Are income tax rates really too high in Ireland

joe sod said:
Being able to WFH is already a substantial benefit, its the people that are required to travel to work everyday that should be getting the tax credits as they bare the increased costs of fuel, and travel . That would then level the playing field a bit .
Click to expand...
I agree and while I understand why it was put into place at the start, I think it is ridiculous.
But this was suggested to replace the PAYE credit: a travel to work cost tax credit, not in addition to PAYE but to replace PAYE.
 
Premos said:
asically a tax cut for people earning 50k+ paid by people on very low income. The exemption is 18k for a single person. It's very low as it has never been indexed for nearly 20 years. If you abolish the paye tax credit, it means they would pay 1600 tax or live on a yearly income of less than 16.4k or 1.366 a month so that people earning 1k a week can pay less tax
Click to expand...
I suspect a lot of the people on hear looking to increase income tax on the OAP had a very cushy childhood and had parents earning above the normal industrial wage in the private sector,

What I would like some of them to do is to go back and do up a chart on the amount of income tax and social security paid by a PAYE Worker on the average industrial wage in the private sector form 1970 to the present day by a single and Double income house hold, I suspect they are going to get a fright when the see how low income was before entering the 60% income tax rate,

Just so you know lots were paid less than the average industrial wage and paid 60% income tax on overtime to make end meet,

When they have that done they can come back on hear and see do they still agree with their own suggestions on taxing people who possibly paid double the income tax now charged in the average industrial wage,

I am waiting for the chart starting from 1970 to the present day for a Single And Double House Hold,
 
Last edited:

"Are income tax rates really too high in Ireland"​

Relative to what I would ask? The question as stated is too broad to answer in a meaningful way. It's not only about the level of tax, but what you get from the tax levied. You can't look at it in isolation. We often see average figures presented, but if we had more granularity, say at different income brackets, focused on comparable countries, we could have a more informed discussion.

Better to ask:
1) Are tax rates at different income levels, say between 25k and 200k, too high relative to other western European countries?
2) Are the level of services provided for the tax levied equivalent to our neighbours?
3) Are the social insurance models comparable?
 
Last edited:
nest egg said:
Better to ask:
1) Are tax rates at different income levels, say between 25k and 200k, too high relative to other western European countries?
2) Are level of services provided for the tax levied equivalent to our neighbours?
3) Are the social insurance models comparable?
Click to expand...
I agree 100%
But you would have to look at it over a lifetime even more so when it comes to no 3 so a good place to start would be to have a look at payroll deductions in Ireland today and show on a chart deductions going back from present day to lets say to January 1 1973 the date we joined the EU,
I also think it should be confined to the EU, as far as i can see every year we move closer and closer to what is going on in the EU,
just look at the new rules in the rental marker at present for the most part we are only catching up to what is in place in most of the EU,
Hopefully someone will get working on Irish data going back to 1973 to back up the changes they are suggesting at present and then we can Examine similartiies and how we stack up against other EU member states,
I know Irish and German payroll deductions over the lifetime of our membership of the EU for the most part are very close,
 
Last edited:
Protocol said:
No other country in the world is as generous!!!
Click to expand...
When you do up a chart to back this up since the entered the work force I suspect you are in for a bit of a land,
Make sure you include all payroll deductions including employers prsi,
 
Last edited:
joe sod said:
Being able to WFH is already a substantial benefit, its the people that are required to travel to work everyday that should be getting the tax credits as they bare the increased costs of fuel, and travel . That would then level the playing field a bit .
Click to expand...
The Civil Servants who actually make these decisions are the same people who disproportionately work from home. Therefore there are tax benefits for working from home and none for travelling to work. They also get mobile phones and free parking spaces so there's no BIK for free parking spaces and mobile phones. There is BIK for the things they don't get... you get the picture.
 
galway said:
When you do up a chart to back this up since the entered the work force I suspect you are in for a bit of a land,
Make sure you include all payroll deductions including employers prsi,
Click to expand...
What's that got to do with anything?
 
Purple said:
What's that got to do with anything
Click to expand...
Well I am inviting you and others to back up in a professional way to see do you understand what you are on about ,
I am waiting but not holding out much hope to be honest,
Just a simple common direct read chart to back up your view,
 
Last edited:
galway said:
Well I am inviting you and others to back up in a professional way to see do you understand what you are on about ,
I am waiting but not holding out much hope to be honest,
Just a simple common direct read chart to back up your view,
Click to expand...
I still don't understand the point you are making.
Are you trying to establish a link between the income taxes I have paid as an individual and the merits of national taxation policy?

At a quick guess I have paid well in excess of a million Euro in income tax and social insurance and that's without adjusting for inflation. Considering that I have 4 children, one of whom required long term medical treatment and my wife had cancer for which she received two years of treatment I'm not sure that I have contributed more than I got back in direct transfers.

I estimate that the State had spent over a half a million Euro educating my children and we as a family have received hundreds of thousands of Euro worth of medical care. That's before I take into account that billions of Euro of borrowings to bail out the depositors in the banks and prop up the economy has vastly inflated the value of my home and my pension.

Yes, I can say unequivocally that the services that the State had paid for that I and my family have consumed directly and the State spending that has directly enriched me has greatly exceeds the value of taxes I have paid.
 
nest egg said:
Relative to what I would ask? The question as stated is too broad to answer in a meaningful way. It's not only about the level of tax, but what you get from the tax levied. You can't look at it in isolation. We often see average figures presented, but if we had more granularity, say at different income brackets, focused on comparable countries, we could have a more informed discussion.
Click to expand...

Effective income tax rates are not too high, compared to most other EU countries.

Marginal tax rates on median earnings are too high at 47.2%.
 
Last edited:
Purple said:
Therefore there are tax benefits for working from home and none for travelling to work. They also get mobile phones and free parking spaces so there's no BIK for free parking spaces and mobile phones. There is BIK for the things they don't get... you get the picture.
Click to expand...

This is inline with historical tax treatment of expenses. Expenses you incur "wholly and exclusively" for business purposes can be discounted for tax purposes. Broadband and Light and Heat can be partially offset if working from home and, of course, commuter bus and rail tickets can be fully offset against income tax. You could never write off "travelling to work" regardless of the type of business undertaken.
 
galway said:
Still lower than I paid in 2009/10 before USC came in
Click to expand...
The top marginal rate in 2009 was 52% on earnings over €174,980. On earnings above €80,000 it was 50%. The PRSI ceiling was €52,000.

The top rate now, including PRSI, is 52% on incomes over €44,000. €70,000 (edited)
 
Last edited:
Corola said:
The top USC rate doesn't start until 70k. Someone on 44k has a marginal rate of 47.2%.
Click to expand...
My mistake, but in real terms (adjusted for inflation) the top marginal rate kicks in at about a quarter of the income that it did in 2009.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top