Bike warranty

C

cremeegg

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My bike recently developed a crack in the frame. The bike shop where I bought the bike has closed down since my purchase.

I contacted the current Irish dealers for the Swiss manufacturers, who passed on my warranty claim.

The manufacturers have rejected the claim on the basis that the crack must have been caused by an impact and is not due to the material degrading.

I am not happy with this. It is impossible to say how the crack started, they have only seen pictures. Of course I cannot prove how the crack started, but I am not happy to accept their convenient view that it was due to an impact.

Further even if it was caused by a crack surely to be fit for use a bike should be able to withstand minor impacts. For sure no one went at it with a hammer.

Any suggestions how I might take this further would be very welcome.
 
What material is the Frame? Aluminium, Steel or Carbon?
I'd suggest contacting a local dealer for the brand and asking them what their view of the crack is and how they suggest you proceed.
I'd advise against riding it in the meantime in case it isn't structurally safe.
 
As above. Just to be clear though, your contract was with the retailer you bought from, not with the manufacturer. That said if there a bike review forums out there, a mention might produce some good will ...
 
VoiceofReason said:
What material is the Frame? Aluminium, Steel or Carbon?
I'd suggest contacting a local dealer for the brand and asking them what their view of the crack is and how they suggest you proceed.
I'd advise against riding it in the meantime in case it isn't structurally safe.
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Thanks for the reply, the frame is Carbon. I have contacted a dealer, I think they are the only one in Ireland, and they passed the query on to the manufacturer.
 
mathepac said:
As above. Just to be clear though, your contract was with the retailer you bought from, not with the manufacturer.
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Are you sure about that. The warranty is from the manufacturer, Unfortunately the bike shop I bought it from has closed down since.

mathepac said:
That said if there a bike review forums out there, a mention might produce some good will ...
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That should be worth a try. Can you suggest any in particular ?
 
The European Small Claims procedure is likely your best bet. Your contract under Irish law is with the shop where you purchased it, so that avenue is no longer open to you. You could also try posting to their social media accounts, that can often yield results.
 
Are you sure about that. The warranty is from the manufacturer, Unfortunately the bike shop I bought it from has closed down since
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Absolutely positive.

The circumstances you describe are some of the few times it might be worthwhile registering the product with the manufacturer at the time of purchase BUT you still have no legally enforceable contract with them. Do they have an Irish distributor who might negotiate or produce some good will for you?
That should be worth a try. Can you suggest any in particular ?
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Unfortunaltely not as I am not a bicyclist, although there are a few registered here.
 
Responses like that, post to their social media page" really get up my back, it smacks a form of blackmail.

No company wants negative feed back to their Social Media account, yet people search this out when making an informed decision. Coming from a Medium sizes company, we cant afford bad publicity, and have often had to take a frivolous claim on the chin just to avoid the inevitable drama which would follow, as like the Insurance Company's, "Pay up irregardless, ie, cheaper than going to court approach" we will end up paying in the long run.

You, me, nor the man in the moon knows how the crack in the frame happened at this moment, a "minor impact" to you, could be a hell of an impact to someone else. This should be identified first before posting to their account, and if proved to be of poor quality, then seek reimbursement for the product, and costs associated with proving it.
 
Anti-consumer stance is startling. The consumer is left hung out to dry when a small business closed, why should he not be allowed to post his experience about the product in question? Is it part of my deal with say Apple, that I can't complain publicly about their product, lack of after sales service, maintenance or follow-up if one of their dealerships closes down?

Very disappointed with your anti-consumer stance @LS400 it smacks of the old "Oh you bought that in the sale" or "That was second-hand" or other ducking and diving tactics vendors still try to employ here to the detriment of Sean & Sheila citizen.
 
mathepac said:
Absolutely positive.

The circumstances you describe are some of the few times it might be worthwhile registering the product with the manufacturer at the time of purchase BUT you still have no legally enforceable contract with them.
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That is not strictly correct. A manufacturer warranty, or guarantee is legally binding, and enforceable through courts if necessary. A warranty in in addition to your statutory rights which provide more protection in most cases.
 
Why is it anti consumer, you are posting a negative feed back without knowing the facts. If it were proved the crack happened from misuse, would it still be fair to leave a negative post?
 
Leo said:
The European Small Claims procedure is likely your best bet. Your contract under Irish law is with the shop where you purchased it, so that avenue is no longer open to you. You could also try posting to their social media accounts, that can often yield results.
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Do you know if this procedure includes Switzerland. The courts.ie website does not list the countries covered.
 
