One of lifes great secrets - keeping your trousers on!

[Betsy Og]

Recently heard that 2 people I know, both with young families, could be in the process of shacking up together. Here's hoping it doesnt happen but God I find it very depressing. On the presumption that neither of them is married to an axe murderer, could they not stick it out where they are??

Call me old-fashioned, but is it really worth disrupting your family and causing all that hurt, especially to young kids. I think its very selfish/ill-advised and whatever else.

& I dont subscribe to the "Mills & Boon" notion that romance just descended on us, we never meant it to happen. OK you mightnt have been happy or whatever but there's a point when you decide to cross the line from flirting to doing something about it - Just say NO

When you're kids are grown up then, fair enough, you only have 1 life, but getting married and having kids should mean a 20 year contract at least, your number one role is not to damage your kids too badly......

 

[Purple]

Agreed. Of course if the woman or man is physically abusive or there is some other extreme extenuating circumstance then it’s different but when young children are involved you don’t have the right to put yourself first.

 

[missdaisy]

I think that a happy relationship where parents of children stay together is probably a great aspiration and something that two partners in a relationship should work at.

However, life isn't perfect and an unhappy marriage/partnership is definitely not a good environment for kids to be brought up in either. I don't think couples should stay together regardless just because they have children together.

 

[Firefly]

This might sound cliched, but whatever is in the children's best interests should be done...to me it really is that simple. All children want is a happy, loving family and something 1/2 decent at Xmas! Their needs are pretty basic and it's the minimum they deserve. Whatever you put in you get out.

 

[ali]

You live and learn. And change your opinions several times. I have no sympathy with people who allow short term flirtations / affairs / to destroy the associated lives in the family. However: If the relationship isn't working, and one or other party is unhappy and there is a reasonable prospect of an improvement to one's own life, then really; life is short. If there is anything I've learnt it's that life is short . And kids will grow up and make their own mistakes and their own triumphs. They are adaptable and ultimately selfish. And not in a bad way.

Just make sure it's worth it and try and minimize the hurt all around.

I say this from a very happy family background ; but I really do believe that life flies by and opportunities for real happiness should be seized . Just be aware what you're leaving and what you're leaving it for.

A.

 

[liaconn]

But no one lives in a bubble. If you always just seize your chance of happiness you could be doing it at the expense of other people. I know someone who 'seized their chance' to take up a great job that involved him being away from home 4 nights a week. His wife is suffering, his parents in law are having to give up time to help with the kids, and some of the wife's colleagues have started to complain about having to pick up some of the slack because she has to dash off at 5 every evening to collect the kids, instead of every second evening as previously and can no longer travel to meetings abroad. Your actions are going to affect lots of other people, so things need to be thought through.

 

[ali]

But no one lives in a bubble. If you always just seize your chance of happiness you could be doing it at the expense of other people. I know someone who 'seized their chance' to take up a great job that involved him being away from home 4 nights a week. His wife is suffering, his parents in law are having to give up time to help with the kids, and some of the wife's colleagues have started to complain about having to pick up some of the slack because she has to dash off at 5 every evening to collect the kids, instead of every second evening as previously and can no longer travel to meetings abroad. Your actions are going to affect lots of other people, so things need to be thought through.

No arguement here. But: you have to differentiate between the big things and ultimately the things that will last and being self indulgent.

 

[Mpsox]

But no one lives in a bubble. If you always just seize your chance of happiness you could be doing it at the expense of other people. I know someone who 'seized their chance' to take up a great job that involved him being away from home 4 nights a week. His wife is suffering, his parents in law are having to give up time to help with the kids, and some of the wife's colleagues have started to complain about having to pick up some of the slack because she has to dash off at 5 every evening to collect the kids, instead of every second evening as previously and can no longer travel to meetings abroad. Your actions are going to affect lots of other people, so things need to be thought through.

To me, marriage is a partership, with give and take on both sides. For example, I'm off to London tomorrow to watch the mighty Leyton Orient (don't ask, far too long a story), wife will be at home with a 4 year old and 10 week old baby all Saturday. I'll also be working til 10 at least one night next week, so she'll be at home again with them on her own. On the other side, she's got a cookery class booked for another Saturday and going to a Spa another day with her Mum, and I'll be babysitting. And yes, we do go off and do things together as well.

What I can never understand is how anyone can put a job before kids and family. I would never want to live away for 4 nights a week, when I'd miss out on smiles from my baby and my little un telling me that she can't be quiet cause all the noise inside her wants to come out. Likewise, would it be worth missing out on all of that for one night of pleasure. Definatly not

 

[truthseeker]

I think that people jump into things too lightly - without thinking about the consequences of what they are doing.

