Housing for key workers

Purple

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Kieran Christie, head of the ASTI, is calling for subsidised housing for key workers. This is not a new thing and other countries have allowances and supports for some sectors but what is a key worker?
The narrative is that it's teachers and nurses but there are other jobs that are far more important for the country to function. The people who keep the lights on, the water running, take our waste away and deliver food to the shops are the real key workers and are paid far less than teachers or nurses so where does the list stop? The average salary for a primary school teacher aged between 25 and 34 is €50,000, with the opportunity to do grinds or summer work on top of that. Nurses aren't as well paid and work much longer hours over the year but they earn an average of €45,000 a year. Should people on reasonably good incomes get subsidised housing based only on their job? If so at what salary level should that support be removed? And given that there is a housing shortage what group should they be prioritised ahead of? I see some merit in a "Dublin allowance" (or Galway or Cork etc) but even more government intervention of this sort in the housing market is the last thing we need.
 
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Kieran Christie, head of the ASTI, is calling for subsidised housing for key workers. This is not a new thing and other countries have allowances and supports for some sectors but what is a key worker?
The narrative is that it's teachers and nurses but there are other jobs that are far more important for the country to function. The people who keep the lights on, the water running, take our waste away and deliver food to the shops are the real key workers and are paid far less than teachers or nurses so where does the list stop? The average salary for a primary school teacher aged between 25 and 34 is €50,000, with the opportunity to do grinds or summer work on top of that. Nurses aren't as well paid and work much longer hours over the year but they earn an average of €45,000 a year. Should people on reasonably good incomes get subsidised housing based only on their job? If so at what salary level should that support be removed? And given that there is a housing shortage what group should they be prioritised ahead of? I see some merit in a "Dublin allowance" (or Galway or Cork etc) but even more government intervention of this sort in the housing market is the last thing we need.
i dont think a dublin allowance (like the london allowance) is unreasonable for essential workers, id put guards, nurses, firefighters and teachers in that. Im sure there are other state employees that come to mind.
 
i dont think a dublin allowance (like the london allowance) is unreasonable for essential workers, id put guards, nurses, firefighters and teachers in that. Im sure there are other state employees that come to mind.
Why single them out though? As listed above there are people who are far more essential who earn far less. Should some of the best paid young graduates in the country really be getting more? When the economy turns, as it surely shall, will those payments be reduced accordingly?
 
Why single them out though? As listed above there are people who are far more essential who earn far less. Should some of the best paid young graduates in the country really be getting more? When the economy turns, as it surely shall, will those payments be reduced accordingly?
because we need them to function and advance our society, education and healthcare are key as are the people who uphold law and order. And if they were among the best paid graduates we wouldnt be having this discussion!

who else would you include that is far more essential? and on the state payroll?
 
because we need them to function and advance our society, education and healthcare are key as are the people who uphold law and order. And if they were among the best paid graduates we wouldnt be having this discussion!

who else would you include that is far more essential? and on the state payroll?
Care workers. Bin men. Grocery workers. Airport staff. Bus drivers. Dart Drivers.
TD,s? :p :p
 
Hard to see a one rule fits all approach working across the country. However, if/when all the social housing comes on stream might there be an argument for ring fencing some social housing for staff in roles deemed important. Such places could be administered by Local authorities. In does sound a bit like a HAP+ scheme mind you. Not sure how to stop it just becoming a subsidy for those who shout loudest rather then those who actually need it from societies perspective.
 
because we need them to function and advance our society, education and healthcare are key as are the people who uphold law and order.
We do, but we need water, power, food, waste removal and sewage more.
And if they were among the best paid graduates we wouldnt be having this discussion!
I stand corrected, they are not amongst the best paid graduates, teachers are the best paid graduates.
who else would you include that is far more essential? and on the state payroll?
Irish Water employees. And why should we only help those who are privileged to be employed by the State?
 
The narrative is that it's teachers and nurses but there are other jobs that are far more important for the country to function. The people who keep the lights on, the water running, take our waste away and deliver food to the shops are the real key workers and are paid far less than teachers or nurses so where does the list stop?
ESB workers are very well paid as fair as I understand. Irish water have an exceedingly high average salary in the organization incl. bonus. Waste and food delivery are private sector with market wages.
 
I stand corrected, they are not amongst the best paid graduates, teachers are the best paid graduates
The take home pay of a new entrant teacher is in the region of €2,2000 a month. Average rent for a 1 bed apartment in the city is 1,800 a month. House share usually €800. We have a chronic shortage of teachers in urban areas. The exodus will continue until there are affordable accommodation options within a reasonable commute to city schools. When little Zac or Sophie doesn't have a qualified teacher in their classroom then we have a serious problem. Trying to compile a hierarchy of essential workers is pointless. All are necessary for our cities to function properly.
 
