Favourite TV series

Purple

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Yep, from last week's episode, up on the RTE Player
Okay, so the Lycra is still there. That's bad alright.

I do have a problem with the normalisation of obesity. We don't talk about 'heroin shaming', or 'alcoholism shaming' so why is fat shaming a thing?

As a former smoker I frequently had people telling me I shouldn't smoke, so why isn't it okay to tell a fat person they shouldn't eat that cake or those crisps they are about to tuck into?
Can you imagine the reception you'd get if you said to someone "You know, you shouldn't really eat that and maybe you'd think about going for a few walks"? Though it seems to be okay to tell a smoker that they should give up and think about their children.
When someone is at a meal in a restaurant and says they are going outside for a cigarette they can expect a few judgemental looks and comments.
Should the fatty expect the same thing when they are ordering dessert? "Really? Are you going to order that, are you sure?"
 

RetirementPlan

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Okay, so the Lycra is still there. That's bad alright.

I do have a problem with the normalisation of obesity. We don't talk about 'heroin shaming', or 'alcoholism shaming' so why is fat shaming a thing?

As a former smoker I frequently had people telling me I shouldn't smoke, so why isn't it okay to tell a fat person they shouldn't eat that cake or those crisps they are about to tuck into?
Can you imagine the reception you'd get if you said to someone "You know, you shouldn't really eat that and maybe you'd think about going for a few walks"? Though it seems to be okay to tell a smoker that they should give up and think about their children.
When someone is at a meal in a restaurant and says they are going outside for a cigarette they can expect a few judgemental looks and comments.
Should the fatty expect the same thing when they are ordering dessert? "Really? Are you going to order that, are you sure?"
For me, I wouldn't tell any stranger not to smoke, or what to eat, or what to wear, or that they should smile. I just wouldn't tell someone what to do, on the basis that it doesn't impinge on me in anyway.

I've only ever told (or asked) someone not to smoke if they smoking in a non-smoking area. Remember the non-sensical concept of the non-smoking area of the restaurant or airplane? I would tell (or ask) someone to switch off their car engine if they're idling while waiting, when it impinges directly on me or others.

I can't find any sign of that interview with Donal O'Shea on the RTE Radio player, so if anyone has more details, please let me know. The RTE response to complaints seemed to rely on a survey of viewers to show that people had improved their exercise or eating habits. It seems the survey was done one week after the show finished, which doesn't seem to me to be a reliable measure of effectiveness.
 

RetirementPlan

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I heard him on NewsTalk. I seldom listen to the Public sector Broadcaster as their bias upsets my usual Zen state.
I seldom listen to Newstalk as their bias upsets my usual Zen state. But thanks for the tip - fortunately, it was Shane Coleman rather than the ranting doctor that did the interview, so my allergies were kept under control.

My interpretation of what he said was;

- This year's OT is the 'least stigmatising ever'
- OT isn't responsible for a rash of eating disorder cases in Ireland, so therefore it is OK
- The focus on a single metric (weight) is something that ED clinics around the world are battling with, as they find it is not the most effective way to treat obesity.

He blamed social media as a cause of EDs, and slightly bizarrely, singled out 'Dr Pimple Popper', who's only connection to weight, obesity or EDs is to tell people that she's taken a 2kg or 3kg growth off their back.

Telling us that it is the 'least stigmatising year ever' is damning with feint praise at best. Why should any supposed self-help TV show be stigmatising, at all?
 
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Purple

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I seldom listen to Newstalk as their bias upsets my usual Zen state.
You like staying in the Public Sector Broadcaster Information Bubble... that figures.
fortunately, it was Shane Coleman rather than the ranting doctor that did the interview, so my allergies were kept under control.
I've grown to like her but I do admit that she doesn't give the Shinners the same armchair ride they get from their mates in RTE so I can see why you don't like her. Exposing them to reality is unfair. She's probably on "The List" at HQ in Belfast. I'm probably a few pages back too.
 

RetirementPlan

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You like staying in the Public Sector Broadcaster Information Bubble... that figures.
I'd prefer not to have to listed to Pat Kenny (sponsored by Jaguar) telling us how dangerous cyclists are on the road and how he saw one breaking a red light on his way home last night, having spent years avoiding listening to serial speeding offender Hook (sponsored by Nissan) telling people that they should assault cyclists.

