Current public sentiment towards the housing market?

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mortimer33 said:
Oops missed the joke! ..
It'll be interesting to see what happens in the New Year with the new countries joining. You can stop them working legally, but experience has shown you can do almost nothing to stop people coming to work illegally...But then again would young Bulgarians/Romanians try to do something like that..
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In fairness, we're not likely to get a huge share of these immigrants due to our distance from their home countries. It'd be easier for them to drive into Germany or somewhere, get kicked out, and then drive back over the border a few days later.

Regardless, illegal migrant workers won't be contributing to house price growth to any great degree.
 
SteelBlue05 said:
salary surveys dont suggest that average salaries are 90k gross in Pharmaceutical companies...

http://www.recruitireland.com/careercentre/info/salarysurvey_pharm.asp
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Firstly, I work in the finance/accounting/HR department of the the company, so we wouldn't have too many lower wage earners dragging us down. Secondly, those figures are laughable, maybe 25% less than what people in the same position earn. Also it wouldn't even take into account bonuses and benefits.
 
mortimer33 said:
Oops missed the joke! ..
It'll be interesting to see what happens in the New Year with the new countries joining. You can stop them working legally, but experience has shown you can do almost nothing to stop people coming to work illegally...But then again would young Bulgarians/Romanians try to do something like that..
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This brought a quote to my mind from an article I read a few weeks ago.
It was the Bulgarian PM stating that anyone who wanted to work in the UK were already there.
The fact that these countries have joined the EU shouldn't make much of a difference if they can't simply hop on a plane and work here.
 
Raskolnikov said:
I don't know anyone on 20-30K salaries that own new/almost new BMW's.
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I know people who supposedly have no salary driving new beamers but that's another story entirely.

Certainly, there are some people who can afford their SUVs and similar luxury cars. However, there are quite a few 06 SUVs parked around my area and I can only think - if you can (legally) afford to pay for that in cash, I doubt you would choose to live here!

I'd agree with Sharp, probably a lot of people doing it but very few admitting it.

Last year nearly one hundred thousand people took out a top-up mortgage. Some of them have to be doing it to finance their lifestyle.
 
Glenbhoy said:
Haven't been following all the posts, but what couple on salaries such as these would be buying a car like this? (they would deserve whatevers coming to them thought) I doubt a bank would offer a top-up loan on salaries like that, regardless of equity built up. Open to correction though.
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I think it's over-simplifying by expecting a bank to directly sanction a 35-year car loan by re-mortgage.

What happens is these people buy the house and pay the mortgage. They then take out the car loan. Insurance costs a grand and goes on the credit card. Sure I'll clear it when I get my bonus. Bonus is spent on a 3-week holiday in Thailand, along with another 1k on the CC. Sure I'm due a pay-rise in May. Pay-rise comes and goes with rising interest rates and fuel costs, etc. Oh, and we need that 42" plasma screen TV too.... throw it on the CC. Short on cash at the end of the month, throw the weeks shopping on the CC. Get paid but last weeks shopping is forgotten about until the CC bill arrives. Cash is running short again cos it's nearly the end of the month. Take out a personal loan to clear CC and start afresh.

Rinse and repeat above for another year or two.

Go back to bank and tell them you're building an extension/attic conversion and ask for an equity release. Bank manager closes his eyes when he asks to see your architects drawing and you show him a blank A4 sheet. No worries, we can release €50k for you Mr & Mrs X, sure isn't it your own money anyway only it's tied up in bricks and mortar!

Rinse and repeat....

Believe me, this happens. Came close to this sort of scenario myself, only I got sense (thanks in large part to AAM!), sold the 03 car and am now tipping around in a rather banged-up 93 Toyota Starlet.

My next car I'm buying with cash.... my own cash....

Edit: forgot to mention the old chestnut of "sure we'll pay it back (42" TV?) when the SSIA comes through next year...."
 
Surveys in Romania have shown that most Romanians who expressed an interest in emigrating to work in other EU countries, said they would like to go to Italy or Spain - fellow Latin countries. I wouldn't expect too many to try to come here.

I haven't heard any similar surveys for Bulgaria, and never came across too many of them when I was in Germany either, so it's hard to say where they would go. Wouldn't be surprised if quite a few of them went to Greece to work illegally there (I'm sure they're already doing this).

For both countries, I think Ireland is not attractive as a destination for illegal work. It's always easier in a country that has an existing community to show you the ropes, and that can be reached easily by car.
 
SHARP said:
Well I do and my friends do.

People are amazed at where people are getting money, Im not - I know exactly where its coming from and its all linked to property.
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I know a guy who is earning in the high 20's and is drving a 02 bmw 2litre 3 series.
 
