Investing in Rabo Bank funds

Garrettod said:
I agree entirely, hence the question directed to RaboDirect here on the thread - I don't want to take the thread way off topic form general RaboDirect facilities etc, so just want a quick answer if possible from the contributor(s) posting under the handle RaboDirect please :)

Regards

G>
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The Rabobank Group comprises 218 independent local cooperative Rabobanks in the Netherlands plus their central organisation Rabobank Nederland and its subsidiaries. Rabobank serves more than 9 million private individuals and corporate clients in the Netherlands and a growing number abroad. It employs over 50,000 staff and is represented in 38 countries.

The local Rabobanks and their clients form Rabobank Group's core cooperative business. The banks are members and shareholders of the supralocal cooperative organisation, Rabobank Nederland, which advises the banks and supports their local services. Rabobank Nederland also supervises, on behalf of the Dutch central bank, the solvency, liquidity and administrative organisation of the local Rabobanks. Rabobank Nederland further acts as an (international) wholesale bank and as a bankers' bank to the Group and is the holding company of a large number of specialised subsidiaries.

in short, RaboDirect is part of the Rabobank International Dublin Branch located in Dublin's IFSC. Rabobank International is owned by Rabobank Nederland and has a AAA rating. RaboDirect customers do not have voting rights or member shares in the Rabobank Group.

For more information regarding the history, structure and profile of the Rabobank Group please see:
[broken link removed]
[broken link removed]

All the best,
RaboDirect
 
RaboDirect said:
Please see the following link regarding the tax treatment of ALL RaboDirect funds. [broken link removed]

You are able to download statements which detail the profit and loss on each fund transaction. To make life easier for our customers we will be developing a calculator that will make it very simple for you to determine your profit (or loss) each year. For example, if you made three transactions in the same fund in one year you will have bought them at different prices. The calculator will do the hard work for you in determining the overall profit. We will release this calculator in our secure site in the coming months.

Regards,
RaboDirect
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Any sign of this calculator we were promised?
 
Latest update:
We investigated if we could actually deduct tax for investors directly. The taxation advice we received is that we cannot do this. Investors in offshore UCITS funds must make their own tax declarations.

So this being the case, we will work on a calculator that we will make available in the Secure Site. This will make it very clear what your profit and loss is during the relevant period. Naturally this requires system development work and needs to be thoroughly tested etc but we have made the commitment to deliver it and will do this before autumn.

Please note that statements are currently available in the secure site which clearly detail each trade, the price and gain or loss. However, an automated calculator would certaintly make life a lot easier.

RaboDirect
 
RaboDirect said:
Latest update:
We investigated if we could actually deduct tax for investors directly. The taxation advice we received is that we cannot do this. Investors in offshore UCITS funds must make their own tax declarations.

So this being the case, we will work on a calculator that we will make available in the Secure Site. This will make it very clear what your profit and loss is during the relevant period. Naturally this requires system development work and needs to be thoroughly tested etc but we have made the commitment to deliver it and will do this before autumn.

Please note that statements are currently available in the secure site which clearly detail each trade, the price and gain or loss. However, an automated calculator would certaintly make life a lot easier.

RaboDirect
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Perhaps you could clarify whether funds are treated separately for tax purposes or not i.e. can a gain on one fund be offset against a loss on another fund?
 
Hi

Now that would be helpful, along with other questions some might consider obvious .... a good FAQ section to accompany the RaboDirect funds would be important to myself and probably many others I'd think.

Perhaps, if RaboDirect are designing this calculation they might also agree an appropriate document which the Revenue will accept & which might be printed off, after the calculator has finished doing the tots ?

Thanks

G>
 
That was a good question room305. Did anyone clarify if gains on one fund can be offset by losses on another.

