Key Post I got cash back three times in 6 months

misemoi

Frequent Poster
Messages
100
Actually now that I think of it, the banks will want mortgage statements so you'd be looking at a year before you switch probably. KBC appear most hungry for business, so maybe contact them and see what they say.
 

cheirin123

New Member
Messages
3
Actually now that I think of it, the banks will want mortgage statements so you'd be looking at a year before you switch probably. KBC appear most hungry for business, so maybe contact them and see what they say.
Could I not switch to EBS after drawing down with PTSB? They don't seem to have any minimum requirement with existing lender. I'm thinking my best options are as follows:

1. New mortgage PTSB
2. Switch to EBS - 1 year fixed @3%
3. Switch to BOI after 12 months (if cashback still available)
4. Switch to UB (if low fixed rate still available)

OR

1. New mortgage PTSB
2. Switch to EBS variable
3. Switch to 4 yr fixed with UB at 2.6% and cut out risk of fixed interest rates increasing over 12 months.
 

Sean Og

Frequent Poster
Messages
140
Absolutely , it's the same process, just don't draw-down the first mortgage until you have the others in place. It is the same process because you are applying for a new mortgage so all the banks will need the same information from you like salary certs , bank statements, proof of savings etc. If you have all the paperwork in place for one bank you should certainly use it for other banks. If it's a first time mortgage then you will not have previous mortgage statements so the banks will not look for them. If you draw-down your first mortgage without having the others in place then you are in bother because PTSB and BOI ans Ulster bank all have minimum requirements regarding time with your previous mortgage lender which makes the quick switches impossible. If you had 4 first time mortgage offers in place you can switch them all because the mortgage is valid for 6 months leaving you loads of time to complete all the switches. At €9000 a time it's absolutely well worth doing. Ill even do it for you for €2000 a time ;)
 

SparkRite

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Messages
1,078
Just what may be a little fly in the ointment, as I think this whole scenario is a little simplistic.

Say you have a mortgage with bank A for 3 yrs or so and you apply for mortgage approval in full (letter of offer) to banks x,y,z, obviously using your existing mortgage as required proof of "length of time with previous lender".
Assuming you get all three offers and you start the process.

This is fine with bank X but what happens when you go to draw down from bank Y ? They expect to see a lien/charge on the title to be with bank A, but now see a different lien on the title ie. bank X . This is now outside the terms of offer and surely would raise a few questions, at the very least. ie. Did you make a mistake? Is there in fact two charges on the property? Is it a case of non-disclosure? How did bank X come into the equation and for how long? etc.

This just has to come to the fore as title and existing closure balance is examined by the lender.
As terms have now changed I strongly suspect "letter of offer" can and most likely would be rescinded.
 

SparkRite

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Messages
1,078
Hi,

Have a read of the following thread.
You essentially need a solicitor on board who will give undertakings, but never register the mortgage charge until the last switch.

https://www.askaboutmoney.com/threads/finding-it-hard-to-get-a-solicitor-to-do-a-switch-for-me.210431/page-2
Yep, just read it, sharp practice, at best.

Regardless of what people may think about banks, they are not in the business of giving out free money.
Undertaking after undertaking after undertaking, what could possibly go wrong ??
An element of deceit also exists, ie. the second new lender looks for a redemption figure and expects this to be from the original bank but it is in fact from the first new lender, which is not disclosed.

I'm not surprised some/many solicitors baulk at doing this as it erodes the very basis of what an undertaking is and I suspect if widespread then a solicitors undertaking may become meaningless in conveyancy. As in this case, for it to work, such undertakings must not be and in fact are never intended to be undertaken.
 

renter45

Frequent Poster
Messages
101
EBS have declined my switch as not with current lender 12 months. (switched last year)
Are they making up acceptance criteria as they go along??
 

Sean Og

Frequent Poster
Messages
140
Yes because they allowed me to switch back to them after only 2 months with BOI. In fairness if you followed my story i told them what i was doing so they were happy to take me back and give me the 2% cash back. I went from EBS - PTSB - BOI- EBS. Obviously i didn't receive any cash back when i took out the original loan with EBS in 2011.
 

Sean Og

Frequent Poster
Messages
140
The solicitor gave an undertaking to do x but the client then told them to do Y so they could no longer do x. I disagree with you. The Central bank are encouraging people to switch and switch often. The Banks have no clauses to say you must remain with us for 24 months or we will take back the cash back. If they want to protect themselves then they should change their t & c's.
 

Bronte

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Messages
13,249
Yep, just read it, sharp practice, at best.

Regardless of what people may think about banks, they are not in the business of giving out free money.
Undertaking after undertaking after undertaking, what could possibly go wrong ??
An element of deceit also exists, ie. the second new lender looks for a redemption figure and expects this to be from the original bank but it is in fact from the first new lender, which is not disclosed.

