An unsuitable President ? And the failure of mainstream politics

[Sister Sara]

That's why the president is meant to be above politics.

She is meant to be above party politics, not politics. Ergo, she is required to sign into law legislation as passed in the Oireachtas by the governing party of the time regardless of her own position on the legislation.

Commentary on public affairs that affect the citizenry is perfectly within the mandate of the position of the President.

"In the presence of Almighty God I do solemnly and sincerely promise and declare that I will maintain the Constitution of Ireland and uphold its laws, that I will fulfil my duties faithfully and conscientiously in accordance with the Constitution and the law, and that I will dedicate my abilities to the service and welfare of the people of Ireland. May God direct and sustain me."

Art 7 2° - The President may, after consultation with the Council of State, address a message to the Nation at any time on any such matter.

Neutrality and pro-migration are not divisive topics in this country. Across the political spectrum there is near uniform agreement.

Providing accommodation to migrants who arrive here through illegal channels or without proper documentation while ordinary working people are finding it harder and harder to pay for reasonable and affordable accommodation, that is divisive - but she didnt reference that,

 

[Purple]

Neutrality and pro-migration are not divisive topics in this country. Across the political spectrum there is near uniform agreement.

Yea, sure they aren't.

 

[Sister Sara]

Yea, sure they aren't.

Well perhaps define what you mean by 'divisive'?

All topics can be 'divisive' to some extent but in that scenario our President shouldn't speak at all.

By divisive I would interpret the presence of sustained political activism on the streets by members of general public that has, or is garnering support from the elected political establishment.

 

[Marsupial]

that I will dedicate my abilities to the service and welfare of the people of Ireland.

So, define "the people of Ireland".

(Presumably on Planet Connolly (which has four moons called McDonald, Cairns, Bacik and Murphy) it's everyone on the island, irrespective of whether or not they have a right to be here.)

 

[Sister Sara]

So, define "the people of Ireland".

Article 2 of Bunracht na hÉireann covers it.

 

[Purple]

Well perhaps define what you mean by 'divisive'?

In this context, topics which cause division.

All topics can be 'divisive' to some extent but in that scenario our President shouldn't speak at all.

That would be ideal but given that she will she should be cognisant that while a majority of the minority who chose to vote did vote for her the majority of the electorate overall, as evident in our Parliamentary elections, do not share her far left anti-EU, anti-business, anti-Western views.

By divisive I would interpret the presence of sustained political activism on the streets by members of general public that has, or is garnering support from the elected political establishment.

Well perhaps define 'elected political establishment'.

I'm not a fan of street politics or activism (if your the activist) as it often becomes thuggery and violence and we've seen more than enough of that on this island.

 

[Purple]

Article 2 of Bunracht na hÉireann covers it.

Article 2 of the Constitution of Ireland (Bunreacht na hÉireann):

It is the entitlement and birthright of every person born in the island of Ireland, which includes its islands and seas, to be part of the Irish Nation. That is also the entitlement of all persons otherwise qualified in accordance with law to be citizens of Ireland. Furthermore, the Irish nation cherishes its special affinity with people of Irish ancestry living abroad who share its cultural identity and heritage.

That defines the Irish Nation and, as is proper an correct in a Constitution, is suitably vague so as to be interpreted by the legislature.

 

[Sister Sara]

That would be ideal

I don't know, between your slavish worship of US corporations and now your 'ideal' that the elected President of this Republic should dishonour her Constitutional entitlement to address the Nation at any time, on any matter, by not speaking at all, I'm beginning to think you hanker for some sort of mythical Japanese Emperor / North Korean dictator to lead the country?

her far left anti-EU, anti-business, anti-Western views.

That would be neutrality and pro-immigration views you mentioned earlier?

'elected political establishment'.

Anyone elected to public forum that has the authority to pass legislation, regulations etc such as the Oireacthas or County Councils.

 

[Sister Sara]

That defines the Irish Nation

And what do you interpret 'Nation' to mean?

 

[Purple]

I don't know, between your slavish worship of US corporations and now your 'ideal' that the elected President of this Republic should dishonour her Constitutional entitlement to address the Nation at any time, on any matter, by not speaking at all, I'm beginning to think you hanker for some sort of mythical Japanese Emperor / North Korean dictator to lead the country?