I know of a marriage that broke up after a year, the bride just said that it wasnt what she wanted and she felt trapped and was becoming increasingly distressed at the thoughts that this was what she was stuck with, she met someone else (also married but he had children) and they both decided to make a break for it and give it a go together.

I personally found it absolutely shocking. I couldnt understand why she had gotten married at all.
I also couldnt understand the guy she hooked up with, one of his children was only a few months old. What was he doing having another child if he was that close to the edge!!
I cant help but think (to this day) that if I were her Id be wary of having children with the guy after seeing how easily he abandoned one family. Id also be wary of marrying either of them seeing how easily they changed their minds on that!

That said, I wouldnt condemn someone to a life that they were dreadfully unhappy in. But people need to take responsibility for their decisions and think about what they are doing before they do it. In the above stories neither party would agree to any kind of marriage counselling or attempt to fix things - they wanted to be together with the new people, out of the old marriage and that was that.

Too many people are far more interested in the wedding (ie the party) than they are in the marriage, and too many people just randomly have children without thinking about the consequences of doing so.

 

[Sunny]

I can beat that. I know a guy that walked out on his wife two weeks after she brought their second child home from the hospital.

 

[truthseeker]

I can beat that. I know a guy that walked out on his wife two weeks after she brought their second child home from the hospital.

Do you think that sometimes in an effort to 'repair' the relationship one or other of the couple decide a baby is the thing to bring them back together?

 

[liaconn]

I think that people jump into things too lightly - without thinking about the consequences of what they are doing.

I know of a marriage that broke up after a year, the bride just said that it wasnt what she wanted and she felt trapped and was becoming increasingly distressed at the thoughts that this was what she was stuck with, she met someone else (also married but he had children) and they both decided to make a break for it and give it a go together.

I personally found it absolutely shocking. I couldnt understand why she had gotten married at all.I

Too many people are far more interested in the wedding (ie the party) than they are in the marriage, and too many people just randomly have children without thinking about the consequences of doing so.

I agree. I think some people get engaged very lightly, get totally focussed on planning a big fancy wedding and then, when the wedding is just a few weeks away suddenly realise what they're doing but are too embarassed to call off the fabulous wedding they've been talking about all year. I feel sorry for anyone in that situation but think it is total madness to walk down the aisle with someone you know is not 'the one'. A few weeks of embarassment is surely better than a lifetime of unhappiness.

 

[Sunny]

Do you think that sometimes in an effort to 'repair' the relationship one or other of the couple decide a baby is the thing to bring them back together?

Absolutely. I know more than one couple that have gone through a hard time and then suddenly there is a baby on the way.

 

[fobs]

I think that over the last few years a lot of people were sucked into "If you want it get it" with life. Things we never dreamed we would afford became available to us i.e nice house,2 cars, holidays, clothes etc.. and a sense of entitlement ensued. This spread to all aspects of our lives. People had to have fancy wedding, honeymoon, fully fitted out house before moving in.

This meant people found it hard to come to terms with day to day life and the not so glamourous lifestyle that occurs when you have kids. We can harp back to how life was so good while we were single and seek out the no strings attached relationship. It is easy to meet someone and think they are great in the pub or a restaurant when you don't have to discuss bills,schools,shopping etc.. and all the mundane things.

Marriages are hard work the same as anything else in life. People put huge effort into their working life and their kids and often forget their relationship needs to be worked on too.

Will be married 12 years this year and we have had many hard times with health issues especially but find working through them brings you closer. I feel you have to avoid certain situations when you are married and find yourself attracted to someone else. It is so easy for a casual lunch date or the casual after work drinks to lead somewhere else if you are attracted to someone else so better to avoid the temptation altogether!

 

[truthseeker]

I agree. I think some people get engaged very lightly, get totally focussed on planning a big fancy wedding and then, when the wedding is just a few weeks away suddenly realise what they're doing but are too embarassed to call off the fabulous wedding they've been talking about all year. I feel sorry for anyone in that situation but think it is total madness to walk down the aisle with someone you know is not 'the one'. A few weeks of embarassment is surely better than a lifetime of unhappiness.

I agree with you.

A couple meet, have an exciting first year together of 'honeymoon period', spend a second year saving for a house or travelling or something equally as exciting, move in in the third year, get engaged and have lots of exciting wedding plans, then after the honeymoon they come home and theyve nothing left to talk about!! And a lot of the time - then they decide to have a baby. Im convinced that some people have children rather than have nothing to plan for!!

 

[ali]

I agree. I think some people get engaged very lightly, get totally focussed on planning a big fancy wedding and then, when the wedding is just a few weeks away suddenly realise what they're doing but are too embarassed to call off the fabulous wedding they've been talking about all year. I feel sorry for anyone in that situation but think it is total madness to walk down the aisle with someone you know is not 'the one'. A few weeks of embarassment is surely better than a lifetime of unhappiness.

