Key Post Capital Gains Tax on sale of shares

jodonova

New Member
Messages
9
Yes, you pay no CGT in 2015 and you carry no loss in 2016.


Just to check - if this is/was a trading operation to generate an income rather than a capital investment (given the number of trades) this may be viewed as income tax chargeable?
Thanks Rob - not quite sure what you mean by trading operation - I was just trading crypto as an individual, if that's what you mean?
 
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jacques28

New Member
Messages
1
I bought shares in a company just a couple of weeks ago and am now sitting on a loss . I'm wondering If you sell the shares after such a brief period are they still eligible to offset future capital gains?

I have only had them for the 2 weeks. I have read threads on this site about a 4 week rule regarding the disposal of shares which I found confusing.

I have no intention of buying the same stock in future and would sell all of them now and be done with it. Does anyone know if selling before 4 weeks would rule out capital loss offsetting?
 

jodonova

New Member
Messages
9
Trading is the key here. You weren't 'investing'. It falls under a different tax head; income tax rather than CGT.
You need to get a professional tax advisor to look at the specific facts of your case.
Thanks RedOnion.

Can anybody recommend any good crypto tax return software that revenue would accept, for example https://koinly.io/ or any good accountants? If accountants, how much should I expect to pay? I need to complete my Form 11 returns and document some losses for 2018/19.
 

boltownes

Registered User
Messages
48
Hi, I sold some shares yesterday and made a gain. I am due capital gains tax on sale but wonder can i sell loss making shares to offset the gain and if so, when is the deadline for doing so? Many thanks in advance.
 

Gordon Gekko

Frequent Poster
Messages
4,549
The tax for gains made during the period January to November inclusive is due by 15 December.

If you make a loss during the same period, or have losses carried forward from previous years or know you’ll make a loss in December, you don’t have to pay.
 

boltownes

Registered User
Messages
48
The tax for gains made during the period January to November inclusive is due by 15 December.

If you make a loss during the same period, or have losses carried forward from previous years or know you’ll make a loss in December, you don’t have to pay.
Thank you very much for this!
 

Felics

Registered User
Messages
1
Hi, Regarding the 4 week rule - it refers to a loss on disposal - am I correct in assuming that the gain or loss is calculated against the shares acquired within the 4 week (whether acquired before or after the sale)?
Many thanks for help on this.
 

mojoask

Frequent Poster
Messages
130
Hi folks, I've an unrealised loss on share A, and want to see if it makes sense to crystalise it, to use against gains on Share B this year. Share B total potential gain is €3,570 at time of writing.

From what I've read, to also make use the annual tax free exemption, I should sell €2,300 (€3,570-€1,270) of Share A, and €3,570 of Share B, which would leave me with €0 gain / CGT liability, correct?

If I want to repurchase Share A on the basis that I may eventually recoup my investment, I can do this after 4 weeks have elapsed, is that also correct?
 

jpd

Frequent Poster
Messages
2,017
I presume you mean sell the number of shares of Share A that will generate a loss of € 2,300 (and not € 2,300 worth of share A) and the Share B to generate a gain of € 3,750

If you sell Share A you do not have to wait to 4 weeks to buy them back
 

mojoask

Frequent Poster
Messages
130
I presume you mean sell the number of shares of Share A that will generate a loss of € 2,300 (and not € 2,300 worth of share A) and the Share B to generate a gain of € 3,750

If you sell Share A you do not have to wait to 4 weeks to buy them back
Yes that's correct, much better worded on your part than mine!
Re: buying them back, I understood that I couldn't use the loss on Share A against the gain on Share B, if I repurchased them within 4 weeks?
 

ride on

New Member
Messages
3
Just to check, do payments and returns for CGT have to be done on paper or can it be done online?,and if so where can I download forms?

Thanks in advance,
 

javiercarrillo

New Member
Messages
5
Hi everyone - I have a question as a total noob in CGT.

My US employer has a share schema: I was awarded a certain number which vest over time (when vesting, some are withheld for tax purposes).

