Wars; when rich old men send poor young men out to kill each other. They are fount over resources and historically the people fighting have no ownership of or control over those resources. Sometimes religion or dogma enters the mix. Those are the worst kind of wars.
Crisis in Ukraine
- Thread starter cremeegg
- Start date
One of the strengths of democracy over authoritarianism is that truth gets to power and that the people in power are not shielded from the truth and their populace. This is being borne out now with Russia's war, putin is being shielded from the truth and the reality on the ground in ukraine. His subordinates tell him nice fairy tales about the situation and that the ridiculous objectives are being met. This was hilariously exposed by Jared Kushner in their meeting with Putin last month. Putin said again that Russia will achieve its objectives and seize the whole Donetsk region over the next few months. Kushner replied "With respect Sir, you told us that last year"
Putin is not used to being confronted with harsh reality even from lackeys.
Putin is not used to being confronted with harsh reality even from lackeys.
Sister Sara
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In my view there is no democracy or truth in international conflict. I listened to the Zelensky speech at UN last week. I was alarmed at some of the things he mentioned, most notably that some citizens of 47 countries are participating on the Russian side.
I knew about North Korea, but never heard anything of "Ghana, Nepal, Tajikistan, India, Yemen, Kenya, Zimbabwe, Cuba, Belarus, Sudan, South Africa, and many, many others."
Zelensky made a plea to these countries to prevent their citizens partaking in combat for Russia. He says they were recruited by deception.
One theory I've heard since is that these countries are emptying their over-crowded prison cells : Russia wants you to fight, if you survive you will receive Russia citizenship. If this is true this amounts to nothing less that State facilitated human traffiking and exploitation on an industrial scale.
How come we don't know anything about this? Why is the media silent on what Zelensky has claimed about the citizens of 47 countries combatting for Russia?
Our leaders are silent. The media is silent.
Its well known that they have recruited from some of those countries , many were duped into going to Russia for work and then signed documents in russian which they did not understand enlisting for the war in Ukraine. For some reason many Indian people have gone ,there is alot of pro russian propaganda in the indian media and establishment. Didn't Modi host Putin in India a few weeks ago giving him badly needed international credibility.
Large Countries have always used mercenaries and auxiliary forces in their wars. Up to one third of the British forces fighting in America during their War of Independence were German Auxiliaries. 10% of the British Armed forces are non British Citizens. During the Second World War that was 30-35%.
That's been covered regularly in the media, they've been openly advertising for recruits on the web.
There are echoes here of an old Thread on Russian Foreign Policy in which some Posters were convinced that Russia was no threat to our national security and that the War in Ukraine was not part of a broader strategy by Russia. I think those ideas have been put to bed in the last few years.
Sister Sara
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I stand corrected. Russia: Recruitment of foreign nationals to fight in Ukraine amounts to human trafficking
I'm surprised a lot more is not made of this. I was familiar with the forced conscriptions in Ukraine but not the extent of Russia's recruitment.
The debasement of humanity has no limits in war.
I'm surprised a lot more is not made of this. I was familiar with the forced conscriptions in Ukraine but not the extent of Russia's recruitment.
The debasement of humanity has no limits in war.
We don't care about the 300,000 or so child soldiers, 100,000 of whom are in Africa, so why would we care about adults being trafficked into the Russian Army? The Americans aren't doing it and there are no Jews involved so the left in Ireland don't care.
Sister Sara
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I think this is very simplistic thinking.
Surely you meant the Left and the Right? I don't know why these matters seem to boil down to left/right politics. These are humanitarian issues and people on the left and the right most certainly do care.
Palestine features more prominently insofar that it is a conflict that has been waging for 80yrs with no resolution in sight. It has/had the effect of spilling out into the greater Middle East region and that can have serious consequences on energy supplys. It is also the epicentre of Christianity, Islam and Judasim. I'm not a practicing Catholic but I try to abide Christian values as set out by Our Lord and Saviour, Jeepers* Christ. Himself, a Jew.
So Palestine is as much my Holy Land as it is anybodys and I can claim direct lineage to that land through my following of Jeepers* Christ. I am quite in favour of the Jewish people having a homeland in Palestine, or Israel. I'm just utterly opposed to the manner in which they are taking other peoples homelands, aided by Western governments. As I live in 'the West', I see good cause to bring pressure on these governments to act against the tyranny that they are more than capable of stopping.
Ukraine features prominently in the news on a daily basis, yet I do think there is a dearth of information for some reason. If the West were as complicit with aiding Russia in their illegal invasion of Ukraine I would be as critical of them as I am with their involvement with Israel.
*the correct word is being blocked out.
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No, the far right don't care about Palestinians or child soldiers. We don't have a traditional Right in Ireland as all our main parties are left wing.
Russia has struck two passenger buses in Ukraine, killing 30 civilians. This is surely (another) war crime?
www.theguardian.com
Russian attack on two buses kills 30 near Ukraine frontline
Authorities say 18 people also wounded after incident in Kramatorsk in country’s ‘fortess belt’
www.theguardian.com
Not as bad as blowing up a school full of little girls but bad all the same.
Not a chance. If you want people with guns to be held to account you need more guns than they have. We have no guns so we don't matter.
Sister Sara
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At the end of the day it would appear to me anyway that some form of compromise will have to be achieved. I definitely think the EU,UK and US are in the "drain Russia's morale, resources, to topple Tupin" mode - that's just my impression.
Putin appears to me to be upping the ante incrementally and it smacks to me somewhat of desparation. Which is very dangerous in my opinion.
I think we all need to pull back before it gets worse.
I don't know what the compromise could look like but a ceasefire is priority at this point.
Putin appears to me to be upping the ante incrementally and it smacks to me somewhat of desparation. Which is very dangerous in my opinion.
I think we all need to pull back before it gets worse.
I don't know what the compromise could look like but a ceasefire is priority at this point.
JoeRoberts
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Ukraine is not going to gain anything by attacking Russian cities as they have done recently only bring on these attacks. Better to use its resources to defend it self.
Achieving anything close to 100% defence is an impossibility. They and multiple international defence suppliers are dedicating vast sums on enhanced drone defence technology, yet are only stopping 30% of jet powered drones. If you limit the powers of the victims of attack to merely defending against further attack, you are enabling the aggressor.
JoeRoberts
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Not if they are depleting the Russian war economy.