AIB Aib ex staff - getting €1,650 compensation

Cbtrack

New Member
Messages
4
Hi all,
I am also in the same position as many of you seem to be here.
Took out staff mortgage in 2007.mortgage was split :
180k staff rate and remainder on tracker, as seemed to be the standard at the time.
My contract has the condition 3.2 referred to earlier which states that we were entitled to revert to tracker/variable/fixed at the end of a fixed period, however, the bank are now saying that the staff rate was not a fixed rate???
My mortgage was on a staff rate up until the end of last year when I switched to variable as it was more beneficial.at this stage I sighted my terms & conditions which contained the clause re: tracker option. When I queried this, I was offere the tracker at the ‘prevailing rate’ of 3.67% which I obviously declined.
When I raised a complaint in relation to why we were not offered a tracker previously during the bulk switch of 2009, they did a full review and I got the response that the staff rate was not a fixed rate.
This position is quite unbelievable. If the staff rate was not a fixed rate,why then did they include the terms & conditions of a fixed loan? The response from the bank has stated that it’s a final one. Just wondering if anyone has gone to pauric kissane with this issue as I can’t actually believe that they are denying this was a fixed rate mortgage and using this as an ‘out’ for staff. I wonder if normal customers who had this clause in their mortgage have been returned to trackers. It would seem on the face of it that staff are being treated much less favourably than other customers
 

Track2019

New Member
Messages
6
Hi all,
My husband and I are in the same position. We were originally on a tracker mortgage and in 2007 we enquired about fixing the rate due to rising rates. We were advised to request the staff pref loan fixed rate as it was available to staff members, so we did same.
The homeflex application form for the staff pref rate clearly refers to the pref rate loan as a FIXED loan and as others have mentioned, the terms and conditions of the contract refer to it as a fixed loan. Yet the bank are refusing to accept our complaint and are claiming the staff pref loan is a variable annuity rate. The t&C's of the contract and clause 3.2 along with with the homeflex application form clearly contradict this. I agree with you cbtrack, if my husband wasnt an aib staff member at the time we requested to fix the rate on our mortgage we would have most likely been included in the review and our tracker rate would have been restored. I haven't heard if the union are getting involved in this or advising their members on this matter.
 
Last edited:

Cbtrack

New Member
Messages
4
@Brendan, I hadn’t heard to date of the union getting involved in this issue at all but might be worth raising with them.
@ Track2019 - what stage is your complaint at? Did they send you a final response? We got a final response the same to say it was not actually a fixed rate. I didn’t even bother to reply to raise all of the issues re: the ts & cs contradicting this etc as I assume this is a position they are taking with all staff.
I couldn’t actually get my hands on the original application form. Did u manage to get a copy where it clearly states ‘fixed rate’ in it?
Next stop is either financial advisor or ombudsman. Just wondering if there would be many of us in this situation.
 

Scruffy1

Registered User
Messages
12
Likewise, my complaint response denied that the Staff preferential PDH account was a fixed rate as it was titled 'Variable Annuity' (and bizarrely as it was subject to BIK) even though they mention the rate was static for term of the loan, this also was a final response. The special conditions specifically refer to it as a fixed rate though
 

Cbtrack

New Member
Messages
4
This must be the standard position they are taking with all staff /ex staff then that this wasn’t a fixed loan. It’s shocking really when the documentation clearly states otherwise.
@Scruffy1 did u get anywhere with a complaint to the ombudsman? Just trying to decide what my next step should be as clearly the bank are sending the same response to all staff hoping we will go away. It’s just plain worng and it’s there in black & white in the terms & conditions
 

Track2019

New Member
Messages
6
We got the same final response letter and are now considering our options. The preferential rate is referred to as a fixed rate in so many documents yet it's unbelievable that the bank are denying same. A link to the homeflex app form is attached on page 2 of this forum.
 

Cbtrack

New Member
Messages
4
By the way, does anyone even know what the hell a ‘variable annuity’ is supposed to be? Having googled it there doesn’t seem to be any link to a mortgage type product at all that I can find. Am I right in saying that as staff we believed at the time that we were taking out a fixed rate mortgage product? Were we then midsold this ‘variable annuity’ under the guise that it was a ‘fixed rate staff mortgage’? I don’t ever remember having a ‘variable annuity’ explained to me prior to signing contracts
 

Scruffy1

Registered User
Messages
12
My initial request to the ombudsman was that I was not considered part of the 3.2 clause. They requested AIB's response to which they were said tracker review was ongoing even though both complaints listed this as AIB's final response. I had since launched a separate complaint on the why 3.2 was not in play which was responded by the Variable Annuity cop out.

