BER Certificate requirement for the sale or letting of property starts on 1st Jan 09

[minion]

Re: Ber Certificate requirement for the sale or letting of property starts on 1st Jan

How about anyone who gets a good price post the link and the price they got and property type in here. Then at least there would be a clear indication of costs involved. I have to get some too and have no idea where to start.

Also for apartment blocks im sure there is much less work involved for an assessor on the 2nd, 3rd, 4th ......... units of the same type. ie once he has one done he just has to more or less repeat it for all of the rest of the apartments on the building.

 

[PADDYBOY99]

Re: Ber Certificate requirement for the sale or letting of property starts on 1st Jan

How about anyone who gets a good price post the link and the price they got and property type in here. Then at least there would be a clear indication of costs involved. I have to get some too and have no idea where to start.

Also for apartment blocks im sure there is much less work involved for an assessor on the 2nd, 3rd, 4th ......... units of the same type. ie once he has one done he just has to more or less repeat it for all of the rest of the apartments on the building.

That would be correct. You should get a deal for Multiple similair properties .

 

[Lak]

Re: Ber Certificate requirement for the sale or letting of property starts on 1st Jan

I have recently been informed that Engineers, Architects and Auctioneers will be able to assess dwellings in which they have a vested interest, when I undertook the new build BER course early in the year I was informed by the training company that under no circumstances would any person that may have a conflict of interest in regards to issueing a cert for any property be allowed to assess said property.
This measure it appears has been fully relaxed, which I find very annoying, as it seems apparent SEI have blatantly induced a large amount of individuals to partake in expensive courses in the belief that there will be many opportunities to make a decent living. This clearly has been curtailed to a large extent if Engineers are assessing their own dwellings and more so Auctioneers for all propertys on their books

 

[Pope John 11]

Re: Ber Certificate requirement for the sale or letting of property starts on 1st Jan

I was also thinking about doing this course. Has anyone have any idea of the number of persons qualifying for this course, over the last year.

 

[MrMan]

Re: Ber Certificate requirement for the sale or letting of property starts on 1st Jan

I have recently been informed that Engineers, Architects and Auctioneers will be able to assess dwellings in which they have a vested interest, when I undertook the new build BER course early in the year I was informed by the training company that under no circumstances would any person that may have a conflict of interest in regards to issueing a cert for any property be allowed to assess said property.
This measure it appears has been fully relaxed, which I find very annoying, as it seems apparent SEI have blatantly induced a large amount of individuals to partake in expensive courses in the belief that there will be many opportunities to make a decent living. This clearly has been curtailed to a large extent if Engineers are assessing their own dwellings and more so Auctioneers for all propertys on their books

It hasn't been relaxed and it should be enforced, the last thing an auctioneer would want is to do his own properties because he would be expected to do it for cut price or as part of the sales package.

 

[mosstown]

Re: Ber Certificate requirement for the sale or letting of property starts on 1st Jan

these certs have been law since 1 October in the UK. I paid a £35 for each property regardless of size. this was a discounted rate based on size of portfolio but you can get generally get them done for £55 so i think 250 euros is taking the mickey, but i guess that's Ireland for you.
these certs are the greatest load of rubbish ever. they are valid for 10 years, there is no legal requirement to improve the property and my 9 year old daughter could have produced the report.
the assessment involved measuring the property, checking if you had low energy bulbs, what type of heating, type of water heating, double glazed or not, roof insulation, year of build, type of build (block or timberframe), noting how many external walls and thats basically it in a nutshell. very simple.
the guy spent 20 minutes in each property, took the information away, input it on his laptop which he said takes him about 10 minutes and then emailed them to me. £35 for 30 minutes work, pretty good.

 

[Lak]

Re: Ber Certificate requirement for the sale or letting of property starts on 1st Jan

You would need to do a hell of alot of assessments at £35 a pop to recoup the five grand or more it costs an individual to train and register with SEI, before the indemnity and public liabillity insurances, lap top, vehicle etc. Before of course someone can attempt to make a living....but I guess thats Ireland for you.

 

[S.L.F]

Re: Ber Certificate requirement for the sale or letting of property starts on 1st Jan

these certs have been law since 1 October in the UK. I paid a £35 for each property regardless of size. this was a discounted rate based on size of portfolio but you can get generally get them done for £55 so i think 250 euros is taking the mickey, but i guess that's Ireland for you.
these certs are the greatest load of rubbish ever. they are valid for 10 years, there is no legal requirement to improve the property and my 9 year old daughter could have produced the report.
the assessment involved measuring the property, checking if you had low energy bulbs, what type of heating, type of water heating, double glazed or not, roof insulation, year of build, type of build (block or timberframe), noting how many external walls and thats basically it in a nutshell. very simple.
the guy spent 20 minutes in each property, took the information away, input it on his laptop which he said takes him about 10 minutes and then emailed them to me. £35 for 30 minutes work, pretty good.

I agree I think €250 for an hours work is scandalous, if could could get someone to do it for this rate, from the prices I've come across it's more like €400.

