Delays in rolling out vaccine

[Paul O Mahoney]

Same thing could happen here couldn't it?
Nothing whatsoever to suggest it had anything to do with the speed of rollout of the vaccine.

We seem to have to go slower here than elsewhere, citing safety is a red herring unless Paul Reid can cite specific corners being cut elsewhere that are not being cut here.

Never said it was associated with their roll out just saying it happened.
So safety isn't an issue for you, strange position to take, my mother in laws care home contacted my wife today to explain what exactly will be put in place in order to protect the "clients " and the staff during the time the vaccine will be administered its a long list and the HSE must have a fairly long list too.
Safety is paramount and as Colm Henry said this morning safety is the number 1 item to be considered above all else and that's why its being rolled out in hospitals first just in case there is an issue and it can be resolved and learnt from.
The manufacturers have said safety was the priority when developing the vaccine, 48 hrs isn't a huge amount of time to wait.

Another thing had the EU not brought forward the approval it would be next week before any roll could happen.

Can't understand why people are getting so annoyed by this .

 

[Laramie]

Listening to news at 9am this morning, seems that there is a fear of litigation here in Ireland.

So why wasn't the issue of consent sorted out months ago?

 

[Laramie]

Is it true that Ireland will only be administering the vaccine 5 days a week from 9 am until 5 pm?

 

[odyssey06]

Never said it was associated with their roll out just saying it happened.
So safety isn't an issue for you, strange position to take, my mother in laws care home contacted my wife today to explain what exactly will be put in place in order to protect the "clients " and the staff during the time the vaccine will be administered its a long list and the HSE must have a fairly long list too.
Safety is paramount and as Colm Henry said this morning safety is the number 1 item to be considered above all else and that's why its being rolled out in hospitals first just in case there is an issue and it can be resolved and learnt from.
The manufacturers have said safety was the priority when developing the vaccine, 48 hrs isn't a huge amount of time to wait.
Another thing had the EU not brought forward the approval it would be next week before any roll could happen.
Can't understand why people are getting so annoyed by this .

Not sure why the death in Israel was mentioned here on this thread then?
There was a clear implication from the context of how the death was raised that it somehow connected to the speed of rollout
Now it appears it was a total red herring though of course an individual tragedy.

A bit like the issue of 'safety' here explaining why we are slower than our peers when it comes to roll out.
Zero evidence has been presented that other EU countries have put safety at issue by rolling out vaccines quicker than we have.
Absolutely nothing, not a single shred of evidence or explanation or indication has been proferred as to why we have to be slower than our peers to be safe.

We're already falling behind after 2-3 days, the concern is this trend will be continued into the weeks and months ahead and we fall further and further behind in the vaccination schedule and leave vulnerable people needlessly exposed. Safety is paramount cuts both ways, every delay means people needlessly exposed to this virus.

 

[Laramie]

The manufacturers have said safety was the priority when developing the vaccine, 48 hrs isn't a huge amount of time to wait.

I notice that they are all using the word "safety" as an excuse for their delay in rolling out the vaccine. I was looking at EuroNews today and lots of countries on the ball vaccinating people. I am sure that they are doing it safely.

Now we are being told that it will take until the end of 2021 before we are all vaccinated. Last week we were told that it would be done by the end of May, then we were told by late summer.

 

[Prosper]

citing safety is a red herring unless Paul Reid can cite specific corners being cut elsewhere that are not being cut here.

Unreasonable to suggest he should do that. If he believes that others are moving too fast or cutting corners he's not going to say it (EU solidarity etc etc). I don't know why we're starting the vaccinations a couple of days later than some others but maybe it has to do with the fact that other countries have not kept the virus under control as well as we have here and so, because of the soaring cases and deaths they are under pressure to act quickly.

Listening to news at 9am this morning, seems that there is a fear of litigation here in Ireland.

I didn't hear the news this morning so I don't know what the nature of this fear of litigation is here. However, we have become a very litigious nation and the hysteria of many, especially in the media but also elsewhere, only contributes to this. I recall the awful disinformation during the Cervical Smear controversy, that ended up in the perception that a smear test should be virtually a diagnostic test (internationally it's accepted that there are about 30% false negatives/false positives). Then this inaccurate "perception" ended up with people thinking that a "false negative" meant that an actionable "mistake" had been made. Professional journalists were using the term "mistake" or "error" with regard to false negatives. Subsequently I think I'm right in saying that a judge ruled that test results should not be given unless there was effective certainty (I'm open to correction on this point). The HSE and the medical profession are petrified of legal actions costing many millions. Maybe this is also a factor in the couple of day delay here? What would be the case if people with certain underlying conditions started to become very ill or die due to a reaction to the vaccine? Would the lawyers be all over it? If the delay here is due to the authorities here closely monitoring reports from other countries for a couple of days then I for one would understand that. If there's a lot of people suffering side effects longer than a couple of days then that would be a real concern.

