 

[Purple]

I would agree, in the real-politik of affairs that is the 99.99% certainty. Shamefully so, when its in the gift of Western powers to act otherwise.

Is it? Is it without far more bloodshed?

The next despairing thing is that Western governments appear clueless of the fomenting resentment building up in younger generations. And, in my opinion it is more than 'fad'. I believe it is becoming ingrained.

Which younger generations are you referring to?

I agree, and I also agree it should happen "never-again", dont you?

Yes.

The Palestinians didnt lose their land just 80yrs ago....they lost it 80yrs and every year since!! They are losing it today!

Well the ones that lost it 80 years ago lost it 80 years ago. Once.

Surely its not beyond the civillised world, in 2025, to say Stop!

I agree, but saying stop does nothing.

Disarm Israel, arrest Naziyahoo, boycott and sanction.

But if Israel was disarmed it would be destroyed and the population massacred. I don't think that would be a good outcome.

Instead, an unrelenting conquest of all Palestinian land is occurring.

"Palestinian land" is, historically the land of Canaan, also know as The Holy Land and Israel. It was renamed Palestine (Syria Palaestina) after the Philistines who were the enemies of the Jews by the Roman Emperor Hadrian, following the suppression of the Bar Kokhba revolt in 135 AD. It was intended to remove the connection between the land and the Jewish people.
You need to be specific about what you mean by Palestinian land.

Nobody here proposed that. The proposition is for Israel to comply with international obligations, cease its criminal occupation of the West Bank, end the blockade of Gaza, recognise the State of Palestine and begin a peace process where both nations, people's can live in peace and prosper.

That's what most people want. Unfortunately Hamas are utterly and intractably opposed to that, as are the current bunch of nutters running Israel.

I don't think anyone here is advocating any such measures? For India, Ulster or Israel.

Okay, so all "Palestinian lands" won't be returned.

Palestine would be the exception. There is clear intent by Israel, facilitated by Western powers to un-plant Palestinians from their land.

Are you referring to Gaza and the West Bank or the lands that Hamas and many Palestinians claim as their own?

 

[Purple]

Is that an unqualified support?

No. It is not within the power of the Palestinian Arabs to achieve those aims. It is within the gift of the Israeli State. The previous settlement which established the Palestinian Authority was undermined by the people who form the current Israeli Government, especially Ariel Sharon who effectively provoked the second Intifada when he visited Temple Mount, and the incompetence, ineptitude and unbelievable levels of corruption by the leadership of the Palestinian Authority. Special mention has to go tho the vile murderer Yasser Arafat who stole hundreds of millions from his own people, amassing a personal fortune of somewhere between $1 billion and $3 billion. With such forces acting against it from without and within it was almost inevitable that the agreement brokered as a result of the Oslo Accords would fail.

I struggle to find virtue in the actions of either side.

 

[Inexpensive]

Okay. Should the Jews expelled from their countries across the Arab world and Iran as part of the same process also have the same right to return to those countries?

Sure, why not?

I agree, but hat doesn't answer any of my questions.

I'm trying to understand where the parameters are in your proposition. What level of violence is justified in order to achieve the outcome you desire?

A man is being beaten to death.
An onlooker asks his companion to describe what 'parameters' he believes ought to limit the victim's defensive efforts.

 

[Purple]

Sure, why not?

Now it really gets messy. Do you think that Egypt, Morocco, Tunisia, Iran, Iraq, Jordan, Syria etc will all give the homes, farms, businesses etc which were taken from hundreds of thousands of Jews after 1948?
That about the people who own them now? They most likely bought them since then and so are legal owners of the businesses. Who compensates them?
Ditto for the Jews who own stuff in Israel but bought it or built it legally. Where do they go?

A man is being beaten to death.
An onlooker asks his companion to describe what 'parameters' he believes ought to limit the victim's defensive efforts.

Strawman argument.
Can you answer the question I asked?

 

[Inexpensive]

Strawman argument.
Can you answer the question I asked?

Au contraire, it cuts to the chase.
A desire to discuss hypothetical Muslim violence even as Israel slaughters them daily.

It's easier to get folks to fear and loathe Muslims than to like Israel and it effectively achieves the same goal.
More than one way to skin a cat

So no, I'm not answering your question beyond what I have already done previously.

 

[Purple]

Au contraire, it cuts to the chase.