From memory I think Padraic Kissane's view on this is staff should have been offered the more favourable tracker account once the variable rate increased above 3%, not that fixed accounts should have defaulted to the tracker option. I'm sure there are test cases still going through the mill but it looks as if AIB are militantly defending their position on staff/ex staff. I'm guessing this cohort would have much more sizable and multiples of loans than the general public
 

Emmalouf

New Member
Messages
3
Just wondered if any of the fso cases have been responded to. On my application form I ticked for a tracker mortgage but was put on the 3% staff and the remainder on tracker. I know I signed the documents but I think that as I ticked for tracker I should have been given this
 

Mildred

New Member
Messages
3
As AIB staff I also have an appeal in with the ombudsman. My mortgage was taken out in 2006 on staff rate with the remainder on commercial rate. In 2007 I applied for all my accounts to be transferred to Tracker rate. However the account on staff rate was not amended, though I had requested for all the accounts to be amended to Tracker. Apart from this, can anyone tell me did the 3.2 condition apply to all staff mortgages in 2006?
 

emilybee

New Member
Messages
3
I received a response from the Ombudsman but it was a typical, AIB have not finished their review yet fob off. I have since made a follow on complaint to AIB as they did not address the 3.2 clause issue. They stated the staff mortgage was considered a Variable rate is it was titled 'Variable Annuity' and subject to BIK however on the special conditions of the staff rate mortgage contract they clearly state that this is a fixed interest term account and references 3.3 accordingly. It also mentions in the Special Conditions that resignation defaults these accounts to Standard variable however there is ambiguity between the special conditions on the main contract.

Just wondering has anybody else pursued this successfully ?
Hi ,
Given what has come to light today re Tracker Mortgages, I am wondering did you ever get to a conclusion on your case..
All the points you have made are exactly the same as what I am highlighting also....
 

Rarrrrrr

Registered User
Messages
4
Original poster here, I have not seen this thread in years! I am one of the e1615 cohorts. It appears that it is because I came out of the 3% rate and fixed for 1 year to eliminate BIK. when this fixed period ended I went onto the SVR. I have the 3.2 clause in my contract. Hopefully we are all part of the 6,000 impacted customers.
 

pyrite

Registered User
Messages
17
Does anyone have a link to what this 3.2 clause looks like. I have a copy of my drawn down letter. The 3.2 clause is not obvious to me I drew down mine in Feb 06. It does state on that the staff rate is fixed at 3% which infers its a fixed rate but maybe I'm wrong. I queried all this with AIB Staff business when I was working for them. Still have the mails. Really just got fobbed off by them.
 

Brendan Burgess

Founder
Messages
39,549
3.2 FURTHER FIXED INTEREST RATE OPTIONS/CHOICE



At the end of any fixed interest rate period, the Customer may choose between: (a) a further fixed interest rate period, or

(b) conversion to a variable interest rate Mortgage Loan, or

(c) conversion to a tracker interest rate Mortgage Loan,

at the Bank's then prevailing rates appropriate to the Mortgage Loan. If the Customer does not exercise this choice, then the Mortgage Loan will automatically convert to a variable interest rate Mortgage Loan.
 

Mildred

New Member
Messages
3
Thank you Brendan. On my staff mortgage letter of offer it stated in Feb 2006 that it was "subject to the terms & conditions outlined and subject also to the Bank's General Terms & conditions governing lending. " As there is no reference to 3.2 in my offer letter but was the 3.2 clause relevent at this time in the terms & conditions? I requested all my paperwork but no terms & conditions were included & most documents are blackened out. I did request appeal with the ombudsman as I had applied in 2007 for all my accounts relating to my PPR to be put on tracker mortgage. Two small mortgage accounts were put on Tracker but the main account was left on staff rate even though I have the form showing I requested all the accounts relating to the PPR.
 

Scruffy1

Registered User
Messages
12
Hi ,
Given what has come to light today re Tracker Mortgages, I am wondering did you ever get to a conclusion on your case..
All the points you have made are exactly the same as what I am highlighting also....
This is still with the ombudsman and in remediation - AIB are due to respond to a list of questions in the next couple of weeks so I'm guessing it will be another 6 weeks before a decision is made.
 

Zorton Maverick

New Member
Messages
1
Hi All,
I want to see if anyone here is in the same boat as myself.
I was not included in the 1615 compensation pool even though i had Clause 3.2 C
When querying, I was told I wasn't included because I was one of the staff members that requested to be moved from the Staff rate to the Variable rate in the December 2008.

My argument in return was that we were advised by SB to do exactly that and it was due to the mass number of staff requesting to be moved as we were advised (due to the forthcoming BIK implications) that cause the MASS movement of everyone else to the VAR rate on 01/01/2009.
These staff that were mass moved got the €1615 compensation.

I exhausted dialogue withAIB last year and they eventually sent me a letter in Mar 2019 advising the matter was closed.

Do I have any come back ?
Should I go the legal route ?
Should I lodge a complaint to teh FPSO ?

Any help appreciated.
 

Pillowcase

New Member
Messages
1
Hi All,
I want to see if anyone here is in the same boat as myself.
I was not included in the 1615 compensation pool even though i had Clause 3.2 C
When querying, I was told I wasn't included because I was one of the staff members that requested to be moved from the Staff rate to the Variable rate in the December 2008.

My argument in return was that we were advised by SB to do exactly that and it was due to the mass number of staff requesting to be moved as we were advised (due to the forthcoming BIK implications) that cause the MASS movement of everyone else to the VAR rate on 01/01/2009.
These staff that were mass moved got the €1615 compensation.

I exhausted dialogue withAIB last year and they eventually sent me a letter in Mar 2019 advising the matter was closed.

Do I have any come back ?
Should I go the legal route ?
Should I lodge a complaint to teh FPSO ?

Any help appreciated.
Hi
I am in a similar situation. I had a split part staff loan and part tracker and the staff loan was mass moved in January 2009 to variable rate . The option to move to tracker was not given even though I had part of the mortgage on tracker. I did not get 1615 comp. my case is now with the ombudsman and they are waiting for response from aib.
 
Top