 

[Paul O Mahoney]

Not sure why the death in Israel was mentioned here on this thread then?
There was a clear implication from the context of how the death was raised that it somehow connected to the speed of rollout
Now it appears it was a total red herring though of course an individual tragedy.

A bit like the issue of 'safety' here explaining why we are slower than our peers when it comes to roll out.
Zero evidence has been presented that other EU countries have put safety at issue by rolling out vaccines quicker than we have.
Absolutely nothing, not a single shred of evidence or explanation or indication has been proferred as to why we have to be slower than our peers to be safe.

We're already falling behind after 2-3 days, the concern is this trend will be continued into the weeks and months ahead and we fall further and further behind in the vaccination schedule and leave vulnerable people needlessly exposed. Safety is paramount cuts both ways, every delay means people needlessly exposed to this virus.

Have we seen or heard of any other fatality?,we discussed in detail before the roll out that there were going to be issues and this is an example of one.
Safety does cut both ways and like the producing of the vaccines its the experts that we placed our faith in ,and with reason as they understand the situation much better than anyone debating here or elsewhere.

For the vaccine to be effective and for it to have a significant effect on the general population will take many months and 2/3 days isn't going to change that.

The UK approved the vaccine on a Wednesday and rolled out the following Monday/Tuesday, US likewise it took a few days I just don't understand why we need to follow a few countries who rolled out immediately its not a sport tournament.

We all know the issues we have in our health system and we also know that there are higher risks involved due to that fact.

I really am at a loss to understand why our strategy of roll out is causing so much angst, and saving more lives really isn't a valid one as we know preventing close contacts is more effective now than any vaccine.

 

[Paul O Mahoney]

I notice that they are all using the word "safety" as an excuse for their delay in rolling out the vaccine. I was looking at EuroNews today and lots of countries on the ball vaccinating people. I am sure that they are doing it safely.

Now we are being told that it will take until the end of 2021 before we are all vaccinated. Last week we were told that it would be done by the end of May, then we were told by late summer.

We don't need all of us to be vaccinated 70% plus would be a huge achievement and it should develop a fairly high herd immunity level.
Like everything else with the virus we simply don't know if 70% immunity will be enough to stem the spread of the virus.

The roll out of the vaccine and its effects will not be seen for months and that has been widely reported by all stakeholders, and if its the summer or autumn what difference does it make? the important thing here is that we have vaccines and they will over time eliminate the virus.

 

[Laramie]

The roll out of the vaccine and its effects will not be seen for months and that has been widely reported by all stakeholders, and if its the summer or autumn what difference does it make? the important thing here is that we have vaccines and they will over time eliminate the virus.

I can't believe that I am reading this. The countries businesses are on their knees. People are dying daily. We should be vaccinating all of our citizens as fast as we can, seven days a week and not waiting on the HSE to get it's act together. Something that should have been done months ago.

I read today that nursing homes are being scheduled for their vaccinations on the 11th January. Why not immediately?

 

[SlurrySlump]

Is it true that Ireland will only be administering the vaccine 5 days a week from 9 am until 5 pm?

I just get the feeling that because the Pfizer vaccine is a two dose vaccine, the HSE doesn't have the IT ability to track those vaccinated. I hope that all their delays are not down to them backing one of the one dose vaccines because they are easier to administer and keep track of.

 

[SlurrySlump]

I read today that nursing homes are being scheduled for their vaccinations on the 11th January. Why not immediately?

Another quote today says that nursing homes will not be fully vaccinated until the end of February. Is this a joke?

 

[Leper]

I can't believe that I am reading this. The countries businesses are on their knees. People are dying daily. We should be vaccinating all of our citizens as fast as we can, seven days a week and not waiting on the HSE to get it's act together. Something that should have been done months ago.

I read today that nursing homes are being scheduled for their vaccinations on the 11th January. Why not immediately?

