AIB Aib ex staff - getting €1,650 compensation

Jane40

Registered User
Messages
1
I have just logged complaint with bank regarding my staff mortgage. Same issue mortgage spilt between tracker and staff rate. Not offered tracker in 2009 when we were taken off staff rate as Bik was no longer favourable. When I spoke to Dublin Today they suggested that the variable rate was a better rate than the tracker rate at the time and that the bank was giving the best options to staff at the time. Also tracker rate was not available in 2009. My complaint has been logged but I was advised that I really do not have a complaint but they will respond to me in due course! Not very hopeful☹
 

Andy836

Frequent Poster
Messages
372
Not 100% bit as far as I know fixed never put back on tracker is now on a rate pf 0.95%
That's nice result!

But do you know if they were

a) originally on 100% tracker, then moved to staff rate, and then moved to SVR, but now been moved back on to the old tracker, or
b) original loan was 50% tracker & 50% staff rate, and they've now moved the 50% that was once on a staff rate which was moved to SVR has now been moved to the tracker.

Appreciate you mightn't know this but I think this is the crux of the problem for many people.
 

Miranda21

Registered User
Messages
1
Hi folks, I am wondering if there has been any update. I too am ex AIB staff in the same situation. I have written to AIB, my complaint acknowledged and I have also requested a copy of my mortgage documents from Adelaide Road, they say I can collect them from a branch once ready in 40 days. Wondering if anyone is having luck. I am also anxious about coming under possible vulture fund sell off purely because I have an investment property. I repaid all repayments through the celtic tiger downturn and carried on with heavy negative equity when AIB tried to force me to sell and carry the shortfall. AIB never seem to act to support us as customers any longer, is that not what banking was all about? Surely the Banks criteria is to support their customers wherever possible when they work 100% with them. We got these mortgages on the basis of higher income, how can we be penalised when we simply want to extend our mortgage term? Any update on ombudsman etc would be much appreciated.
 

Sleven273

Registered User
Messages
21
Special Conditions in letter of Offer:

“While the customer(or if the offer is addressed to more than one person, all of them) remain in the service of the Bank, a staff preferential Fixed Home Loan interest rate of 3% will apply to the Mortgage loan”.



The fixed interest rate early breakage cost referred to in Clause 3.3 of the General Terms & Conditions will not apply if for any reason the interest rate applicable to the Mortgage Loan ceases to the Staff Preferential Fixed Home Loan Interest Rate”.
 

Andy836

Frequent Poster
Messages
372
Bump

Anyone have any thoughts on this. A family member contacted me last night and appears to be in the same boat as Selvin above (and a raft of other people).
They moved jobs to AIB and moved their mortgage to the staff mortgage in 2006.
As such they're loan was split between a portion on a tracker / and a portion on the "staff preferential rate". This "staff rate" had the same clause as Slevin listed above (from their memory - they've to dig out their docs yet).
When they removed the Preferential rate they were contacted and advised SVR or Fixed were only options. They specifically remember being told that the tracker option was no longer an option.

This issue would appear to fall into the AIB's wider stance re the "Prevailing Rate" of ECB + 3.67% (AIB reiterated this to the Finance Committee in Sept 27, 2017 - link at end).

I've a couple of problems with this:
- Family member was not offered this tracker + margin in Jan '09.
- The simplest argument is the prevailing rate should be the rate applied to the closest loan matching this loan - which of course would be the other part of their mortgage (the tracker part which is ECB+1.1%) i.e. same Borrower, same security, same credit history
- The wording is vague, and the attitude that seems to be gaining traction is that where wording is vague the Bank's should come down on the side of the Borrower/Consumer.

At the Finance Committee Bernard Byrne sought to justify the ECB+3.67% "prevailing rate" based on the disconnection between the Bank's funding costs & the ECB rate.
I'm not sure I fully agree with this argument.
The Bank's cost of funds is a separate issue to the "prevailing rates appropriate to the Mortgage Loan" i.e. the wording highlighted references "the Mortgage Loan", not a "Mortgage Loan Pool".
In this case the specific Mortgage Loan was - (i) performing, (ii) aged [as in the loan had been in existence for over 5 years], (iii) low initial Loan to Value (<80%) [what the LTV at the time was is a different question].