That explains a lot.

That would be neutrality and pro-immigration views you mentioned earlier?

No. Lots of people are pro immigration (like me for example) and lots are pro-neutrality (not like me). I am talking about her anti-EU stances in the past and more recently, her horrific insulting of Germany and the German people during the campaign, her anti-business stance, particularly big businesses (a position you seem to share), her stance on Russia's invasion of Ukraine and the scramble to help it defend itself, a stance which is at best stupid and childish. Those are what I'm talking about.

Anyone elected to public forum that has the authority to pass legislation, regulations etc such as the Oireacthas or County Councils.

Ah, so Paul Murphy is part of the political establishment, as was Catherine Connelly, as is Luke Ming Flannagan etc as well as the various far left and far right and single issue head-bangers who are elected to County Councils all over the country. I'm sure they'd be delighted to know that. If that's the case there are no anti establishment politicians. I'm not sure Bríd Smith, for example, would agree with you (a woman for whom, despite disagreeing with her on many things, I have a great deal of respect, possibly even admiration).

 

[Purple]

And what do you interpret 'Nation' to mean?

I'm not sure, because every person born on the island, as well as those born elsewhere who qualify under law, is considered part of the Irish nation.
But! Not all of those people are entitled to Irish Citizenship and can be deported from this country. Is the Irish born child of a (failed) asylum seeker from Ghana still a part of the Irish nation after they have been deported to Ghana with their parents?

Not that cut and dry, is it?

What do you interpret 'Nation' to mean?

 

[Sister Sara]

I was very disappointed by the highly political and divisive tone of her speech. I hopes for better.

Left wing agenda being repressed by the establishment, neutrality mentioned numerous times, pro immigration message a number of times etc.

the majority of the electorate overall, as evident in our Parliamentary elections, do not share her far left anti-EU, anti-business, anti-Western views.

That would be neutrality and pro-immigration views you mentioned earlier?

No.

Can you stop talking in riddles and answer this question straight?

Is it Connolly's pro-immigration views that are divisive or your own pro-immigration views that are unifying?

 

[Shelby219]

Maybe Brendan could start a new forum in AAM called "The Purple and Sister Sara Show"

 

[Purple]

Can you stop talking in riddles and answer this question straight?

Is it Connolly's pro-immigration views that are divisive or your own pro-immigration views that are unifying?

As you are misquoting me in a way that misrepresents what I've said I'll leave this one here.

 

[Sister Sara]

As you are misquoting me in a way that misrepresents what I've said I'll leave this one here.

Connolly is pro-immigration
You are pro-immigration.

You highlighted Connollys pro-immigration views in the context of her being political and divisive. Its not unreasonable to assume that therefore you consider pro-immigration views divisive?

The only thing I would say therefore is you also believe your own pro-immigration views to be divisive and not unifying as I inferred?

To my mind, pro-immigration views are not divisive amongst the vast, vast majority of the population. In fact, across the political spectrum pro-immigration is broadly welcomed.
Even most of those who are protesting against IP migrants are primarily concerned about the apparent collapse of migrant controls leading to limited resources of housing and other public services rather than actual migrants entering the country, albeit they do lend cover to actual racists.

 

[Purple]

Its not unreasonable to assume that therefore you consider pro-immigration views divisive?

Yes, of course they are. Many people disagree strongly with me. Therefore my views are divisive. If the President spent their time making political speeches which I agreed with it would be equally inappropriate and divisive. The President is the Head of State for all Irish people and so should not seek, deliberately or inadvertently, to alienate ant sector of society.

 

[Purple]

Even most of those who are protesting against IP migrants are primarily concerned about the apparent collapse of migrant controls leading to limited resources of housing and other public services rather than actual migrants entering the country, albeit they do lend cover to actual racists

In my view they are either ignorant, stupid or racist, or any combination of the above. If the president said that I'd agree with her but I'd still think it was inappropriate and divisive.

 

[Sister Sara]

Therefore my views are divisive. If the President spent their time making political speeches which I agreed with it would be equally inappropriate and divisive.

Ok, fair enough. I think we can call a truce here. I was working on the assumption that broadly speaking pro-immigration views are not divisive, and that when the President speaks on matters it is from a broad perspective of the Irish Nation, rather than from any narrow perspective of party politics or fringe campaign.