Permanent TSB to raise interest rates

roland said:
And yet I take it you are still with them. You demand and expect every ECB and market reduction going, but the idea that a loss-making company might have to increase its prices is unacceptable to you? This is a free market - if you are not happy with the product you signed up for then head on to another company.
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-2 (one for you and one for the nut that agrees with you)

Get real. You are joking right? I bet you havent walked into a bank hat in hand in the last 6 months. Kicked out on your keister you would be... Try to remortgage have you? Tried to get a new loan for anything? I have and not just for myself - they arent giving out money even in small amounts without at least a kidney.
 
yankinlk said:
They only recently passed on the last ecb rate reduction - as usual dragging it out as slow as possible. I bet come monday though I will have the letter in the post saying it will go back up!
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If they did it slower that what stated in the contract you can sue them. Is that the case?
 
roland said:
And yet I take it you are still with them. You demand and expect every ECB and market reduction going, but the idea that a loss-making company might have to increase its prices is unacceptable to you? This is a free market - if you are not happy with the product you signed up for then head on to another company.
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Have you tried moving a mortgage in the last 6 months? Impossible. The banks are closed for new business/lending.

Even if you could, PTSB is a stalking horse and all the other banks will follow suit in the next few weeks.
 
yankinlk said:
-2 (one for you and one for the nut that agrees with you)

Get real. You are joking right? I bet you havent walked into a bank hat in hand in the last 6 months. Kicked out on your keister you would be... Try to remortgage have you? Tried to get a new loan for anything? I have and not just for myself - they arent giving out money even in small amounts without at least a kidney.
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So your proposal to sort this is to have the banks continue to write loans at a loss? That is hardly going to help the situation. If we are looking to have a functioning banking system, then the banks need to start operating on a commercial basis.
 
Does PTSB and other banks have people on variable rates over a barrel, particularly if they are in negative equity?

For example, if someone is in negative equity it is difficult for them to change mortgage providers, so if their bank raises rates there is nothing they can do.
I assume they will also raise their rates when the ECB rate goes up so it is possible that if ECB returns to something like 4-5%, variable rates of 7-8 % might be commen in a couple of years.
 
roland said:
So your proposal to sort this is to have the banks continue to write loans at a loss? That is hardly going to help the situation. If we are looking to have a functioning banking system, then the banks need to start operating on a commercial basis.
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Read my past posts instead of making up my proposals for me. None of these banks has fired even one employee - have they tried to cut costs anywhere at all?
 
yankinlk said:
None of these banks has fired even one employee - have they tried to cut costs anywhere at all?
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Many government backed (or partly capitalised) banks will not and cannot be seen to let hordes of people go. Many, like a lot of companies, are not renewing contracts so a lot of these types of people are being let go. Can you imagine the public outcry if BoI and AIB annouced tomorrow that they were letting 1000 people go each? There would be cries of "We fund the banks, we cant just fire ourselves" and what not.

As for cost cutting, what do you think? They're simply rolling with the times? Racking up massive expenses? :rolleyes:
 
yankinlk said:
Read my past posts instead of making up my proposals for me. None of these banks has fired even one employee - have they tried to cut costs anywhere at all?
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Well, what do you think the consequence is of continuing to write loans at a loss?

As for costs, all banks have cut costs. But they are not going about it the route you suggest. Of course they could cut a lot of costs by simply sacking a whole load of people. But can you imagine the response to that? They are going about it in a way that any business owner should i.e. no salary increases, no bonuses, no recruitment, no promotions etc. etc. and slash the hell out of all other costs. Maybe they will have to sack people, but that is clearly not a nice option for anyone.