Don't listen to too much RTE either tbh, Morning Ireland is OK, maybe Claire Byrne if I'm out and about, possibly Brendan O'Connor at the weekends. Creedo is excellent in the evenings.
 

Baby boomer

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I'd prefer not to have to listed to Pat Kenny (sponsored by Jaguar) telling us how dangerous cyclists are on the road and how he saw one breaking a red light on his way home last night, having spent years avoiding listening to serial speeding offender Hook (sponsored by Nissan) telling people that they should assault cyclists.

Don't listen to too much RTE either tbh, Morning Ireland is OK, maybe Claire Byrne if I'm out and about, possibly Brendan O'Connor at the weekends. Creedo is excellent in the evenings.
Pat Kenny is head and shoulders above any other current affairs radio presenter we have. His intelligence and breadth of knowledge shine through. He is tough on bullshitters and evasion. Katie Hannon is getting better and better too and equally takes no prisoners. Claire Byrne and Brendan O'Conner are wannabes by comparison.
 

RetirementPlan

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Pat Kenny is head and shoulders above any other current affairs radio presenter we have. His intelligence and breadth of knowledge shine through. He is tough on bullshitters and evasion. Katie Hannon is getting better and better too and equally takes no prisoners. Claire Byrne and Brendan O'Conner are wannabes by comparison.
Pat is certainly convinced that Pat's own intelligence and breadth of knowledge are head and shoulders above everyone else. He does seem to have gone a rabbit hole of being convinced that Pat knows best, and anyone else, like, for example, NPHET, with centuries of expertise, experience and training, should just be listening to Pat instead of bringing their professional expertise to the issue. He is also very clearly biased in a number of areas, such as anything relating to public services, and anything relating to cycling, he's far from professional.

Katie Hannon is good at challenging, but her presentation isn't great - lots of stuttering and losing her place and repetition. O'Connor is a chancer indeed, but a fairly entertaining and engaging one.
 

Purple

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NPHET, with centuries of expertise, experience and training, should just be listening to Pat instead of bringing their professional expertise to the issue.
Questioning the decisions of public bodies is his job. Unlike the Public Sector Broadcaster that's allowed on commercial radio stations.
He is also very clearly biased in a number of areas, such as anything relating to public services, and anything relating to cycling
Again, questioning public sector organisations is his job. Given the very high spend and bad outcomes in so much of the public sector I'd like to see more questioning.
As a cyclist I find his issue with cyclists annoying and disproportionate but it is worth questioning the stupid narrative that deaths and injuries to cyclists are caused by motorists. In my experience most are caused by the reckless and stupid behaviour of cyclists.

His knowledge of politics and history is excellent and he avoids the Public Sector Broadcaster's habit of framing everything as an emotive human interest story. If there's a long waiting time in A&E RTE will interview Mary, the 78 year old whose left buttock fell off and who had been waiting in a chair for 6 days and the "hero" Nurses who work "tirelessly" for up to 36 hours a week helping people like Mary, and that adds nothing to the discussion but rather deflects from the facts and distracts us from the root cause.
 

RetirementPlan

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Questioning the decisions of public bodies is his job. Unlike the Public Sector Broadcaster that's allowed on commercial radio stations.

Again, questioning public sector organisations is his job. Given the very high spend and bad outcomes in so much of the public sector I'd like to see more questioning.
I've no problem with robust questioning, and indeed, I will delight in the robust questioning of someone like Sarah McInerney.

On the two occasions I've had the misfortune to hear PK over the pandemic, where I wasn't in control of the dial, he wasn't so much asking questions, more so positioning himself and Luke as the experts, and sure the big eejits over there in NPHET wouldn't know anything compared to Pat and Luke. He went way beyond questioning, positioning himself as an expert player in the discussions. It's easy to be the expert when you don't have the responsibility or accountability for anything that you say - classic hurler on the ditch.

As a cyclist I find his issue with cyclists annoying and disproportionate but it is worth questioning the stupid narrative that deaths and injuries to cyclists are caused by motorists. In my experience most are caused by the reckless and stupid behaviour of cyclists.
I don't think there's any evidence to support your (or Pat's) victim-blaming narrative, but either way, the disproportionate approach is the big issue. Even IF cyclists were largely to blame for their deaths and injuries, these are but a drop in the ocean of the overall deaths and injuries on the road. Most road deaths and injuries are single vehicle collision or motorist vs motorist collisions, so it's pretty difficult to suggest that cyclists are the big issue that need to be fixed on our roads. But you'd never hear Pat (sponsored by Jaguar) suggesting something revolutionary like drivers slowing down or putting their phones away.

