KBC KBC Tracker Examination Information

[peemac]

Hi The letter of offer was 25th Oct 2006 and loan was drawn in Dec 12th 2006 and not Nov 2006, are the dates relevant?

Many thanks

Yes. On Nov 7th 2006 IIB homeloans wrote to brokers to state that all fixed rates would now roll on to 1.25% tracker.

Have a good read of the first few posts on this thread. Have a look at the fixed rate flyer in one of the messages.

Next step is probably to contact padraig kissane of kissane financial services for an opinion.

You fall in a group that applied before the date of the letter but drew down afterwards. I think this is still under investigation.

 

[Covid20]

Thanks for looking at my case Peemac, KBC have made my life hell over past 10 years, when you them they are so unhelpful. I would hate to be in arrears, they would be ruthless. I will look into this a bit more.

Thank you

 

[Covid20]

Hi How does one get in contact with Padraig Kissane, his office is closed and obviously off due to Covid?

 

[Don007]

Hi Covid, I would like to contact him also, to explain with him in person my case

 

[peemac]

Hi How does one get in contact with Padraig Kissane, his office is closed and obviously off due to Covid?

Many offices are closed, but most people are working from home - send him an email
http://www.padraickissane.ie/contact.htm

Keep it short and to the point. Give the precise dates.

He does charge a fee of €1,000 if he thinks there's a case, but worth every cent.

You are in a group of about 400 KBC customers who straddled the date of the flyer. They say its the application date and not the drawdown date that applies, but as the contract is not in force until the drawdown rate, there is a very strong argument that the flyer promise should apply to anyone who drew down after November 6th. Any broker that got that would have clearly assumed that any undrawn down mortgage would have that condition applied.

I would also guess that the offer of contract says that the current rate is XX% but it is the rate at drawdown that will apply.

I suggest you spend a few hours reading the entire mortgage offer document and mortgage contract. Highlight anything that mentions interest rates, rate it rolls on to, options on expiry, and in particular anything on the offer documents stating that the interest rate and terms can chnage between than and the drawdown

 

[Don007]

Hi All, I am new to this forum, however it would be great to know if the ombudsman has kbc in focus at the moment, I was just wondering as I hadn't heard much about it lately and given the fact there is such a large group, I had hoped it would be prioritized

 

[peemac]

Hi All, I am new to this forum, however it would be great to know if the ombudsman has kbc in focus at the moment, I was just wondering as I hadn't heard much about it lately and given the fact there is such a large group, I had hoped it would be prioritized

400 is quite a small group in the overall scheme of things. I think this cohort is the last group that has a reasonable chance of success. You can give brief details about your case and either I or someone else will give an opinion based on what we've leant over the past 12 years.

 

[BeanyBoo]

Hi
I am part of the 2006-2008 cohort and have been following any KBC posts on this with interest. Posting to assist with info and strength in numbers.

Applied - through broker, July 2006
Drew down - 30 Nov 2006, fixed for 3 years
Received letter/kbc secure message within KBC review - looking through paperwork to get this date
Letter not impacted - 18 Feb 2018
"We can confirm we have written to all customers considered to be impacted by the Tracker Mortgage Examination. No impact or detriment in relation to your account" letter
Contract has "prevailing variable rate"

I requested a copy of my file from KBC - The file came with no letters re rate offers from end of 3 years or any others after 2009. I am suspicious that these were omitted on purpose.

 

[Don007]

Hi Beany, my case resembles yours, except when I came off the fixed rate I got no options and was put on 4.75per cent variable rate, also like covid 20 , another post the only option given to me when I took out the loan was a fixed rate. I bought through a broker, and when I requested my file from kbc, I found documents omitted

 

[BeanyBoo]

Those I have noted are similar to me are
McCoyPat
Steely1
TippTopp2
Unfortionate
DaisyDuke
Darn40
KBC Tracker
draw down Dec 06 / Jan 07 . Lenders Prevailing Rate . Some had tops ups . (I did not)

And I wonder about the user Wonder

(Could the Flair on this thread be changed from AIB to KBC?)