LS400 said:
Why is it anti consumer, you are posting a negative feed back without knowing the facts. If it were proved the crack happened from misuse, would it still be fair to leave a negative post?
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I'm not posting anything, I suggested avenues the consumer might explore to remedy his situation with the broken bike. Your post is anti-consumer because your suggestion is the consumer cannot post his presumably honest experiences with the product. You're playing the victim role here, "poor vendor / retailer, always hard done by".
 
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LS400 said:
You, me, nor the man in the moon knows how the crack in the frame happened at this moment, a "minor impact" to you, could be a hell of an impact to someone else. This should be identified first before posting to their account, and if proved to be of poor quality, then seek reimbursement for the product, and costs associated with proving it.
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I sent photos to the manufacturer through the dealer and they came back with

"they have come back this morning having assessed your claim, the damage is deemed to have been caused by an impact or knock of some description and as such not covered under the warranty I am afraid."

This reminds me of the immortal words of Christine Keeler "Well he would say that wouldn't he"

I don't know how they can tell from a photo how the damage was caused, and even if it were caused by "an impact or knock of some description" would that not be normal usage on a bike. It is frustrating not knowing how to move the thing on from here. I will have to consider the European small claims procedure, if that covers Switzerland.

I posted this comment with the photo on their Facebook page.

"Hi guys, I have a crack in my frame, just wondering if it is dangerous to ride."
 
But the retailer is a victim, if they get unwarranted bad publicity. Your finding them guilty first without even knowing the circumstances. Sure these are the big guys, they can afford to take a hit if I shout loudly enough, they wont want the bad publicity, sure what have ye to loose--- Nothing.
 
If this were my bike, and no doubt cost a lot of bucks being of Carbon Fiber, I would engage a metallurgist to form an opinion on the likely cause of the damage. I dont know how much this would cost, but would investigate it.
I agree, a photo will give very little information, and this is probably their tact, deny and wait until you raise the bar.

With this in hand and if proved to be of poor quality, then sure, post all you like, and seek recovery by any means necessary. I certainly would. Its the running screaming at the retailer before knowing the facts that irk me.

As an aside to an earlier comment about Apple etc, my sister works in a phone/computer shop, and its not unusual to have people coming ranting and raving about this new crap Apple product they just bought, it wont do this and that etc, when along they just didn't take the time to look at the manual, a quick demo and they're off happy as Larry..
 
'If this were my bike, and no doubt cost a lot of bucks being of Carbon Fiber, I would engage a metallurgist to form an opinion on the likely cause of the damage. I dont know how much this would cost, but would investigate it.'

Carbon fibre isn't a metal so this would not achieve anything. I would suggest that posting on the cycling forum on Boards.ie will provide the best opportunity to receive practical advice from posters who will have seen and/or experienced similar damage on Carbon Fibre frames. In general my understanding is that after a crash or impact an x-ray or scan of the frame can be required to establish if it is safe to ride or needs to be replaced.
 
mathepac said:
@RedOnion Through the Swiss courts? The Irish courts? Please explain.
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Note - consumer law isn't my area, but this is my understanding. I usually bow to your superior knowledge on consumer rights, so happy to be told if I've got this one wrong.

Applicable laws and covered territories should be stated in the warranty. I'm not sure of the process here since Switzerland is not an EU member state (although they usually adopt the law if the country of the consumer to keep everyone happy with their membership of the EFTA) but an often overlooked fact is that there are provisions in EU law to make guarantees offered to consumers (and claims made in advertising) legally binding.

It's true that the contract, and therefore your legal guarantee, is with the retailer, but a commercial guarantee is legally binding on the offeror.

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2003/si/11/made/en/print

A guarantee shall be legally binding on the offerer under the conditions laid down in the guarantee statement and the associated advertising.
 
LS400 said:
But the retailer is a victim, if they get unwarranted bad publicity. Your finding them guilty first without even knowing the circumstances. Sure these are the big guys, they can afford to take a hit if I shout loudly enough, they wont want the bad publicity, sure what have ye to loose--- Nothing.
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I don't doubt there are a lot of people who run moaning to social media any time they have a problem and want something they're likely not entitled to. However, there are also a lot of companies who clearly fail in their duties to their customers, and refuse to remedy issues that are clearly due to a product not being fit for purpose. As a consumer, I want to know about such issues, and I think I'm wise enough to know when someone's trying it on versus a customer with a genuine complaint. I use this information to guide me when deciding on a particular brand. If I see them responding well to what look like genuine cases, I'll be more likely to do business with them, if I see them shutting down chancers, I'll be more likely to do business with them, if I see them fail to deal with what look like really genuine cases, I'll spend my money elsewhere where I'll be more confident of a good outcome if I have an issue I need resolved.

With the information we have to hand, we can't say whether the OP's is truely genuine. So all we can do is lay out all the options and let the OP decide how to proceed.
 
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