DCC buyout - Solictor needed

seforin

Registered User
Messages
6
Hi there,

I'm in the process of buying out the DCC for 100% mortgage but need to have a solictor involved.

Could anyone advise on a good solicitor but at a cheap price

Regards,
Seforin
 

Society

Registered User
Messages
202
Anyone know if it is possible to buyout the Clawback on an affordable dwelling (loan with Council) by remortgaging? Was told a few years ago that the property would have to be sold. At that stage the dwelling was worth what I paid for it. There was talk of new legislation being introduced to allow remortgaging. Surely with rising property prices Councils could start being more amenable to the idea? Anyone have any success ?
 
Z

zen

Guest
@Society
No, is the answer in short. With AH you are joined at the hip to the councils for the 25 year duration of the mortgage. You can however redeem the loan in full but that would just mean you have no mortgage but you are STILL tied to the council for 25 years (incase the value goes up and you make a profit by selling), there is no getting away from them other than SELLING your home so what you were told on this is true.
If there are any changes to legislation by influence of the council rest assured they will not benefit you.

@Seforin
So you are in the process of "Re-mortgaging" your AH...I assume with a private lender? How are you in the process without a solicitor? Are the council now allowing this?

May I ask why out of curiosity?

Any solicitor I spoke with just couldn't get their head around the scheme and just didn't want any part of trying to understand it. Perhaps go back to the solicitor that was used when originally buying the unit?

I tried to do this in an attempt to rid myself of DCC from my life until I discovered that even if I did re-mortgage (which was excrutiatingly painful to get any assistance or anwer from DCC) I discovered 2 things,
1-No it wasn't possible due to the clawback on the title deeds.
2-That even if I could, I would still be "bound" by the original contract to DCC for 25 years..... so there was no point! Make sure you understand this before embarking on this road. Be sure that if you do remortgage that DCC are GONE!

To rid the councils from the deeds and your life you must SELL (at a loss in most cases)
To fully OWN your AH you must complete the 25 year agreement

p.s. There is always talk of new legislation. I would only entertain any remortgaging if the original lender took some of the hit on the loss of value AND they severed any connection with me or the asset after doing so. Dont forget, the councils valued the houses at the original prices and its the councils who are now who are saying they have lost 50% of the value, not us.
 

Brooklyn

Registered User
Messages
417
I remortgaged my AH several years ago. Still with DCC but went from shared ownership to 100% mortgage. I opted to remain with DCC rather than a private lender because the banks are a little more unpredictable about raising interest rates. This actually ended up being a good move because I then had a severe income drop and it was easier to negotiate with DCC over my repayments than I think it would have been with a bank. OP I will PM you the name of the solicitor I used for the remortgage if you change your settings to allow PMs!
 
Z

zen

Guest
Hello Brooklyn

I was always 100% annuity believing I was 100% owner as told by the solicitor and DCC.

DCC told me that the only way possible to lease would be to remortgage with a private lender, they damn well knew this was impossible it was just another loop in the meat mincer they were sending me through.

The reason I wanted to remortgage with a private lender was so I could lease out my place so the 5 of us could leave the one bedroom apartment and lease somewhere bigger. Also to get a better deal on the mortgage insurance which is outrageous. What was your reason?


Despite that, I tried anyway....

When I tried I discovered the bank would not take over the loan due to the clawback entity on the deeds, the bank said get that removed and we'll take over the loan but the council would not remove the clawback unless the loan was fully redeemed...., so chicken and egg as I said before.

It was only after I wasted my time looking into what the OP is trying to do that I discovered I would still be bound to DCC for the remainder of the mortgage term. It had not really been a case of what they were telling us, rather what they deliberatly were not telling us. These AH contracts were signed under undue influence.

So my question to yourself and the OP is;

"What are your reasons to remortgage 100%, but escpecially while remaining with DCC"?

You will not own your property if you go 100% with DCC, this seems like absolute waste of time as the interest rates are variable and the rent rates are arbitrary.

Brendan, the site moderator concluded that it made no difference, its a misnomer, you already have a full ownership anyway....your just paying for it differently, at least that was my interpretation.