Anyway, I'm wondering if anyone has any thoughts on this (i presume there's a huge number of AIB staff affected). My cousin is going to get her docs together and get all her ducks in a row.

https://beta.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/debate/joint_committee_on_finance_public_expenditure_and_reform_and_taoiseach/2017-09-26/2/
Update, family member received a check from AIB for approx €1600 split €1000 compensation plus €600 for professional fees.

They quoted an indicative "prevailing tracker rate" of approx 8% at the time she came off her staff rate. Now they're offering an ECB plus approx 3.2%.

This came out of the blue. She had submitted no correspondence on this issue to AIB.

I haven't seen the letter she received yet so the above figures may be off slightly.

If nothing else, it suggests they are looking at former staff mortgages.
 

MrBrightside

Registered User
Messages
2
Hi all,

I received this letter also and a "shut up" cheque for €1600. €1000 0f this is compensation and the €600 for use towards fees for an independent advisor.
Is this a tactic by AIB to try to give everybody something in the hope they will be happy to get anything and will not pursue anything further?

I am really pissed off with this. We all got screwed here. In fairness to Bank of Ireland they have made redress to all their staff.

I got a mortgage 8.5 times my salary at the time. I was only 20 years old and maybe wanted to make a quick buck ! IT WAS STUPID AND WAS A MISTAKE MADE BY ME .

But the bank and the government have done nothing to ease the pain. Had I been on a tracker over the last 10 years or if I got the appropriate redress, I could now sell my house to some young first time buyers in urgent need to finding somewhere.

The "prevailing tracker rate" is the most ridiculous rate product I have heard of. It's so high when ECB is so low, is there anyone in the country on one of these rates at the moment.

Lastly , I got a letter from revenue last year to say I owe them back mortgage interest relief as they were aware the property I bought was not always used as my Private principal residence. It was a whopper bill !!!!

So, like so many other people, I feel completely screwed. Received a mortgage of 8 times salary, not allowed go onto a tracker, have to cough up a huge tax bill, stuck in negative equity and now I'm unable to avail of the First time buyer tax rebate because I have previously owned a property.

That's my rant over!!! :) I just want to get one positive outcome from the stupid house I bought at a stupid time.

I hope there are others in the group that don't want to let this go either. I'm not sure what my next steps are . I'm hope Paudie Kissane is busy and is trying to resolve this for everyone.

Best regards,
Mr Brightside
 

Sunshine39

Registered User
Messages
9
Hi there
See some posts re AIB staff mortgages.....does anyone know if AIB changed the contracts they used at some point between 2005 and 2006/2007. Mine was taken out in 2005 and doesn’t seem to have wording in it to the effect that the mortgage could be put on tracker at the end of any fixed rate although I know of others who’s contracts do say this but were possibly taken out later. Needless to say I’m not getting much info from the bank! Thank you
 

Scruffy1

Registered User
Messages
9
I only made a complaint recently on this as I was not considered as part of the secondary redress however AIB have stated they are not reimbursing me and is the final response. I took a mortgage as a staff member in 2008 that was auto setup as a split mortgage by AIB staff business as a 25% tracker and 75% PDH. When I resigned in 2013 my PDH (fixed 3%) was auto converted to standard variable at 4.4% with no option of tracker. My mortgage contract has the 3c clause. AIB did not address my resignation auto conversion and only focussed the complaint on activity in 2008/9 of which I had specifically requested to return to the PDH in 2009; needless to say I've send this to the Ombudsman. Are their any AIB staff/ex staff in the same situation ?
 

Scruffy1

Registered User
Messages
9
Brendan
I'm in a similar position. As AIB staff, I received a split mortgage in 2008 without specifying with approx. 40% on tracker and remainder on staff rate (PDH fixed at 3%). On resigning from the bank the fixed rate was auto switched to a variable. The conversion to variable was stipulated in the original staff letter of offer however it does not form part of the mortgage contract (i.e. 3c clause).
I raised the complaint with AIB which they rejected - their response was in line with most others. I have since raised with the Ombudsman who requested AIB to redress – the Ombudsman noted AIB said the tracker investigation was on-going so complaint was not closed – even though AIB previously said it was. I am part of 3.69% group but did not receive he €1,500 compensation. Do I have a valid case to raise again with AIB/Ombudsman once the review has ended ?
 

