The screw is being turned on the DUP

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When Brexit goes badly, it will be Ireland's fault. When immigrants are still arriving in the UK, it will be Irelands fault. When inflation climbs and interest rates rise, it will be Irelands fault. When the famous trade deal with the US falls in Congress, it will be Ireland's fault. When the rest of the world aren't flocking to buy UK goods, it will be Ireland's fault. When Sterling reaches parity with the Euro and English breakfasts and pints of beer in Spain rocket, it will be Ireland's fault.

After all is Ireland that decided that the UK should leave the EU. It is Ireland that bullied every country in the EU including the weak Germans into punishing the UK with the Irish backstop. The UK are like spoilt teenagers crying 'Why me', 'Why is it always me'..... They made the decision to leave but now it is everyone elses fault.
 
Purple said:
I don't think a minor, or even major, concession to Teresa would have changed anything as this is all about a civil war within the Tory Party but we shall never know for sure.
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The point is we never tried. Leo's legacy in all this is that he saw it as a contest as to who could have the brightest red lines.
 
Duke of Marmalade said:
The point is we never tried. Leo's legacy in all this is that he saw it as a contest as to who could have the brightest red lines.
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In my view - this is falling into the narrative that is being spun in the UK in order to justify the current path. The backstop in any form is a red herring. They don't actually care about the backstop. Even if it was completely removed, they would still refuse the withdrawal agreement. The issue is much more fundamental than that. There is a vision doing the rounds of turning the UK into a laissez-faire Singapore lookalike with significantly reduced Governmental intervention and influence. Not dissimilar to the Tea Party in the US. Any form of deal with the EU would hamper that.

Leo could say anything he wants - he could lie down and have his belly tickled. It really doesn't matter. They have a list of other things up their sleeve that they will pull out if the backstop issue suddenly disappeared.
 
It looks like the UK Gov is determined to crash out - they have rejected the Withdrawal Agreement that was drawn up with the involvement of the UK negotiators and accepted by the PM - yet they have failed to propose an alternative. All the Irish Government can do is stick to its guns. Let the UK make its own decision. The EU have made clear that if the UK want to discuss a trade deal in the future (which they will have to) then all the committments in the current Withdrawal Agreement (including the backstop and the "divorce bill") will have to be dealt with first.

The issue is not the backstop. It is the Tory civil war and their fear of the Brexit Party. There is the secondary issue of the DUP - taking the same path that the leaders of Ulster Unionism has taken for decades - going for short term triumphalism ( a hard Brexit and sharper barriers to the ROI), while alienating the middle ground that they will depend on to "preserve the union" in the longer term.
 
Early Riser said:
It looks like the UK Gov is determined to crash out - they have rejected the Withdrawal Agreement that was drawn up with the involvement of the UK negotiators and accepted by the PM - yet they have failed to propose an alternative. All the Irish Government can do is stick to its guns. Let the UK make its own decision. The EU have made clear that if the UK want to discuss a trade deal in the future (which they will have to) then all the committments in the current Withdrawal Agreement (including the backstop and the "divorce bill") will have to be dealt with first.

The issue is not the backstop. It is the Tory civil war and their fear of the Brexit Party. There is the secondary issue of the DUP - taking the same path that the leaders of Ulster Unionism has taken for decades - going for short term triumphalism ( a hard Brexit and sharper barriers to the ROI), while alienating the middle ground that they will depend on to "preserve the union" in the longer term.
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The DUP would happily build a wall from donegal to the cooley mountains
 
UK LABOUR PARTY leader Jeremy Corbyn has called on opposition party leaders to install him as caretaker Prime Minister to avoid a no-deal Brexit.

www.thejournal.ie

Jeremy Corbyn urges parties to make him caretaker PM to defeat no-deal Brexit

Corbyn has called on opposition leaders to support a Labour caretaker government.
www.thejournal.ie www.thejournal.ie

Could be the perfect storm for the UK....leaving the world's largest trading bloc with a Marxist at the wheel...what could possibly go wrong!
 