If its to control the rental portion then thats not going to be a big issue when the ECB jack up the interest rates, at this point the Russian rates shot up 15% in only 2 weeks........

I'm eager to know why anyone would want to remortgage to 100% AND REMAIN WITH DCC?
 

Brooklyn

Registered User
Messages
417
I remortgaged because I needed my monthly repayments to go down - which they did, significantly - and the option to rent out a bedroom without having to ask the Council's permission.

I explained why I stayed with DCC in my earlier post.
 
Z

zen

Guest
wow

let me get this right in my head...

You can’t even rent a ROOM under Shared Ownership either!!!!?? OMG! You need permission! So, I assume Brooklyn, that you DIDNT get permission and was the main reason you HAD to go 100% annuity?



That wasn't explained in your earlier post....and that’s news to me!



Also you said you "opted" to remain with DCC alluding to that fact that you had a choice in the matter which, as I said, in my experience, it wasn't an option. How was this option orchestrated with the council?

Did you actually turn down the option to go fully private which would have allowed you to;

  • 1. move the ludacris Mortgage Protection (a policy that nobody got a copy of the day of signing)
  • 2. Grant you FULL rights and TRUE OWNERSHIP to rent a room or lease it out entirely without anyone’s permission?
In other words, you chose to go through all that work, to find a solicitor, to NOT fully “OWN” your home just so you could save on the short term by getting permission to rent a room to assist with the mortgage payments!


Brooklyn, you could have and should have benefitted far greater had you not opted to remain with DCC, whats more, I may be wrong but I don’t think that’s what the OP had in mind…


There is no ambiguity in what the OP stated, and I quote "I'm in the process of buying OUT the DCC for 100% mortgage". Which is what I attempted to do, and NOT what you actually did.



I apologise, I'm being pedantic I know, but I dont belive you ever had any option to move the loan which would fully sever any link with DCC. Something which I tried so hard to do so to hear someone just say they decided to remain with DCC makes me very weiry.


You do realise if there is (heaven forbid) another change in your life situation that you can NEVER leave that place unless you SELL (at a huge loss). Which is not even a choice. Even if you could, by fully redeeming the loan in full still does not give you explicit full ownership either as I said, you are still bound to the councils for the mortgage duration as stipulated in the contract and thus their incomprehensible and unnegotiable obtuse rules.


Going Full 100 Annuity is a waste of time in the long run. It may be ok in the short term if you are content with what you have but times can and do change.



So my advice to anyone on the AH scheme


If you are about to embark on any change SEEK TRUE OWNERSHIP and not this PSEUDO MILARKY.

DO NOT "OPT" to remain with the councils (if it is an option and financially possible), take the loan from the councils, get away from them if you can. Get legal advice, get represented, truely own your own home.



I know this as I am 100% Annuity and I've been up and down this road many times over.
 

Society

Registered User
Messages
202
Zen, why not write to the council for permission to rent it out or have you already tried this?
 
Z

zen

Guest
hello Society, asking 8 years and answer is still no. Im on mortgage strike 2 years now.
 

Brooklyn

Registered User
Messages
417
In other words, you chose to go through all that work, to find a solicitor, to NOT fully “OWN” your home just so you could save on the short term by getting permission to rent a room to assist with the mortgage payments!

No, that's not what I said. The rent a room thing was only part of it (and not even the most important part).

I apologise, I'm being pedantic I know, but I dont belive you ever had any option to move the loan which would fully sever any link with DCC.

Yes, I have the option to remortgage with a bank if I choose to. At the moment, I don't, but this may change in the future.

Please don't assume your personal circumstances are applicable to everyone else.
 

skipper1978

Registered User
Messages
14
The rules seem to be different for Fingal than for DCC. (This is definitely the case for the permission to rent for example) I am currently renting my apartment with permission from Fingal. I also bought out the shared ownership part a coupe of years ago. At this point I had to sign papers at final redemption so that everything was legal etc.

I am not sure how the council can still have a claim to anything once the mortgage has been fully paid and cleared?? At this point I would of assumed that the transfer of deeds would be to the owner?

@Seforin I hope that everything works out well for you.