His knowledge of politics and history is excellent and he avoids the Public Sector Broadcaster's habit of framing everything as an emotive human interest story. If there's a long waiting time in A&E RTE will interview Mary, the 78 year old whose left buttock fell off and who had been waiting in a chair for 6 days and the "hero" Nurses who work "tirelessly" for up to 36 hours a week helping people like Mary, and that adds nothing to the discussion but rather deflects from the facts and distracts us from the root cause.

He's certainly knowledgable on many topics, but maybe he could use his knowledge to be a great interviewer rather than a player in the discussion.

And yes, sometimes RTE does go a little OTT on the human interest angle. However, this can have value too. Going back as far as the Prime Time investigation in the Lees Cross nursing home, this public interest story basically brought about HIQA and a whole regime of regulating nursing homes and disability services that didn't previously exist. Coverage of kids awaiting scoliosis operations brought significant attention on HSE delays, resulting in significant improvements. They've done good work on various kinds of disabilities over the years, giving real insights into the harsh realities of living with such conditions.

This can be overplayed, and perhaps needs to be done along with robust investigation and questioning, rather than instead of.
 

Purple

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I don't think there's any evidence to support your (or Pat's) victim-blaming narrative,
Where did I blame anyone? I'm a regular cyclist and I see cyclists doing dangerous things all the time. Are you suggesting that they don't?
Even IF cyclists were largely to blame for their deaths and injuries, these are but a drop in the ocean of the overall deaths and injuries on the road.
I agree and I'd add that their dangerous behaviour almost exclusively puts themselves at risk whereas dangerous behaviour by motorists puts everyone at risk.
He's certainly knowledgable on many topics, but maybe he could use his knowledge to be a great interviewer rather than a player in the discussion.
I agree with you there. He does like to be part of the story.
And yes, sometimes RTE does go a little OTT on the human interest angle. However, this can have value too. Going back as far as the Prime Time investigation in the Lees Cross nursing home, this public interest story basically brought about HIQA and a whole regime of regulating nursing homes and disability services that didn't previously exist. Coverage of kids awaiting scoliosis operations brought significant attention on HSE delays, resulting in significant improvements. They've done good work on various kinds of disabilities over the years, giving real insights into the harsh realities of living with such conditions.

This can be overplayed, and perhaps needs to be done along with robust investigation and questioning, rather than instead of.
Those investigations never addressed the root causes, they just resulted in more money being thrown at the problem, enabling the waste and inefficiency which caused the problems in the first place. We have one of the best funded healthcare systems in the world and have had for about the last 30 years. RTE never point that out and never start from the position that the problem is the misuse of resources rather than the lack of resources. In that they help to sustain the narrative which sustains the problem.

Anyway, what's your favourite TV show?
 

RetirementPlan

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Where did I blame anyone? I'm a regular cyclist and I see cyclists doing dangerous things all the time. Are you suggesting that they don't?

You blamed cyclists when you said; "In my experience most [deaths of and injuries to cyclists] are caused by the reckless and stupid behaviour of cyclists". Yes, I see cyclists doing silly things all the time. Dangerous is a bit of a stretch, in most cases the danger to themselves is fairly mild and the danger to others is non-existent. I see drivers doing dangerous stuff all the time, with mobile phone use being my major current bugbear. This lorry driver killed three people in the UK while browsing sex sites on his phone. https://www.independent.ie/world-ne...led-three-people-in-90kmh-crash-41229578.html
This is the kind of thing of results in deaths and serious injuries on the road, to cyclists, to pedestrians, and mostly to other motorists. I've seen several international studies into cyclist deaths and injuries showing that by and large, motorists are responsible most of the time. I'm aware of a tiny number of cases in Ireland where cyclists were clearly responsible for their own deaths, like the drunk who cycled onto the M1, or the guy who came off his bike in Wicklow during a fast descent. By and large, there's nothing to suggest that cyclists are generally responsible for their own deaths. Pat and others will make a big song and dance about lights and hi-vis for cyclists. The last time I looked at the data, 14 out of 16 cyclist deaths were in daylight, suggesting that lots of people really don't get the real causes of death and injury on the roads.

