For if we too do nothing on the border it only proves it was all a bogus issue.
UK does nothing in respect of the Irish borderYou mean if we do nothing, and the UK does nothing, and we carry on regardless implementing the same rules and regulations as before 31 Oct?
Isnt that the backstop, through the back door?
I don't know about circles but I feel I am slipping once more into a parallel universe where I haven't a clue what Theobold is on about.Theobold said:Without wanting to go around in circles. It appears that Brexit on the island of Ireland will be a different, separate beast, to Brexit on the island of Britain.
I don't know about circles but I feel I am slipping once more into a parallel universe where I haven't a clue what Theobold is on about.
What about the ECJ?
I am sure there are plenty of circles in that explanation but if your main point is that you have the DUP on a “gotcha” you haven’t. The DUP have stated that they are against a hard border in Ireland but even more against a sea border between them and the rest of the UK. They have no problem with Dundalk being treated differently from Calais, doesn’t weaken the United Kingdom.Oh dear, we are descending into attacking the man instead of attacking the ball. Not a good sign.
Everything I have pointed out holds.
DUP claim NI cannot be treated separately from rest of UK. It cannot diverge from UK law after Brexit.
- control of borders
- end FoM
- make own rules and regulations for trade.
But in practice, it is the UK gov, the Brexiteers and the DUP who are heralding a divergence from Brexit in NI
- no border controls
- keep same trade rules and regulations
(this is not Brexit)
The counter argument goes something like "thats just for Ireland. Because the UK is free and independent, it can apply whatever rules it likes to whatever country it likes."
True.
And as stated previously, the historical, cultural and economic ties between Britain and France are as every bit strong as between Ireland and Britain, so not beyond reason the UK applying same for French citizens, goods and services, in and out of UK either?
Or can France expect the full hard Brexit treatment?
Ditto the Germans and Italians, the Spanish, and the Swedes, Belgians, Dutch and Portuguese?
Where will it all end? Before you know it, we will be back to where we are right now.
Wow! This was an eye opener, especially the bit about John Hume. I had to check this in Wikipedia and everything is as you say. EH is a deplorable egotist who wallows in thinking he is a supreme intellect by taking the contrarian view. Despite having been proven spectacularly wrong on many occasions. The mystery is that he has achieved credibility with the likes of Aherne, Bruton etc.
Anyway, my point was that I think Bojo will keep his word on the border. Not because he is an honourable man, he is only a shade behind EH in deplorability. But because it is such an easy tactic to follow. He can easily outstay Ireland/EU with this tactic. For if we too do nothing on the border it only proves it was all a bogus issue. The EU cannot let that happen.
So, Johnson is in full election mode. I suspect the game plan is to talk "tough" (ie, bombastic hot air) on Brexit for the next few weeks and then face an election (called or facilitated by himself) where he will outflank the Brexit Party, aim for an overall Tory majority and ditch the DUP. Then it will be back to some version of the NI only backstop - perhaps rephrased and slightly modified to make it seem like compromise (or "victory").
The rhetoric about reneging on the "divorce bill", etc is rubbish and an election ploy red meat for the rabid Brexiter Daily Mail/Expressers. Approximately 50% of the UKs trade is with the EU who have made it clear that there will be no trade deal without this being settled.
They have no problem with Dundalk being treated differently from Calais,
Does he put up physical barriers to defend the Single Market?
Boris is in a very good position to call the backstop bluff.
Sunny yes Britain can't maintain a do nothing stance in Ireland for ever. My point is they have much more time on their hands than Ireland/EU.
Yes, Ireland would love to keep going as if nothing has changed. The pressure will come from the EU. It is not so much to protect its Single Market, that would take some time to come under any significant threat given the UK is already compliant. But, as Tusk said, the EU will not make No Deal easy. This is a point of principle, a principle stated by Barnier at the very beginning - the UK cannot be better off outside the bloc than in it. It is not revenge (although it has the same effect) it is a warning to other potential exiteers.I dont see why you say this.
On Nov 1st Leo can set up a working group to investigate how to administer the border now that the UK is a third country. I would imagine that would take months, if not years.
What pressure would we be under.
Irish goods exports to NI, no problem for us.
NI or other UK citizens crossing south. No problem for us.
Anyone at all crossing North. No problem for us.
Yes, Ireland would love to keep going as if nothing has changed. The pressure will come from the EU. It is not so much to protect its Single Market, that would take some time to come under any significant threat given the UK is already compliant. But, as Tusk said, the EU will not make No Deal easy. This is a point of principle, a principle stated by Barnier at the very beginning - the UK cannot be better off outside the bloc than in it. It is not revenge (although it has the same effect) it is a warning to other potential exiteers.
This is a very informative piece about the GFA, Brexit and the ECHR.
The main aim of the DUP, as I see it, is to unpick the GFA. They can only do that with the UK out of the ECJ and not bound by the ECHR.
So when they say "we won't put up a border", they are just avoiding having to answer the difficult question.
Sorry, link added.I think you meant to include a link ?
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