I just want you to get some perspective here - it's too easy to throw stones at people without first trying to understand the reasoning. I think you are throwing stones at the wrong people and for the wrong reasons. If you added up all the misinformation that is being bandied about on this thread it puts Lisbon 1 in the shade. I'm not doubting people are annoyed that they have to pay more on their mortgage, but this really has to be put into perspective. Permanent TSB have not caused the **** this country is in. The government has not put a penny into them (whereas they have put billions into Anglo, AIB, BOI). Permanent TSB didn't have any of the reckless lending to developers that is causing a lot of this. Their crime was to rely too much on external funding, and that has frozen up for reasons unrelated to this country. My view is that the stones should be thrown at the government who have mismanaged and overspent for the last 10 years and now are now hiking up taxes to cover the shortfall that seems to have taken them by surprise....
 
roland said:
As for costs, all banks have cut costs. But they are not going about it the route you suggest. Of course they could cut a lot of costs by simply sacking a whole load of people. But can you imagine the response to that?
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How do you know they have cut costs? If they (all the banks) are doing less business now than a year ago, and less again than then year before that - then surely there are people standing around getting paid to do nothing. Where I work - those people have been sacked. Every time people get sacked, there is reaction - but its reality.
 
demoivre said:

10,997 new mortgages to the value of some €2 billion were issued during the first quarter of 2009 !
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:rolleyes:

http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/enraged-mortgage-holders-want-loan-transfers-1844676.html

"One financial analyst said banks were reluctant to take on new business, adding "you'd probably have to be a couple both working in the public service and with less than 50pc loan to value ratio on your home to qualify" for a switch-over. "
 
yankinlk said:
How do you know they have cut costs? If they (all the banks) are doing less business now than a year ago, and less again than then year before that - then surely there are people standing around getting paid to do nothing. Where I work - those people have been sacked. Every time people get sacked, there is reaction - but its reality.
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They have or are in the process of getting rid of 500 people. They have also outlined a further €22 million of payroll costs to be cut on top of this.
 
demoivre said:

10,997 new mortgages to the value of some €2 billion were issued during the first quarter of 2009 !
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yankinlk said:
:rolleyes:

http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/enraged-mortgage-holders-want-loan-transfers-1844676.html

"One financial analyst said banks were reluctant to take on new business, adding "you'd probably have to be a couple both working in the public service and with less than 50pc loan to value ratio on your home to qualify" for a switch-over. "
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The are there if you bother to check. :rolleyes:
 
yankinlk said:
Yes I see them thanks - those stats emphasize my point that they are doing less work with the same amount of staff.
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I think you are thinking of the civil service there! You should check your stats on the number of staff. e.g.

"AIB is the State’s biggest private sector employer with 13,500 staff and has so far avoided a redundancy programme, despite the crisis in the banking sector. The bank reduced staff costs by 11 per cent to €1.4 billion in 2008 by cutting the number of external consultants, freezing pay and recruitment, and cutting bonuses and profit-share payments.
Its workforce dropped by 457 staff in 2008 as departing employees were not replaced. Some 250 outside consultants were not retained by the bank."
 
yankinlk said:
http://www.irishexaminer.com/busine...-350m-eib-funds-set-aside-for-smes-97588.html
Ok, I give up. You are right - its business as usual and the banks have ALL trimmed the fat as close to the bone as the rest of the economy.
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From the article:

But, Mr Garland added that banks need to take extra risk on SME lending policies immediately, but said that they needed to be encouraged to do so by the Government.


http://www.irishexaminer.com/business/banks-lending-very-little-of-350m-eib-funds-set-aside-for-smes-97588.html#ixzz0MjU65SOW&D

So what we're trying to say is that banks need to have risky loans going out to make it seem like they're lending? Lending for the sake of lending is not a good policy imo.
 
Kine said:
So what we're trying to say is that banks need to have risky loans going out to make it seem like they're lending? Lending for the sake of lending is not a good policy imo.
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Im talking to the wall here. The banks are not busy, not lending and still employee the same people. Im not suggesting they should wash glasses like a bartender in a slow pub...im saying to improve margins other than raising interest rates.

When have banks raised interest rates in the past - while the ECB rate is going down?

From Today - DOnt rule out another interst rate cut - ECB
http://www.rte.ie/business/2009/0730/imf.html
 
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