You would need to do a hell of alot of assessments at £35 a pop to recoup the five grand or more it costs an individual to train and register with SEI, before the indemnity and public liabillity insurances, lap top, vehicle etc. Before of course someone can attempt to make a living....but I guess thats Ireland for you.

As you say this is Ireland so the prices are not what they should be and are quoted to be between €250 and €400 for a single dwelling.

So €5000/400 is 12.5 basically 1.5 days work

or to be fair if it was cheaper then €5000/€250 works out at 20 that's 2.5 days work.

Even factoring in things like insurance, training costs, registering with SEI motor expenses or lap tops which most people have anyway

Not bad money if you can get it.

 

[mosstown]

Re: Ber Certificate requirement for the sale or letting of property starts on 1st Jan

this guy who carries out the energy certs in London often does 12 reports in a day. he also works saturdays and most sunday mornings and would have 3-5 done on a sunday morning and home for lunch. he told me he can easily earn £2,500 a week without breaking into a sweat ! he even turns down properties that are bit awkward to get to or too far from where he lives.
the letting agents are also using this as a money making opportunity, i.e. one agent is charging £140 + VAT, sneaky gets !

 

[S.L.F]

Re: Ber Certificate requirement for the sale or letting of property starts on 1st Jan

this guy who carries out the energy certs in London often does 12 reports in a day. he also works saturdays and most sunday mornings and would have 3-5 done on a sunday morning and home for lunch. he told me he can easily earn £2,500 a week without breaking into a sweat ! he even turns down properties that are bit awkward to get to or too far from where he lives.
the letting agents are also using this as a money making opportunity, i.e. one agent is charging £140 + VAT, sneaky gets !

Now turn this into Irish prices.

12 per day @ €250 is €3000 per day equates to €15000 per week or €18000 if you work Saturdays

12 per day @ €400 is €4800 per day equates to €24000 per week or €28800 if you work Saturdays.

I'm obviously in the wrong business!

 

[Bronte]

Re: Ber Certificate requirement for the sale or letting of property starts on 1st Jan

these certs have been law since 1 October in the UK. I paid a £35 for each property regardless of size. this was a discounted rate based on size of portfolio but you can get generally get them done for £55 so i think 250 euros is taking the mickey, but i guess that's Ireland for you.
these certs are the greatest load of rubbish ever. they are valid for 10 years, there is no legal requirement to improve the property and my 9 year old daughter could have produced the report.
the assessment involved measuring the property, checking if you had low energy bulbs, what type of heating, type of water heating, double glazed or not, roof insulation, year of build, type of build (block or timberframe), noting how many external walls and thats basically it in a nutshell. very simple.
the guy spent 20 minutes in each property, took the information away, input it on his laptop which he said takes him about 10 minutes and then emailed them to me. £35 for 30 minutes work, pretty good.

That's very interesting, I was wondering exaclty what the BER would be, but if this is all it is I could do it myself without any qualification. Anyone know what happens if you don't get one when renting out from January? Is there a fine? How is it enforced? It just seems like another cost to landlords. I can tell my tenant's the exact heating costs based on previous bills for gaz/oil/esb.

 

[MrMan]

Re: Ber Certificate requirement for the sale or letting of property starts on 1st Jan

That's very interesting, I was wondering exaclty what the BER would be, but if this is all it is I could do it myself without any qualification. Anyone know what happens if you don't get one when renting out from January? Is there a fine? How is it enforced? It just seems like another cost to landlords. I can tell my tenant's the exact heating costs based on previous bills for gaz/oil/esb.

Max fine of €5,000 and/or 3 months in prison afaik. Do people really think that this could be done for the price of a call out to look at a broken washing machine?

 

[Bronte]

Re: Ber Certificate requirement for the sale or letting of property starts on 1st Jan

Max fine of €5,000 and/or 3 months in prison afaik. Do people really think that this could be done for the price of a call out to look at a broken washing machine?

Who's going to check if you have a BER certificate? Nobody currently checks the state of property, though I do know there is some state body that is supposed to. The PRTB doesn't check standards as far as I know and they can't even handle the complaints procedure in a timely manner, never mind efficiently. Let's say I don't get the BER, who will be taking me to court? Tenants? Why would they care. What is the point of all this. It's just more red tape.

 

[joker538]

Re: Ber Certificate requirement for the sale or letting of property starts on 1st Jan

I agree I think €250 for an hours work is scandalous, if could could get someone to do it for this rate, from the prices I've come across it's more like €400.



As you say this is Ireland so the prices are not what they should be and are quoted to be between €250 and €400 for a single dwelling.

So €5000/400 is 12.5 basically 1.5 days work

or to be fair if it was cheaper then €5000/€250 works out at 20 that's 2.5 days work.

Even factoring in things like insurance, training costs, registering with SEI motor expenses or lap tops which most people have anyway

Not bad money if you can get it.