For example:
2018: I was awarded 1000 shares at 90 USD each
2019: shares vested. At vesting, 400 shared were withheld (for income tax, USC, etc.) and I got to keep 600 shares at 100 USD each (so my account value at that moment is 60 000 USD)
2020: if I sell the 600 shares at 300 USD each (=180 000 USD). Let's assume no cost of sale/fee from broker.

According to this https://www.revenue.ie/en/tax-professionals/tdm/share-schemes/chapter-02.pdf, I have to pay CGT on the sale. However, what is the taxable amount for CGT in this case? (from which then I have to detract the exemption and then apply the CGT %)

Is it simply the total of sale minus the "value" of the 600 shares I got to keep after vesting: 180 000 - 60 000 = 120 000 USD? Or do I have to consider the value of the total number of shares that vested (as in, the 1000 at 90USD = 90 000, including the ones that were withheld).

I ask because most examples talk about people buying and then selling shares (so there's a clear cost of acquisition and cost of sale). In my case, what would be the cost of acquisition I should consider?

Thanks a lot for any guidance!
 
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Jimmy85

Registered User
Messages
14
Hi everyone - I have a question as a total noob in CGT.

My US employer has a share schema: I was awarded a certain number which vest over time (when vesting, some are withheld for tax purposes).

For example:
2018: I was awarded 1000 shares at 90 USD each
2019: shares vested. At vesting, 400 shared were withheld (for income tax, USC, etc.) and I got to keep 600 shares at 100 USD each (so my account value at that moment is 60 000 USD)
2020: if I sell the 600 shares at 300 USD each (=180 000 USD). Let's assume no cost of sale/fee from broker.

According to this https://www.revenue.ie/en/tax-professionals/tdm/share-schemes/chapter-02.pdf, I have to pay CGT on the sale. However, what is the taxable amount for CGT in this case? (from which then I have to detract the exemption and then apply the CGT %)

Is it simply the total of sale minus the "value" of the 600 shares I got to keep after vesting: 180 000 - 60 000 = 120 000 USD? Or do I have to consider the value of the total number of shares that vested (as in, the 1000 at 90USD = 90 000, including the ones that were withheld).

I ask because most examples talk about people buying and then selling shares (so there's a clear cost of acquisition and cost of sale). In my case, what would be the cost of acquisition I should consider?

Thanks a lot for any guidance!
Sounds like you have RSU's from your employer. The taxable amount is $120,000 ($200 Gain per share)

My understanding is that CGT is due on the gain of the 600 shares here and not on the balance of shares that were held for Income Tax, PRSI, USC.

The proceeds from your sale were (disp)$300 less (acqu)$100 x 600. That was your trade that you received direct proceeds from and the liability falls on you for taxation, the sale of the 400 shares was by the employer, they withheld them at vesting and they sold them to cover taxation as the liability for that trade falls on them.

If you're unsure, log onto revenue myaccount and submit an enquiry, you can submit specific CGT enquiries and they will get back to you in about 3-5 days.

J
 

mojoask

Frequent Poster
Messages
130
Sounds like you have RSU's from your employer. The taxable amount is $120,000 ($200 Gain per share)

My understanding is that CGT is due on the gain of the 600 shares here and not on the balance of shares that were held for Income Tax, PRSI, USC.

The proceeds from your sale were (disp)$300 less (acqu)$100 x 600. That was your trade that you received direct proceeds from and the liability falls on you for taxation, the sale of the 400 shares was by the employer, they withheld them at vesting and they sold them to cover taxation as the liability for that trade falls on them.

If you're unsure, log onto revenue myaccount and submit an enquiry, you can submit specific CGT enquiries and they will get back to you in about 3-5 days.

J
If you are getting RSUs, I can confirm it works as Jimmy85 states. CGT on the gain on the balance of the shares received, at their vesting value. I'll mention as you say you're new to this game, you have an annual tax free exemption of the first 1270 EUR of any gain (every little helps).
 

javiercarrillo

New Member
Messages
5
Hi everyone, a (hopefully!) final question... I was preparing my CG1 form and only now I realize that all Revenue offices are closed. Where am I supposed to post this form? Do you know if there is any address that is still working to send paper forms to?

Thanks!
 
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