@ Zen, sorry to hear your situation. It would seem that DCC have had and still have an awful approach to the AH/Shared Ownership from reading posts on here and other internet forums.
 

Society

Registered User
Messages
202
Skipper1978 what were the conditions the council put on you? Did they extend the clawback and do you have to renew the request for permission annually?
 
Z

zen

Guest
@Brooklyn:- I'm sure lots of people would be exceptionally gratful if you be willing to part with your info and start a thread giving an overview of this revelation with details of how to go about it, when it all changed and what to expect.

Like do they have an info pack we could ask for? Is it on a website?

The OP seems to have abandoned the thread but I have been told over an 8 year period its not possible to move the loan privately due to the clawback on the deeds.

@skipper. Fair play, I appreciate the understanding and compassion. Its back to the drawing board!
 

skipper1978

Registered User
Messages
14
Hi Society. I had already bought out the shared ownership part from Fingal a couple of years ago. Then later on I wrote to Fingal explaining my circumstances and situation had changed and requested permission to rent out my apartment. The permission was for 2 years and the clawback goes on hold for every year I do not live in the apartment so yes it is an extension as such. Only conditions were that I obviously keep up the mortgage payments, register with PRTB which I have done and that the mortgage interest relief is gone.

@Zen I am very interested to find out more relating to the council still having entitlements even after the mortgage is fully paid? (If paid off earlier than the 25 years) Did you get something in writing and I wonder is this DCC specific?
 

Society

Registered User
Messages
202
Skipper1978, that's interesting, what happens though after the two years is up do you apply again for permission?
 

Brooklyn

Registered User
Messages
417
The OP seems to have abandoned the thread but I have been told over an 8 year period its not possible to move the loan privately due to the clawback on the deeds.

It's always been possible to move the loan privately if you could repay the clawback. The law was amended in 2009 to allow the clawback rank in second place behind the new mortgage, to allow all owners to remortgage privately. However, I see from the Irish Statute Book that that section of the law has not yet come into effect. Might be worth asking your TD to put a question to the Minister about this, if it's an issue for you (as I said it isn't for me at the moment). It's the Housing (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 2009, Section 88(5).
 

skipper1978

Registered User
Messages
14
@ Brooklyn. The part I can not seem to understand is how is the clawback tracked if someone is to pay off their mortgage ahead of schedule. So lets say for example Alan has a house purchased through AH scheme. Tomorrow Alan pays off the remainder of his affordable housing mortgage in full. He is not selling but just happens to have saved enough money/come into money (Whatever Reason) to do this. There are meant to be another 8 years left on the mortgage. At this point when Alan fully pays the remainder of the mortgage off is the house not completely Alans? He has no intention of selling but just wants to be mortgage free so clawback would not apply. Then fast forward 3 years and Alan wants to sell. At this point how would clawback be applied?
 

Tired Paul

Registered User
Messages
262
I've mentioned this before in other threads - no single council has a clue how to handle the whole AH scheme. Each council seem to make up their rules. To this end I was successful in getting out of my AH houseing contract 2 years ago and we sold our house without the penalty of the clawback. We should have paid back a considerble sum but because the council could not agree a clawback figure and our solicitor was like a dog with a bone in that he wanted answers, proper answers they threw back figure of €12k ( or thereabouts can't remember excatly now). We were unsure at first but taking our solicitors advice we settled, sold our house privately and have not looked back since.
Problem is becasue the legislation is till up in the air no one council is will make a stand.
 

skipper1978

Registered User
Messages
14
I've mentioned this before in other threads - no single council has a clue how to handle the whole AH scheme. Each council seem to make up their rules. To this end I was successful in getting out of my AH houseing contract 2 years ago and we sold our house without the penalty of the clawback. We should have paid back a considerble sum but because the council could not agree a clawback figure and our solicitor was like a dog with a bone in that he wanted answers, proper answers they threw back figure of €12k ( or thereabouts can't remember excatly now). We were unsure at first but taking our solicitors advice we settled, sold our house privately and have not looked back since.
Problem is becasue the legislation is till up in the air no one council is will make a stand.

Hi Tired Paul, your story seems to sum up the whole situation!! Nobody seems to have absolute clarity on all points. What council was your mortgage with?
 
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