Waste and food delivery are private sector with market wages.
Are you suggesting state employees are earning less? So much so that they are deserving of a hand-out? Or have the public sector unions failed miserably in achieving market pay for state employees?
 
The take home pay of a new entrant teacher is in the region of €2,2000 a month. Average rent for a 1 bed apartment in the city is 1,800 a month.
The average starting Salary for a teacher in 2019 was €38,701. That's around €2,600 a month after tax. Very few 24 year olds are renting their own apartment. If they took the house share they'd have around €430 a week after tax and accommodation costs.
The average gross salaries for primary teachers in Ireland in 2019 and 2020 was €58,975 – the fourth highest in the EU – ranging from teachers aged 25-34 earning €49,529 on average to those aged 55-64 earing €73,747.
House share usually €800. We have a chronic shortage of teachers in urban areas. The exodus will continue until there are affordable accommodation options within a reasonable commute to city schools. When little Zac or Sophie doesn't have a qualified teacher in their classroom then we have a serious problem.
I agree that there is a serious problem with the supply of qualified teachers who want to actually work in the sector. An obvious first step is to actually apply the rules around career breaks and job sharing but yes, it's a real problem.
Trying to compile a hierarchy of essential workers is pointless. All are necessary for our cities to function properly.

Exactly, so who gets the free gaff?
 
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agree that there is a serious problem with the supply of qualified teachers who want to actually work in the sector. An obvious first step is to actually apply the rules around career breaks and job sharing but yes, it's a real problem.
The idea that restricting any of these schemes will actually improve the situation is ridiculous. Those refused career breaks will simply resign to go abroad, mainly to the Middle East where they can earn much more and have subsidised accommodation. Granting them a career break offers some hope they may return. Those who job share are generally doing so because of childcare or to care for a elderly parent. They are providing another essential service in doing this. Irish teachers are very much in demand internationally. We need to seriously consider how we will retain them where they are most needed, in our urban areas. No members of the profession expect a "free gaff" obviously.
 
We do, but we need water, power, food, waste removal and sewage more.

I stand corrected, they are not amongst the best paid graduates, teachers are the best paid graduates.

Irish Water employees. And why should we only help those who are privileged to be employed by the State?
sorry, the point is teachers are paid well as graduates but they aren't high paid workers overall, and they can't afford to buy in the cities if they were so well paid they wouldn't have this issue. Picking the point where they start earning is just arbitrary.
 
We do, but we need water, power, food, waste removal and sewage more.

I stand corrected, they are not amongst the best paid graduates, teachers are the best paid graduates.

Irish Water employees. And why should we only help those who are privileged to be employed by the State?
The reason it relates to those who are 'privileged' to be employed by the state is that everyone else is working for a private enterprise so what they get paid isn't really something the state can influence, except maybe by tax breaks.
 
Picking teachers is arbitrary, there are many others in the same plight who have less earning potential
I don't think anyone is suggesting that teachers are they only ones affected by this, but nonetheless they are affected and are voting with their feet by leaving the cities. We can rant on about how well paid they are but we now have a severe shortage in city schools which we need to address before it worsens.
 
Are you suggesting state employees are earning less? So much so that they are deserving of a hand-out? Or have the public sector unions failed miserably in achieving market pay for state employees?

I'm suggesting the comparisons are ridiculous and self-serving. The proposal is framed to try and address an acute problem in the Union's constituency and also to somewhat align with the dysfunctional nature of the way their employer delivers the service. It is not proposed because it the most optimal solution or that they see themselves as superior to other workers as suggested.

Comparing salaries, arguing about the hierarchy of importance and the "privilege" of being employed by the state (LOL!) is largely irrelevant. The 'market pay' in the public sector is more a reflection of the States ability to wield its power as the monopolistic employer in the relevant sector and historical sectoral factors (teaching and nursing being largely dominated by women etc.).
 
Kieran Christie, head of the ASTI, is calling for subsidised housing for key workers. This is not a new thing and other countries have allowances and supports for some sectors but what is a key worker?
The narrative is that it's teachers and nurses but there are other jobs that are far more important for the country to function. The people who keep the lights on, the water running, take our waste away and deliver food to the shops are the real key workers and are paid far less than teachers
I think the point about public servants is that they are paid the same no matter where they work in the country.

Food delivery workers I expect are paid far more in Dublin than in country towns.

The suggestion is that the state should pay differing amounts in differing areas, based on the additional difficulty in recruiting in certain areas.
 
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