But you're assuming that 'the one' will always be the one. Things change, people change, and 'the one' at 26 may not be the same one you want at 44. I think people who are lucky can find that they grow along the same lines as their partner and find that they have as much if not far more in common with them as they move through the different phases of life.

But that's not everyone. Often times having a family or other life issues only brings out the differences in people. Or the mundanity of day to day life means that a little flattery, the buzz of attraction and the seduction of being selfish can bring on the infidelity.

I agree that your first loyalty is to your family and your children but I also think that very few people sit down and ask themselves what do I want for myself. They tend to drift through life without a plan and let circumstances dictate what happens to them. Knowing what you want for yourself might lead to very different decisions.

 

[Ceist Beag]

Personally I think the term "the one" is a load of rubbish. To suggest that there is one and only one person out there for you is lets say a little naive! But I agree with others, entering marriage should mean you are committing to stay with that person for the rest of your life.
ali I would very much differ from your view on this. I think relationships tend to break down when people lose respect for each other, and are no longer prepared to make the effort to see things from the other persons perspective or try to reach common ground on issues between them.
I don't accept the argument that people change - people get lazy, selfish, yes, but saying that "the one" they married is no longer the one is just a cop out as far as I'm concerned. Luck isn't a word I would use either to describe successful marriages, it is more down to a mutual appreciation between both partners that they want to build on their relationship to better understand each other.

 

[thedaras]

Recently heard that 2 people I know, both with young families, could be in the process of shacking up together. Here's hoping it doesnt happen but God I find it very depressing. On the presumption that neither of them is married to an axe murderer, could they not stick it out where they are??

Call me old-fashioned, but is it really worth disrupting your family and causing all that hurt, especially to young kids. I think its very selfish/ill-advised and whatever else.

& I dont subscribe to the "Mills & Boon" notion that romance just descended on us, we never meant it to happen. OK you mightnt have been happy or whatever but there's a point when you decide to cross the line from flirting to doing something about it - Just say NO

When you're kids are grown up then, fair enough, you only have 1 life, but getting married and having kids should mean a 20 year contract at least, your number one role is not to damage your kids too badly......

On the other hand is it worth staying together for the sake of the kids,if the kids are in an unloving environment with constant fighting and hostility?

I know many separated people who are very happy with their lot,whose kids are as balanced or unbalanced as those who stayed together.

I think its down to the way the issue is handled and how well focused the parents are at keeping the children as their top priority.

I know of people who grew up in the days when most if not all couples stayed together regardless of how badly they were treated,be it alcohol,physical.mental abuse..or just plain unhappy..And my God did those kids have to suffer also..

There is usually a reason why people Cross that line..

I was out canvassing during the divorce referendum ,I was for giving people the choice,I had strong opposition from some people,who weirdly enough are in a position where they may now have to take that choice up..
I suppose its a case of never say never..

In my own family my parents separated after 25 years,I would say 10 of those 25 years were hell for us kids,having to listen to things kicking off every other day..so it does have an effect..I would walk if I felt the kids were living in that kind of environment..we were all much happier when they finally parted.

It is impossible to judge why others do what they do..and can be unfair as we never know what is happening behind the scenes.

 

[liaconn]

Personally I think the term "the one" is a load of rubbish. To suggest that there is one and only one person out there for you is lets say a little naive! But I agree with others, entering marriage should mean you are committing to stay with that person for the rest of your life.

It was just an expression Ceist meaning that if you don't 'feel' that way on your wedding day there is something wrong.

 

[liaconn]

On the other hand is it worth staying together for the sake of the kids,if the kids are in an unloving environment with constant fighting and hostility?

I know many separated people who are very happy with their lot,whose kids are as balanced or unbalanced as those who stayed together.

I think its down to the way the issue is handled and how well focused the parents are at keeping the children as their top priority.

I know of people who grew up in the days when most if not all couples stayed together regardless of how badly they were treated,be it alcohol,physical.mental abuse..or just plain unhappy..And my God did those kids have to suffer also..

There is usually a reason why people Cross that line..

I was out canvassing during the divorce referendum ,I was for giving people the choice,I had strong opposition from some people,who weirdly enough are in a position where they may now have to take that choice up..
I suppose its a case of never say never..

In my own family my parents separated after 25 years,I would say 10 of those 25 years were hell for us kids,having to listen to things kicking off every other day..so it does have an effect..I would walk if I felt the kids were living in that kind of environment..we were all much happier when they finally parted.

It is impossible to judge why others do what they do..and can be unfair as we never know what is happening behind the scenes.

But there's a difference between walking away from an abusive or unhealthy marriage and walking out of a lack lustre marriage because you want to be with someone else regardless of consequences.