 

[Covid20]

Hi Peemac, Many thanks for direction on this, I have got more information here in 24 hours that in 10 years talking to KBC.

 

[peemac]

Hi Peemac, Many thanks for direction on this, I have got more information here in 24 hours that in 10 years talking to KBC.

That's why this forum is here. I was the new poster posing the questions back in 2008! Many other posters are experts in relevant fields and others have built up knowledge over the years and share that.

Thankfully spam and off topic replies and replies without any back up are banned, so you tend to get decent info / quality conversation from most posters from all angles of a discussion

 

[Don007]

Thank you also pee mac for your input and it is very much appreciated and it is helpful to have the discussions and get the shared knowledge

 

[BeanyBoo]

https://www.askaboutmoney.com/threads/kbc-basing-cohorts-on-application-date-rather-than-draw-down-dates.207047/post-1568546

There is an interesting post on this thread by @Mountain Man1 . They say they were part of 650 PDH receiving redress with a drawdown in Dec 2006, fixed for 3 years. It would be very interesting for @Mountain Man1 to provide
1. An update on how you got on with rental properties and
2. what your date of application was?

 

[GTracker]

Check the precise dates. A day or two out can make a big difference.

After Nov 7th drawdown and you have a strong argument.
Before Nov 7th drawdown and you have a weak argument.

In relation to the original advice of fixing, it probably was right for the time as rates were increasing.
The main tracker issue came because people who were on trackers (incl me) switched to fixed rates in mid/late 2006. So broker advice was good at the time.

It's what rate you were to go to after the fixed rate that needs to be worked out.

Hi peemac, I drew down on 1st of November 2006 on a 3 year fixed rate (special condition ..no other option given). Looks like I'm falling outside the timeline . Deemed not impacted by KBC?

 

[Leighlinboy]

Hi Peemac, my case is similar to yours . Drew down on variable and moved to tracker 6 months later , have the ECB refi rate gurantee letter , fixed in late 2007 after the unsolicited letters started coming through letter box . and the rest is history . Deemed under investigation but not impacted . With Padraig a couple of years .

 

[peemac]

Hi peemac, I drew down on 1st of November 2006 on a 3 year fixed rate (special condition ..no other option given). Looks like I'm falling outside the timeline . Deemed not impacted by KBC?

At a tracker meeting run by padraig kissane about 3 years ago this came up.

Seems that by only offering a fixed rate, a bank could offer a higher multiple of earnings as a mortgage.

So possibly you would not have been offered the mortgage if you wanted a tracker.

And unfortunately it does look like you fall out of both cohorts - the cohort that got a tracker and those skirting between the applied date and drawdown date of after Nov. 6th

Sorry I can't give more positive news

 

[peemac]

Hi Peemac, my case is similar to yours . Drew down on variable and moved to tracker 6 months later , have the ECB refi rate gurantee letter , fixed in late 2007 after the unsolicited letters started coming through letter box . and the rest is history . Deemed under investigation but not impacted . With Padraig a couple of years .

The difference is I had tracker from day one and it stated "for lifetime of mortgage" in the primary mortgage document.

It really would depend on the exact wording of the tracker document, but I would very much target the unsolicited nature of the fixed rate letters.

I'm surprised that they are fighting this as there would be very few such scenarios and a reasonable chance of the ombudsman finding for you

 

[mccoypat94]

Yes I’m afraid I didn’t have any success and the ombudsman didn’t include these cohorts so I presume it’s all wrapped up

 

[GTracker]

At a tracker meeting run by padraig kissane about 3 years ago this came up.

Seems that by only offering a fixed rate, a bank could offer a higher multiple of earnings as a mortgage.

So possibly you would not have been offered the mortgage if you wanted a tracker.

And unfortunately it does look like you fall out of both cohorts - the cohort that got a tracker and those skirting between the applied date and drawdown date of after Nov. 6th

Sorry I can't give more positive news

We did have approval with tracker option but looking for single application dual title which they refused at the 11hr (I already had a property and did not want to get caught for stamp duty).

Is there any traction with the prevailing variable on role off from fixed rate?