1. A relatively small amount of the Pfizer Vaccine has been delivered to Ireland todate. Only the amount of people per vaccine unit available can receive it. If you have only 10,000 units of vaccine there is no point in having 25,000 in the initial queue.
2. Whoever gets the Pfizer Vaccine must receive a 2nd dose about a month or so later. Hence "fully vaccinated" taking some time.
3. Strict records must be kept and "Covid Vaccine Passports" must be issued. These are important documents and should not be treated like waste paper.
4. In the television news last night a doctor explained (a) The vaccine has only the lifespan of a few days once taken from deep-freeze and (b) Once ready to inject the lifespan reduces to a few hours. Therefore, amounts of people to be vaccinated must be policed and some decent order must be maintained.
5. In today's radio news a Cork doctor (CUH) informed that hospital staff dealing with Covid patients must be vaccinated first. I have no truck with this.
6. Next in line are the Care Homes. It's the elderly who are at most risk. I have no truck with this either. But, the process must be executed properly.
7. Yes Commercial interests are being delayed re the vaccine. The last thing Ireland Ltd needs is Collateral Damage. All in good time things will improve. Let's get this vaccination process done in a proper way.

 

[RedOnion]

Another quote today says that nursing homes will not be fully vaccinated until the end of February. Is this a joke?

No, it's not a joke.

There are 70,000 staff and residents. There has to be 3 weeks between first and 2nd shot. They need 140,000 vaccinations to do this.

Can we see your schedule of when it could be possible, based in the availability of the vaccine?

Now we are being told that it will take until the end of 2021 before we are all vaccinated. Last week we were told that it would be done by the end of May, then we were told by late summer.

Where was May referenced?
The EU is only scheduled to receive the last of their order from Pfizer in September, and that's only 200m doses. Yes, there are other vaccines, but one of them isn't expected to be authorised until July.


I think if we're going to have a sensible thread here, we need to separate what the HSE can and can't control.

 

[Paul O Mahoney]

I can't believe that I am reading this. The countries businesses are on their knees. People are dying daily. We should be vaccinating all of our citizens as fast as we can, seven days a week and not waiting on the HSE to get it's act together. Something that should have been done months ago.

I read today that nursing homes are being scheduled for their vaccinations on the 11th January. Why not immediately?

Whats so unbelievable? People will continue to die from Covid even with the vaccine.
The vaccine rollout for the first few months will primarily be elderly, healthcare workers and people with underlying health issues.

Are you willing to pay, via taxes,for all those extra hrs that you perceive are needed?

How can you plan for something that didn't exist "months ago" the vaccine we have didn't get approval until last week for our use.

The communication regarding care homes rollout I've seen is the 4th of January.
How do you suggest that the vaccine be rolled out to almost 600 care homes scattered throughout the country and do it in a safe and controlled way?

I too can't believe what I'm reading as it would appear that your needs or wishes seem to be more important that those of the rest of the country.

 

[Paul O Mahoney]

Another quote today says that nursing homes will not be fully vaccinated until the end of February. Is this a joke?

How is it a joke? approximately 600 homes with thousands of staff, not to mention we have 10,000 doses now which will be used up by nurses and doctors who have given everything to help contain this virus since last March , some even their lives.

 

[Paul O Mahoney]

I just get the feeling that because the Pfizer vaccine is a two dose vaccine, the HSE doesn't have the IT ability to track those vaccinated. I hope that all their delays are not down to them backing one of the one dose vaccines because they are easier to administer and keep track of.

Every vaccine will require 2 doses to achieve the stated efficiency levels right now.
What vaccine has one dose?

 

[tomdublin]

Looks like it will be Monday to Friday 9-5. After the initial public outcry has subsided its likely that noone will face any consequences as per usual. It's depressing.

 

[joe sod]

So why wasn't the issue of consent sorted out months ago?

maybe they believed all the "experts" who were saying that a vaccine was years away. Its interesting though that Tony Holohan has barely discussed the vaccine and when probed by media was anything but positive.
The government could sort out the consent issue with emergency legislation anyway, afterall they have exercised enormous powers since the start of the pandemic forcing businesses to close and they never got bogged down in "consent" or legalities with that.

 

[Leper]

On the issue of "consent" we live in Ireland not the Peoples Republic of China. While I want the vaccine asap, I respect the right of those who don't. But, please, let them not get in the way of those who want the vaccine.

 

[Paul O Mahoney]

maybe they believed all the "experts" who were saying that a vaccine was years away. Its interesting though that Tony Holohan has barely discussed the vaccine and when probed by media was anything but positive.
The government could sort out the consent issue with emergency legislation anyway, afterall they have exercised enormous powers since the start of the pandemic forcing businesses to close and they never got bogged down in "consent" or legalities with that.

You advocate taking away personal rights by legislating?
People have a right to not get the vaccines.