Firefly said:
UK LABOUR PARTY leader Jeremy Corbyn has called on opposition party leaders to install him as caretaker Prime Minister to avoid a no-deal Brexit.

www.thejournal.ie

Jeremy Corbyn urges parties to make him caretaker PM to defeat no-deal Brexit

Corbyn has called on opposition leaders to support a Labour caretaker government.
www.thejournal.ie www.thejournal.ie

Could be the perfect storm for the UK....leaving the world's largest trading bloc with a Marxist at the wheel...what could possibly go wrong!
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In fairness, he is not calling on the parties to form a on-going government with him. The plan is to form a government in order to obtain an extension and then hold an election. But it will still be a problem for any conservative or LibDem to be seen to let him in the door of No 10 even if only for a single purpose.

It's being referred to as a "Meat Loaf Brexit" - "I'd do anything to stop a no deal - but I won't do that"
 
Duke of Marmalade said:
Varadkar has succeeded in uniting unionists in NI to see the backstop as a Green/Orange struggle.
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Varadkar made it into an Orange/Green struggle. Hardly.

It was Arlene Foster who telephoned TM to say a NI only backstop would weaken the union.

Objectively it is a nonsense to say that a NI only backstop threatens the union, (consider all the other borders in the Irish sea on gay rights etc.) but the DUP having been caught on the wrong side of the Brexit debate, needed something Orange to rally their supporters around and the "border in the Irish sea" (which was an idea created by the British Government, I believe) was perfect.
 
Firefly said:
Small steps....

www.theguardian.com

Like a good Marxist, Corbyn is securing his revolution from within | Damian McBride

By appointing Ken Livingstone, the Labour leader is hoping history will repeat itself. But will it be the success of 2000 or the dismal failure of 2012?
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
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It wouldn't work - he wouldn't hold confidence of the house for anything other than extending and calling an election - the debate may be whether to call a general election or hold a second referendum first. I suspect he might want to do the later but I doubt that would keep some of the conservative rebels on side
 
EmmDee said:
It wouldn't work - he wouldn't hold confidence of the house for anything other than extending and calling an election - the debate may be whether to call a general election or hold a second referendum first. I suspect he might want to do the later but I doubt that would keep some of the conservative rebels on side
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I think if he were in power (even in a caretaker role) he would be more likely to win an election.
 
cremeegg said:
Varadkar made it into an Orange/Green struggle. Hardly.

It was Arlene Foster who telephoned TM to say a NI only backstop would weaken the union.

Objectively it is a nonsense to say that a NI only backstop threatens the union, (consider all the other borders in the Irish sea on gay rights etc.) but the DUP having been caught on the wrong side of the Brexit debate, needed something Orange to rally their supporters around and the "border in the Irish sea" (which was an idea created by the British Government, I believe) was perfect.
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Unionists see everything through the lens of an impending green takeover and always have, if we took unionist preciousness - "neurosis into consideration every day, we'd might as well stay in bed, you cannot assuage paranoia
 
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Firefly said:
I think if he were in power (even in a caretaker role) he would be more likely to win an election.
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I know what you mean but I'm not sure - I think he might have peaked at the last one. There will be quite a lot of his party coming under pressure from either LibDem / Remain Alliance or Brexit. I don't think he would get more MP's.

But he might be able to form a coalition - or at least Labour might be able to. Whether other parties would agree with him as leader is another thing - other than the SNP who would if given a second IndyRef
 
galway_blow_in said:
Unionists see everything through the lens of an impending green takeover and always have, if we took unionist preciousness - "neurosis into consideration every day, we'd might as well stay in bed, you cannot assuage paranoia
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And yet they have the opportunity of a life-time.....being able to export into both the EU and the rest of the UK (and whoever the UK agrees to trade with after Brexit). All this with cheaper wage costs than the RoI. If NI was to then get autonomy regarding taxation they could reduce Corporation Tax. There would then, IMO, be a lot of companies here wondering why they don't move up the road....
 
Firefly said:
And yet they have the opportunity of a life-time.....being able to export into both the EU and the rest of the UK (and whoever the UK agrees to trade with after Brexit). All this with cheaper wage costs than the RoI. If NI was to then get autonomy regarding taxation they could reduce Corporation Tax. There would then, IMO, be a lot of companies here wondering why they don't move up the road....
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Unionists would rather live on three bowls of rice per day than see their precious union diluted 1%

They are a people who want very little, they want to wave their union Jack's and that's it

Might explain the kind of politicians who have been elected
 
Cornyn is a fraud and hides his real opinion on Brexit which makes him untrustworthy to lead a short term government. If they are serious then a person who is not a leader e.g. Ken Clarke would be best suited for this role.
 
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