Teachers/Free classes

thedaras said:
Blameless and not their fault are two different things.

The teachers and the unions, themselves are the very ones who complain the loudest when it comes to changing ANY of the terms set down by the department.
So in my opinion they are not blameless!
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The standardised school year and school hours have been agreed by the employer , the employees trade unions , school representatives and parents organisations since 2004 and as such all have an input - if you personally have a problem with what was was agreed then I suggest that you target all the responsible parties.

Furthermore it appears that the standardised year and hours are unlikely to be changed in the forthcoming review at Easter as none of the negotiating parties are seeking an extension either of the standardised years or hours nor does it seem to be a case of concern for the majority of the public.

To the best of my knowledge the Unions have never challenged ANY aspect of the original 2004 agreement - if however you have facts to prove the contrary please don't hesitate to post same.

I would contend therefore that the teachers and their unions are indeed blameless as the standardised year and hours was mutually agreed by all interested parties and indeed adhered to by such parties.
 
Some of the above comments remind me of the goings on in the Soviet Union, where everything in society was dictated by the state e.g. where people worked, what they did, how they did it.
Apparently, we are not living in a totalitarian state (yet). Although, teachers (like many others in the PS) will blame 'the department' when it suits e.g. hours etc are laid down by the department . Of course, they will attack the department at the merest hint of any real change.

Teachers should work significantly longer hours, for in-service training, and increased contact time with pupils e.g. through shorter holidays. Perish the thought that teachers might become tired through such exertions. I mean, most of us in the real world (lucky enough to have a job) know what tiredness is all about - it's a fact of life.

But wait, I'm forgetting - part of our society is indeed Soviet in nature - just like the communist party apparatchiks, who ran the USSR to serve their own narrow interests. This approach worked wonderfully for decades, until......they 'ran' the country into the ground.......sound familiar?
 
I prefer to see it as democracy and the workings of industrial relations at their best.

The Dept. Of Education felt that the implementation of a standardised working week was an imperative , to achieve this end the Dept. as employer sat down with their employees representative body , the schools representatives and the parents organisations and arrived at a mutually agreed , mutually suitable solution.

A solution , incidentally , arrived at in 2004 and which has stood the test of time since and probably will do for the foreseeable future .
 
I prefer to see it for what it is...a well organised and powerful vested interest group (the teachers unions) aligning with another powerful vested interest group (FF) to stitch up Joe & Josephine public. Warren Buffett said 'it is only when the tide goes out, that you can see who is swimming naked'. FF are starkers....so to are their friends in ICTU........and both are trying to cover up their modesty with
tired and washed up rhetoric...
 
DonDub said:
Some of the above comments remind me of the goings on in the Soviet Union, where everything in society was dictated by the state e.g. where people worked, what they did, how they did it.
Apparently, we are not living in a totalitarian state (yet). Although, teachers (like many others in the PS) will blame 'the department' when it suits e.g. hours etc are laid down by the department . Of course, they will attack the department at the merest hint of any real change.

Teachers should work significantly longer hours, for in-service training, and increased contact time with pupils e.g. through shorter holidays. Perish the thought that teachers might become tired through such exertions. I mean, most of us in the real world (lucky enough to have a job) know what tiredness is all about - it's a fact of life.

But wait, I'm forgetting - part of our society is indeed Soviet in nature - just like the communist party apparatchiks, who ran the USSR to serve their own narrow interests. This approach worked wonderfully for decades, until......they 'ran' the country into the ground.......sound familiar?
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Very strange comment. What kind of "real world" do you live in, exactly? :confused:

Forgive me but, you sound like you work in a forced-labour camp.
 
Your 'forced labour camp' comment is I suspect, how most PS employees view the experience of employees in the private sector i.e. compulsory redundancy, restructuring, emigration.....are for the 'others', and not for the 'elite' insiders......
 
DonDub said:
Your 'forced labour camp' comment is I suspect, how most PS employees view the experience of employees in the private sector i.e. compulsory redundancy, restructuring, emigration.....are for the 'others', and not for the 'elite' insiders......
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Maybe I was thinkinking of Soviet labour camps. ;)

How do you know "how most PS employees view the experience of employees in the private sector?"

You seem very biased against them. Can you read their minds as well?
 