I'm not surprised some/many solicitors baulk at doing this as it erodes the very basis of what an undertaking is and I suspect if widespread then a solicitors undertaking may become meaningless in conveyancy. As in this case, for it to work, such undertakings must not be and in fact are never intended to be undertaken.
I don't see any sharp practice, and I find that a rich comment after the carry on of Irish banks (no insult to you intended).

All I see here is savy customers making money.
 

RedOnion

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Messages
3,047
The Banks have no clauses to say you must remain with us for 24 months or we will take back the cash back. If they want to protect themselves then they should change their t & c's.
They have no such clause because it's illegal. I think BOI had it at first, but had to remove it as it was a breach of MCD. That's when the brought in the extra 1% after X years.
 

renter45

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Messages
101
I'll be with current lender 1 year in May 2019 (6 weeks time). After getting salary certs, bank statements, loan statements, credit card statements etc I got a short reply saying underwriters declined application as I wasn't with lender 1 year. but if I wanted to resubmit fresh statements etc after 5th may, they would look at application.
My issue is that their website doesn't say that swichers must be with current lender a minimum of 1 year nor did the customer adviser mention same over phone or at any point during email conversations. I even had to get a second set of bank statements as some were 2 days over the "within last 2 months" period.
Its the time I wasted getting all the information for them. If they had stated at the start that I had to wait until 1 year was up with current lender it would have saved a lot of hassle.
Prob the wrong thread as im not doing multiple switches, just moving for 1 cashback.
 

Sean Og

Frequent Poster
Messages
140
Be patient and go again in a few weeks time. Yes they can move the goal posts from time to time. As i said it wasn't an issue for me but i was dealing with the local EBS office in town and maybe they told the underwriters to look at the application on its own. After all i was with them for 7 years and moved away for about 6 months to get cash back from PTSB and BOI before returning to EBS for their cash back. I told them what i was doing before i moved although i only told them i was moving to PTSB not BOI as well .lol
 

cheirin123

New Member
Messages
3
Absolutely , it's the same process, just don't draw-down the first mortgage until you have the others in place. It is the same process because you are applying for a new mortgage so all the banks will need the same information from you like salary certs , bank statements, proof of savings etc. If you have all the paperwork in place for one bank you should certainly use it for other banks. If it's a first time mortgage then you will not have previous mortgage statements so the banks will not look for them. If you draw-down your first mortgage without having the others in place then you are in bother because PTSB and BOI ans Ulster bank all have minimum requirements regarding time with your previous mortgage lender which makes the quick switches impossible. If you had 4 first time mortgage offers in place you can switch them all because the mortgage is valid for 6 months leaving you loads of time to complete all the switches. At €9000 a time it's absolutely well worth doing. Ill even do it for you for €2000 a time ;)
Thanks Sean Og.

@RedOnion , do you agree that it's possible on above basis? (Not doubting you Sean Og but just want to make 100% sure before I apply to 2/3 other banks)
 
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SparkRite

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Messages
1,078
I don't see any sharp practice, and I find that a rich comment after the carry on of Irish banks (no insult to you intended).
Believe me, I have absolutely no love of banks and have even less respect for them.

But I find it incredulous that you don't see any sharp practice here, ie. undertakings given with no intention of fulfilling same, redemption figures from a different lender than the one referenced on initial application not disclosed etc. ??
Now you can use whatever language you like to "flower" this up but that is what is intentionally occurring. Even the OP has admitted that he is "being light with the facts" which directly equates to subterfuge.
Hardly acting in the utmost of good faith.

Notwithstanding this, if I thought for one second it is as easy as it is being portrayed here, I would also do it. I have few morals where banks are concerned.

So, what's stopping me, I have two children and one sibling working in three well known financial institutions, two in managerial positions and one not quite there yet. I put this scheme to them and they picked so many holes in it that I forget most of them. All three said it would not be looked on in a favourable light and would not be helpful should the proposer wish to do business with them in the future.

Another point I would be wary about is, as you cannot/will not opt to be locked into a fixed interest mortgage as you intend to be changing shortly, what happens if the "wheel falls off the cart" and you are stuck with your present lender with its higher interest for way longer than you had imagined ?
 
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Bronte

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Messages
13,249
At the time the solicitor gives an undertaking there is no guarantee the borrower will be able to move to another bank. So I don't see any issue here.

As for doing business in the future, we are all just numbers to bankers. Numbers to make money out of and there are no morals when it comes to banking, it's strickly business. So how could it affect a person moving banks? Are you suggesting they put a red card on our accounts and refuse to deal with us?

And you're pretty silly not to move if you would make money on it. Do you not agree with shopping around. Do you apply the same "standard's" to life/house/utilities/car insurance products?
 

SparkRite

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Messages
1,078
@Bronte I'm not going to argue the point with you re. sharp practice, either you haven't read my post correctly or you are being purposefully obtuse.

Re. Shopping around, of course I do, on a regular basis but there is absolutely, not even a whiff of, anything underhand about it.
Buying an item in Lidls as opposed to Aldis or changing utility providers I do not need to resort to any sleight or duplicity.

I'm not denying that maybe it would work for some but, call a spade a spade, it is chicanery !
 
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