Those investigations never addressed the root causes, they just resulted in more money being thrown at the problem, enabling the waste and inefficiency which caused the problems in the first place. We have one of the best funded healthcare systems in the world and have had for about the last 30 years. RTE never point that out and never start from the position that the problem is the misuse of resources rather than the lack of resources. In that they help to sustain the narrative which sustains the problem.
True, they didn't look at root cause, though I'm not sure that's an entirely fair criticism of an investigative reporting time. It's a bit like expecting your mechanic to remove the speed bumps instead of just fixing your suspension. It's not really in their scope. They have done some stuff on value for money, like the procurement fraud that were going on, and the consultants who were clocking into two hospitals at the same time. They do cover some of the bigger picture stuff from time to time, and you'll hear Eddie Molloy and Colm McCarthy banging on about value for money.
Anyway, what's your favourite TV show?

Hard to beat this, which kicked off 23 years ago yesterday, as it happens.
 
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Peanuts20

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There was actually some good documentaries on RTE over Christmas, I particularly enjoyed the ones about music festivals in the 70's(watch it with a teenager or someone in their 20s who has been to something like EP for their reaction) and one about a guy who had made a lot of home movies around Dublin in the 50s and 60's. Both interesting social history docs, I presume they are up on the RTE player.
 

Purple

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There was actually some good documentaries on RTE over Christmas, I particularly enjoyed the ones about music festivals in the 70's(watch it with a teenager or someone in their 20s who has been to something like EP for their reaction) and one about a guy who had made a lot of home movies around Dublin in the 50s and 60's. Both interesting social history docs, I presume they are up on the RTE player.
TG4 have some great documentaries.
 

odyssey06

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I'm enjoying the trip down memory lane from ITV4's repeats of The Big Match. I say memory lane ... the games are from 1981 which is before my horizon of football memories - which started with the 1982 World Cup. But the players and events I have some second hand familiarity with.

I like how they often dip into games from the lower leagues... Third Division Huddersfield and Sheffield United played out a cracker on a mudbath (the matches are from February).
You can see the wingers slowing down as they hit the 'heavy' part of the pitch.
The players move differently to today's players - they have to protect themselves more. The ball is heavier, it hangs in the air, if you tried some of the tricks of today's footballers with them you'd look like an eejit! It is most obvious in the crosses.

And the commentaries pick out little quirks like the Fulham player married in a registry office at 11am playing at 3pm.
 

odyssey06

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There was actually some good documentaries on RTE over Christmas, I particularly enjoyed the ones about music festivals in the 70's(watch it with a teenager or someone in their 20s who has been to something like EP for their reaction) and one about a guy who had made a lot of home movies around Dublin in the 50s and 60's. Both interesting social history docs, I presume they are up on the RTE player.
Camera Tripod Bicycle was the one with footage from the 1950s and 1960s, was very good. I recognised some of the spots (including from around the corner from me in Dublin) but more captions would have been appreciated... the footage flashed by so fast.
 

Purple

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The ball is heavier
Apparently the older ball wasn't heavier but it absorbed water so it did get far heavier in the rain. The dry weight of the ball hasn't changes since 1937. Germany were against the change and threatened war over it. Nobody believed them and the rest is history.


Okay, I might have made the last bit up but the bit about the weight not changing since 1937 is true.
 

RetirementPlan

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I'm enjoying the trip down memory lane from ITV4's repeats of The Big Match. I say memory lane ... the games are from 1981 which is before my horizon of football memories - which started with the 1982 World Cup. But the players and events I have some second hand familiarity with.

I like how they often dip into games from the lower leagues... Third Division Huddersfield and Sheffield United played out a cracker on a mudbath (the matches are from February).
You can see the wingers slowing down as they hit the 'heavy' part of the pitch.
The players move differently to today's players - they have to protect themselves more. The ball is heavier, it hangs in the air, if you tried some of the tricks of today's footballers with them you'd look like an eejit! It is most obvious in the crosses.

And the commentaries pick out little quirks like the Fulham player married in a registry office at 11am playing at 3pm.
It's funny to see the state of the pitches back in the 80s. I've seen better pitches for under 13s hurling today.

The weight of the ball was indeed an issue, with a fairly strong trend of players, including our Jack, getting dementia at relatively early ages - and the institutions that earned money from them doing feck all to support them.
 
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