No it doesn't. It's a complete strawman and a deflection.

A desire to discuss hypothetical Muslim violence even as Israel slaughters them daily.

No, actual violence by the PLO, Hamas and other Arab Palestinian groups over the decades.
To be specific (off the top of my head so not in order and not comprehensive);

• The Munich Olympics attack.
• The attacks targeting children in Kiryat Shmona and Ma'alot in 1974 where 43 people, over half of whom were children, were killed.
• The 1000 Palestinians (accused of colaborating) that were killed by the PLO during the first Intifada.
• The hijacking of the Achille Lauro cruise liner during which a 69 year old wheelchair bound Jewish American was thrown overboard.
• The attacks on Tourists in Egypt in 2004 referred to as the Sini bombings.
• The suicide bombings in nightclubs and hotels.
• Hijacking Airplanes.
• The 7th of October attacks.

It's easier to get folks to fear and loathe Muslims than to like Israel and it effectively achieves the same goal.
More than one way to skin a cat

I don't understand what that means. I don't like any fundamentalists. I make no distinction between Nazis, Communists, Extremist Muslims, Hindus, Jews or Christians or anyone else who wants to create a utopian society by imposing their beliefs on others. It always ends in tyranny and death.

So no, I'm not answering your question beyond what I have already done previously.

Okay, so you're not answering my question at all. Therefore your assertion that you "support the right of the Palestinian people to resist" is without context and so doesn't actually mean anything at all.

 

[Sister Sara]

"Palestinian land" is, historically the land of Canaan, also know as The Holy Land and Israel. It was renamed Palestine (Syria Palaestina) after the Philistines who were the enemies of the Jews by the Roman Emperor Hadrian, following the suppression of the Bar Kokhba revolt in 135 AD.

Well if 80yrs ago is akin to the ship sailing, then this is the ship sailing, decommissioned, rotted, sunk and the stuff of myth and has no bearing on any claims for land today.

 

[Sister Sara]

But not other regimes which are far worse.

There are no regimes competing in Eurovison that are far worse than Israel.

 

[Inexpensive]

Okay, so you're not answering my question at all. Therefore your assertion that you "support the right of the Palestinian people to resist" is without context and so doesn't actually mean anything at all.

So if I say that I support the right of the Palestinian people to resist [their oppressors] without telling you exactly what exact violence I'd find acceptable, it's meaningless.
Do you realise how silly that sounds?

 

[JoeRoberts]

Our national broadcaster is already in dispute against the Israeli apartheid fascist regime

That is a decision for them re the Eurovision.
Its a different thing altogether for presenters considering getting involved in a protest that is an internal matter among some in the GAA.

 

[Sister Sara]

Its a different thing altogether for presenters considering getting involved in a protest that is an internal matter among some in the GAA.

Not really, remind yourself of the official RTE position.

"RTÉ feels that Ireland’s participation remains unconscionable given the appalling loss of lives in Gaza and the humanitarian crisis there which continues to put the lives of so many civilians at risk. RTÉ remains deeply concerned by the targeted killing of journalists in Gaza during the conflict and the continued denial of access to international journalists to the territory.”

That there were protests being discussed in GAA circles with an 800 player petition calling for GAA to drop the Allianz name, and considering the official RTE position towards the Israeli death-machine, IDF, Cantwell, a journalist working for RTE, was completely on-point to highlight that concerns were raised with regard the naming of the program she is presenting considering the official RTE position. With or without a GAA protest.

When she says "we" I assume she has the backing of the production team, staff, other journalists in RTE until such time as I hear any different.

Have you heard any different from anyone within RTE?

 

[JoeRoberts]

When she says "we" I assume she has the backing of the production team, staff, other journalists in RTE until such time as I hear any different.

Have you heard any different from anyone within RTE?

Exactly as i assumed in the original post, the far left union.
They need reminding that their job is to present programs, not influence protests.
If they are really that concerned let them go on strike for 3 years without pay like the afore mentioned Mary Manning did.
But no chance that they would even miss a tea break in protest.

 

[JoeRoberts]

Today is the International Holocaust Rememberence day. Very little on Irish media about it. I picked it up from BBC.
Opportunity lost maybe to tackle the10%. in thread title.
Our President has a statement on her website and fair dues to her for keeping it on point for once.