I know of a guy who has never worked a day in his life and he's got a nice apartment with no mortgage and an almost new car. So what?
 
conor_mc said:
I think it's over-simplifying by expecting a bank to directly sanction a 35-year car loan by re-mortgage.

What happens is these people buy the house and pay the mortgage. They then take out the car loan. Insurance costs a grand and goes on the credit card. Sure I'll clear it when I get my bonus. Bonus is spent on a 3-week holiday in Thailand, along with another 1k on the CC. Sure I'm due a pay-rise in May. Pay-rise comes and goes with rising interest rates and fuel costs, etc. Oh, and we need that 42" plasma screen TV too.... throw it on the CC. Short on cash at the end of the month, throw the weeks shopping on the CC. Get paid but last weeks shopping isn't paid for until the CC bill comes and cash is running short again cos it's nearly the end of the month. Take out a personal loan to clear CC and start afresh.

Rinse and repeat above for another year or two.

Go back to bank and tell them you're building an extension/attic conversion and ask for an equity release. Bank manager closes his eyes when he asks to see your architects drawing and you show him a blank A4 sheet. No worries, we can release €50k for you Mr & Mrs X, sure isn't it your own money anyway only it's tied up in bricks and mortar!

Rinse and repeat....

Believe me, this happens. Came close to this sort of scenario myself, only I got sense (thanks in large part to AAM!), sold the 03 car and am now tipping around in a rather banged-up 93 Toyota Starlet.

My next car I'm buying with cash.... my own cash....
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I rent in a pretty affluent area. You can see the difference between the new money and the old money just by the kind of car that's sitting in the driveway. New money tends to have a fleet of 05/06 cars parked in front as if they were on display. Old money will have a 96-97 volvo estate that hasn't been washed all summer and has a scent of dog from the interior. Some people just don't see the need to announce to the world that they've got money.

Personally, I drive a 1994 toyota carina E. It was handed down to me from grandfather->father->son. (and no, I'm not old money).
 
How is any of this bickering over how perfect strangers pay for their cars relevant? I realise that there is some link to property prices if people are remortgaging but *as long as they can keep up the payments it is not going to matter one way or the other* they will do their best not to sell.

The point is for those who are selling, will people want to buy what's on sale. Methinks increasingly less at the money being saught but well, it'll take time for the shakedown, right?
 
Raskolnikov said:
I know of a guy who has never worked a day in his life and he's got a nice apartment with no mortgage and an almost new car. So what?
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Re-read the previous posts, this is all in the context of what is being discusses. You cant follow it?
 
Persius said:
Surveys in Romania have shown that most Romanians who expressed an interest in emigrating to work in other EU countries, said they would like to go to Italy or Spain - fellow Latin countries. I wouldn't expect too many to try to come here.
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..and why not...there has been a bunch of Romanians in Cork for years...long before the Polish & Latvians arrived.

Why would they not want to come...sure for any non national who does not work here they get well looked after with state benefits.
 
ninsaga said:
Why would they not want to come...sure for any non national who does not work here they get well looked after with state benefits.
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When the downturn comes one of the first things that's going to come under the microscope is the social welfare system,and how's it handing money out hand over fist and in many cases to people who shouldn't even be getting it.The health boards are even worse than the social welfare for this.The waste of taxpayers money is simply staggering,as other posters have said in some aera's rental supplement is the only thing keeping the market going.
 
Calina said:
How is any of this bickering over how perfect strangers pay for their cars relevant?
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I think the original point was that there is a lot less of an equity cushion out there than people might expect. In a downturn, it will not just be the people who bought last year who are trapped in a negative equity situation.
 
Many people have pointed out the lack of foreign interest in the Irish property market as a sign that there is no value to be had here.
Well in the business section of today's Irish times there's an article about a Dutch online estate agency called Funda, which is buying the IAVI's website realestate.ie. Funda are paying €4m for the site, but most of it is deferred payment, based on profit sharing or targets being met.

I'm not sure what this actually says about the irish property market, but it seems madness to me, considering the dominance of both myhome and daft. There should be a lot of marketing over the coming weeks to try to establish the site.
 
Persius said:
Well in the business section of today's Irish times there's an article about a Dutch online estate agency called Funda, which is buying the IAVI's website realestate.ie. Funda are paying €4m for the site, but most of it is deferred payment, based on profit sharing or targets being met.
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What if they miss their target? Generally the targets will be extremely ambitious to get the €4m.
 
room305 said:
When the housing crash drags us into a deep recession, we may actually serve as an example to newer EU member states on how to manage their economies.
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yep i reckon so too was just thginkin the same the other day!

edo said:
Ah BJ - Im on to you now!


Kev and Brian are really Ant & Dec and yis are just buzzin' us trying to rise a response out of the more high strung posters on this thread!
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no kev is my bro
 
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