I am doing this course and am due to finish next week. Would estimate to come and do a survey on an existing property would take 4 hours (1-1.5 hours survey, 1-2 hours on computer inputing date, 1 hours travel)

If you were to charge €250 for the cert. You would have the following costs

Price 250.00
Vat @ 21% 43.47
Price excl vat 206.53
less cost of lodging cert with sei 25.00
181.53

less capital costs contribution say 16.53
(training €1800, laptop €500, insurance, car, register with sei €1000)
150.00

So €150 for 4 hours worked less tax and prsi, say 25%, is €112.50 for half a days work. Assuming that over time you would become more efficient and could complete 4/5 per day its still not the kind of money you have in your calculations above

 

[MrMan]

Re: Ber Certificate requirement for the sale or letting of property starts on 1st Jan

Who's going to check if you have a BER certificate? Nobody currently checks the state of property, though I do know there is some state body that is supposed to. The PRTB doesn't check standards as far as I know and they can't even handle the complaints procedure in a timely manner, never mind efficiently. Let's say I don't get the BER, who will be taking me to court? Tenants? Why would they care. What is the point of all this. It's just more red tape.

The tenants might want to know what your rating is so that they can use it for rental negotiations, they may simply want to because it is their right to do so. It may seem like red tape but hopefully it is the start of more sustainable construction and even better for the environment, you hardly are against that are you?

 

[MrMan]

Re: Ber Certificate requirement for the sale or letting of property starts on 1st Jan

less cost of lodging cert with sei 25.00

You should probably provide a cost plus the charge of cert just the allow for the possibility that the cert price will go up.

 

[Bronte]

Re: Ber Certificate requirement for the sale or letting of property starts on 1st Jan

The tenants might want to know what your rating is so that they can use it for rental negotiations, they may simply want to because it is their right to do so. It may seem like red tape but hopefully it is the start of more sustainable construction and even better for the environment, you hardly are against that are you?

Absolutely agree with better standards of course I do (environment and sustainable is a different debate), I've got very high spec as far as I'm concerned but in older buildings. But I've heard the newer builds are getting an automatic certificate and I don't belive a lot of them have been well built, so who was ensuring the standards there and why are they getting an automatic certificate, I think it's a cover up for bad building practice. Also when one gets an engineer/expert to do a survey why can't it cover this. MrMan, I'll be getting the certificate if I have to but do I believe the standards will go up, No.

 

[MrMan]

Re: Ber Certificate requirement for the sale or letting of property starts on 1st Jan

Absolutely agree with better standards of course I do (environment and sustainable is a different debate), I've got very high spec as far as I'm concerned but in older buildings. But I've heard the newer builds are getting an automatic certificate and I don't belive a lot of them have been well built, so who was ensuring the standards there and why are they getting an automatic certificate, I think it's a cover up for bad building practice. Also when one gets an engineer/expert to do a survey why can't it cover this. MrMan, I'll be getting the certificate if I have to but do I believe the standards will go up, No.

i guess its putting the onus on the vendor from now on, the purchaser would have had to employ a surveyor and pay him even if he didn't go through with the purchase, so this way its a once off. Tenants would never have employed a surveyor anyway. I understand your fears and they are well founded, hopefully it will turn out to be a positive move and not another paper over the cracks.

 

[S.L.F]

Re: Ber Certificate requirement for the sale or letting of property starts on 1st Jan

I am doing this course and am due to finish next week. Would estimate to come and do a survey on an existing property would take 4 hours (1-1.5 hours survey, 1-2 hours on computer inputing date, 1 hours travel)

Nowhere have I seen anybody saying it will take an hour and a half to survey a property, normally an hour. 1
1-2 hours on a computer. Come on you are not writing a novel. You have a few things to take into consideration type of heating, insulation, vents, walls and windows. What else is there?

Say it costs €400 to survey a property or suppose you can get more surveyed in a day than you think you can or suppose you get faster at your computer than you are now, suppose you do all your calling on set days and do all your PC work on other set days.

Where would these thoughts change your figures?

Since you have not even started to do this as a business my figures make as much sense as yours.

€1800 for a course that gives you a business that people have to use or they get fined or thrown in jail, yeah give me a slice of that cake please!

 

[PADDYBOY99]

Re: Ber Certificate requirement for the sale or letting of property starts on 1st Jan

If you belive you could set yourself up for 1800 Euro why don't you go ahead. You will soon find that outlay growing quiet a bit.

Nowhere have I seen anybody saying it will take an hour and a half to survey a property, normally an hour. 1
1-2 hours on a computer. Come on you are not writing a novel. You have a few things to take into consideration type of heating, insulation, vents, walls and windows. What else is there?

Say it costs €400 to survey a property or suppose you can get more surveyed in a day than you think you can or suppose you get faster at your computer than you are now, suppose you do all your calling on set days and do all your PC work on other set days.

Where would these thoughts change your figures?

Since you have not even started to do this as a business my figures make as much sense as yours.

€1800 for a course that gives you a business that people have to use or they get fined or thrown in jail, yeah give me a slice of that cake please!