If so, does it apply only to disposals within the same tax year or what are the parameters?
 
galmeister said:
That was a good question room305. Did anyone clarify if gains on one fund can be offset by losses on another.
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Never been clarified as far as I can tell. My brother's professional opinion is that they cannot be. It's a shame because although they have high charges, Rabo do have the best range of funds available. However, I don't fancy getting hit with a tax bill every year simply for rebalancing my portfolio, so I've kept away from the funds.
 
room305 said:
Never been clarified as far as I can tell. My brother's professional opinion is that they cannot be. It's a shame because although they have high charges, Rabo do have the best range of funds available. However, I don't fancy getting hit with a tax bill every year simply for rebalancing my portfolio, so I've kept away from the funds.
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Oh No,

If thats the case .... it could be a problem for many investors / potential investors.

This is the kind of thing I'd love to see RaboDirect respond to - both here and also, cover out on their FAQ's on their website.

Regards

G>
 
Could someone explain the additonal 3% on top of the CGT rate of 20%?

Any revenue documentation I can find just states that the CGT rate is 20%

Thanks!
 
room305 said:
Never been clarified as far as I can tell. My brother's professional opinion is that they cannot be. It's a shame because although they have high charges, Rabo do have the best range of funds available. However, I don't fancy getting hit with a tax bill every year simply for rebalancing my portfolio, so I've kept away from the funds.
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Unless you are rebalancing within an umbrella fund any "rebalancing" would give rise to CGT anyway.
 
greentree said:
Could someone explain the additonal 3% on top of the CGT rate of 20%?

Any revenue documentation I can find just states that the CGT rate is 20%

Thanks!
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It is not CGT, it is exit tax. If you search for 'exit tax' on AAM you will find plenty of explanation.
 
BRICKTOP said:
Unless you are rebalancing within an umbrella fund any "rebalancing" would give rise to CGT anyway.
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Many other fund providers do facilitate just such an umbrella. With Rabo you can only cash out and re-invest giving rise to a possible exit tax liability even for a year in which you realised a loss overall (it's not CGT btw).

With ordinary shares, you have a CGT threshold to work under and you can offset the gains on some shares against losses on others.
 
CCOVICH said:
It is not CGT, it is exit tax. If you search for 'exit tax' on AAM you will find plenty of explanation.
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Sorry - bit of a newbie in the tax area.

I have a share portfolio and am thinking of getting into funds.

So when you sell shares you pay CGT and when you exit a fund you pay this exit tax of 23%. Is that correct?

Thanks
 
Can you not switch between funds in Rabo (like in every other product I can think of) without exposing yourself to tax ?


Greentree, how I think of the exit tax is that it applies to the dividends + capital gains. So its a tax on both the capital gain and also on the income created in the funds' investments.
 
greentree said:
Sorry - bit of a newbie in the tax area.

I have a share portfolio and am thinking of getting into funds.

So when you sell shares you pay CGT and when you exit a fund you pay this exit tax of 23%. Is that correct?

Thanks
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Pretty much, yes.
 
room305 said:
Many other fund providers do facilitate just such an umbrella. With Rabo you can only cash out and re-invest giving rise to a possible exit tax liability even for a year in which you realised a loss overall (it's not CGT btw).

With ordinary shares, you have a CGT threshold to work under and you can offset the gains on some shares against losses on others.
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RB (due to economies of scale) provide low minimums, low cost access (in terms of front end load) to multiple top fund managers whom the ordinary Joe Bloggs would normally not have access to, therefore an umbrella is unrealistic.
 
BRICKTOP said:
No, unless they are within an umbrella fund.
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I welcome Rabo into the Irish market but in that case I have no regrets about NOT taking up their May no entry fee commission offer. It seems ludicrous not to be allowed to change funds without paying tax or new charges. Normally thats one of the best options to someone who thinks he wants to consolidate his gains and move from for example shares to a bonds/cash fund.
Why cant they put some kind of wrapper around the Irish portion of the fund ? There must be a legal way.
 
sign said:
I welcome Rabo into the Irish market but in that case I have no regrets about NOT taking up their May no entry fee commission offer. It seems ludicrous not to be allowed to change funds without paying tax or new charges. Normally thats one of the best options to someone who thinks he wants to consolidate his gains and move from for example shares to a bonds/cash fund.
Why cant they put some kind of wrapper around the Irish portion of the fund ? There must be a legal way.
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Just curious, do you know any other providers who do this?
 
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