Patient fella

New Member
Messages
3
I'm ex AIB staff too.
I did receive the compensation from AIB for both a staff loan and a fixed loan( I have a tracker too on the same home so a big mortgage )
The intention of the 3 loans in oct 2007on the same property was to achieve overall best rate initially with a move to tracker when fixed element matured.
I requested copy of my file. Recently received it but it does not contain anything related to loan approved in 2007. Am I entitled to see AIB internal notes on loan approved.?
PF
 

Mayoress

Registered User
Messages
2
Hi all does anyone have an update on this?

My case is with the ombudsman since 2017 & i’m at the adjudication stage. Waiting on ruling.,
 

Scruffy1

Registered User
Messages
9
I received a response from the Ombudsman but it was a typical, AIB have not finished their review yet fob off. I have since made a follow on complaint to AIB as they did not address the 3.2 clause issue. They stated the staff mortgage was considered a Variable rate is it was titled 'Variable Annuity' and subject to BIK however on the special conditions of the staff rate mortgage contract they clearly state that this is a fixed interest term account and references 3.3 accordingly. It also mentions in the Special Conditions that resignation defaults these accounts to Standard variable however there is ambiguity between the special conditions on the main contract.

Just wondering has anybody else pursued this successfully ?
 

Brendan Burgess

Founder
Messages
38,121
Guys, I have counted 14 separate posters to this thread with the same issue.

I see that Padraic Kissane has raised it as well.

You should get together and compare notes.

And maybe as a group deal with Padraic Kissane.

And what about your trade union? They should co-ordinate the response.

Do any of you have shares in AIB? If so, you should consider going to the AIB AGM and raising the issue there.

Brendan
 

Neady1

New Member
Messages
1
I am also ex AIB staff, and unfortunately I went to the Ombudsman back in 2014 who partially ruled in my favor however since then so much more information has come to light. The ombudsman at the time did not allow my staff rate back on the tracker. However I am not giving up. I believe I was treated unfairly as a customer because i was staff. I strongly believe if I was not staff I would be on the tracker. See some of my notes below might help one of you. Also I rang the ombudsman yesterday and they said I could log another complaint once it was not the same as my orginal one. I have been discriminated because i was staff.



1. While my initial drawdown rate was staff preferential rate my legally binding contract with AIB clearly included details of the tracker option following expiry of fixed products.

3. Following drawdown on my initial mortgage, statement from AIB on account titled “TRACKER MORTGAGE” (note this was in considerably larger font and in bold) I automatically presumed I was on the tracker mortgage.

4. In 2008, in the AIB issued a press release (and internal staff circular) which referenced the removal of tracker product this statement clearly stated that the removal related only to “new mortgage applicant” I was existing mortgage holder so this did not apply to me.

5. As my terms and conditions clearly referenced the tracker option and noting, in the absence of any press release stating that existing customers tracker option on their terms and conditions would be removed. I understood that I continued to have the right to take up my tracker mortgage

6. In January 2009, the Bank advised all staff preferential rate holders that they would be moved to the standard variable rate at this was lower than the staff preferential rate.

7. On expiry of this 2 year fixed rate in March 2012, I sought to have the tracker applied to these accounts in line with the terms of my letter of offer (sectoin 3.2) The tracker had become the most beneficial rate. see my terms and conditions below part C)

Section 3.2

3.2 FUTHER FIXED INTEREST RATE OPTIONS/CHOICE

At the end of any fixed interest rate period, the Customer may choose between:

A) A further fixed interest rate period , or

B) conversion to a variable interest rate mortgage loan

C)conversion to a tracker interest rate mortgage loan

at the bank then prevailing rates appropriate to the mortgage loan

Also I was given no advice on my mortgage pre, post drawdown. My calls were not recorded. etc etc

Dont give up , keep fighting.
 
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