DonDub said:
I prefer to see it for what it is...a well organised and powerful vested interest group (the teachers unions) aligning with another powerful vested interest group (FF) to stitch up Joe & Josephine public. Warren Buffett said 'it is only when the tide goes out, that you can see who is swimming naked'. FF are starkers....so to are their friends in ICTU........and both are trying to cover up their modesty with
tired and washed up rhetoric...
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A plot !

Engineered by the Dept. Of Education , the employees union , the parent's organisation and the schools , all with the connivance of the Evil Empire of FF - all determined to hoodwink the public !

Are you Jim Corr ? :D
 
Deiseblue said:
A plot !

Engineered by the Dept. Of Education , the employees union , the parent's organisation and the schools , all with the connivance of the Evil Empire of FF - all determined to hoodwink the public !

Are you Jim Corr ? :D
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What a red herring!!, I could have asked on several occasions,,,,Are you Jack O Connor..
Anyhow DonDUB as Purple mentioned in an earlier post,dont get distracted ..
Vested interests are alive and kicking..and throwing red herrings around left right and centre...ùsually from the left at the right and centre!

You have made excellent posts,but childish responses asking if you are Jim Corr, just show how some have no sense of mature debate..Its a real sense of desperation..which is good..they are not the only ones sensing what is coming down the tracks ,change is coming, regardless..
 
thedaras said:
What a red herring!!, I could have asked on several occasions,,,,Are you Jack O Connor..
Anyhow DonDUB as Purple mentioned in an earlier post,dont get distracted ..
Vested interests are alive and kicking..and throwing red herrings around left right and centre...ùsually from the left at the right and centre!

You have made excellent posts,but childish responses asking if you are Jim Corr, just show how some have no sense of mature debate..Its a real sense of desperation..which is good..they are not the only ones sensing what is coming down the tracks ,change is coming, regardless..
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Ah-ha, Deise, you've been outed and exposed as a fraud!!!!! :D

You're not DeiseBLUE at all. You're really DeiseRED! :eek:
 
Lex Foutish said:
Ah-ha, Deise, you've been outed and exposed as a fraud!!!!! :D

You're not DeiseBLUE at all. You're really DeiseRED! :eek:
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Deiseblue said:
Damn , found out by a combination of Don Dub and Thedaras !
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Amazing what you get with a combination of like minded people! ;)



And just you wait till Purple gets his hands on the above information about you..... :eek: Your beard will have to go, for starters!!!!!! :D
 
DonDub said:
Your 'forced labour camp' comment is I suspect, how most PS employees view the experience of employees in the private sector i.e. compulsory redundancy, restructuring, emigration.....are for the 'others', and not for the 'elite' insiders......
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That's right DonDub. We live in fear of ever having to become like 'private sector people' and spend our days looking down on them.


Seriously, get over yourself!!!
 
thedaras said:
What a red herring!!, I could have asked on several occasions,,,,Are you Jack O Connor..
Anyhow DonDUB as Purple mentioned in an earlier post,dont get distracted ..
Vested interests are alive and kicking..and throwing red herrings around left right and centre...ùsually from the left at the right and centre!

You have made excellent posts,but childish responses asking if you are Jim Corr, just show how some have no sense of mature debate..Its a real sense of desperation..which is good..they are not the only ones sensing what is coming down the tracks ,change is coming, regardless..
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Thedaras, how come when anyone disagrees with you or points out a flaw in your arguments, you dismiss them as childish? It's becoming a bit repetitive.
 
Ahh you guys... I'm feeling rather bullied by your last EIGHT posts! Are you trying desperately to say something,but cant quite find the words..bless..

Whenever you two decide to leave the playground and come back to the adult world of debate and discussion on a mature level.. perhaps we can have a reasonable debate.
 
thedaras said:
Ahh you guys... I'm feeling rather bullied by your last EIGHT posts! Are you trying desperately to say something,but cant quite find the words..bless..

Whenever you two decide to leave the playground and come back to the adult world of debate and discussion on a mature level.. perhaps we can have a reasonable debate.
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Everyone being childish again except Thedaras:rolleyes:
 
If people start throwing red herrings just stand behind the elephant in the room.

BTW, Deisered knows I know he's a pinko. ;)
 
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