Why cant provisional drivers get insurance?

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foxylady

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Asa learner driver hwo are you supposed to get insurance, if companies say you need x amount of years experience. Hello thought you couldnt get experience without driving first, are these companies advising you to drive without insurance as not all leaner drivers have the privilege of driving on someone elses policy
 
Try Quinn Direct, or do the Hibernian Ignition course.

Provisional drivers most certainly can get insurance (I know from experience, and many of my friends have their own insurance on provisional licences), just not from all insurers.

The cost of insurance for a provisional driver is a different issue altogether.

foxylady said:
are these companies advising you to drive without insurance
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Nobody is advising you to do this.
 
Unfortunately they obviously can and them not fit to be on the road at all , 400,000 of the beggars or some equally crazy number :(
 
foxylady said:
Asa learner driver hwo are you supposed to get insurance, if companies say you need x amount of years experience. Hello thought you couldnt get experience without driving first, are these companies advising you to drive without insurance as not all leaner drivers have the privilege of driving on someone elses policy
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Everyone is legally obliged to have car insurance and the insurance industry (as a whole) is obliged to offer a quote to everyone. If you are having problems obtaining insurance, contact the Irish Insurance Federation and they will make sure someone gives you a quote - although as mentioned above, no guarantees on the price.
 
I probably should have wored the question better, but my rant is about insurance companies who wont insure a first time driver unless they have 5 years experience, or do som ecourse that can only be done by some who is driving like a fully qualified driver, which is kind of impossible if you are only starting off.
 
foxylady said:
I probably should have wored the question better, but my rant is about insurance companies who wont insure a first time driver unless they have 5 years experience, or do som ecourse that can only be done by some who is driving like a fully qualified driver, which is kind of impossible if you are only starting off.
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Take lessons.

And AFAIK, Quinn don't require experience or a course.
 
foxylady said:
my rant is about insurance companies who wont insure a first time driver unless they have 5 years experience, or do som ecourse that can only be done by some who is driving like a fully qualified driver, which is kind of impossible if you are only starting off.
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Do you think that motor insurance should be community rated or something and that insurance companies should not load the premiums of individuals who (statistically) represent a higher risk to them?
 
At lot of places do it for provisional drivers, you'll just have to pay more for the privilege! Tough I know, but everyone had to do it at some stage. However, a friend of my mum's son got first time insurance for €800ish through Cornmarket because his Dad was in the Union. Worth checking it out.
 
i think the title of this post is misleading. it isnt true to say provisional cannot get insurance. They can if they are prepared to pay the price.We all have to build up our no claims bonus.
 
personally I think provisional drivers should be quoted the full cost of insurance- then a 50% discount applied - and to all motorists who have obtained this discount the hard way now shouting at this post, this discount will be on a very big premium, especially if the provisional driver is male. if the provisional driver causes an accident he/she loses the discount and reverts back to a whacking great premium. this to remain the case for 5 years - but the 'basic' premium falling each year to 'normal levels' maybe 50% is too high but not less than 40% for it to be effective. very easy for us oldies ( who are paying under €400 for full comp etc) to forget how expensive it is for the newer generation to get insurance.
 
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The sums won't add up on this. If 'full cost' is say €2,000 (the expected cost of claims for the full year, ignoring expenses), charging the first year's group €1,000 will leave the insurance company short 50% of the cost of claims. The second year, the 'bad' people are still only paying the 'full cost' of €2,000 and the 'good' people will be paying €1,000 (ignoring bonus) - but the insurance company still needs an average €2,000 per person to cover the cost of claims.
Not that many people have claims in any one year so the 'bad' people would have to pay substantially more than full cost to justify a discount to the drivers deemed 'good' - and there's nothing to stop the 'bad' drivers giving up driving for a few years and so not contributing to the pool.
Insurance companies do try to come up with schemes to help provisional licence drivers but it's really hard to come up with a scheme that can give an upfront discount but still guarantee that the insurance company will get enough money overall - mainly because people are free to move companies or stop driving altogether (or present to another company as a brand-new claims-free no previous insurance driver).
 
I think you just need to make sure that you minimise your risk as much as possible as a provisional driver, make sure you have a small engine, go for an older car so if you have a knock or 2 you won't mind covering that cost for small repairs while building up no claims bonus, and your driving experience.
Seriously consider taking out comprehensive insurance for the first year, even if it is significantly higher costwise, if you do any reasonable distance annually.
It will be expensive for the first year, but do the Ignition course and it will help to bring the cost down.
Ring around all the companies / brokers and see who can offer the best deal, not all companies will cover you but a number will, Ladystar / quinn / hibernian are the ones that spring to mind.
Most of these companies will let you pay monthly (ok you pay somethign like 5-7% extra for the privilege, but it is handy).
Apply for your driving test now, it may be 30-60 weeks until you'll do it, but it will make a difference for you financially (from memory, when I got mine in first year of driving I got a refund for approx 15% of the years cost, that was in month 9 of the first year). Your priority should be to get your test, I don't understand why people are happy to drive around 5-10 years later on a provisional.
If the cost is really prohibitive, wait and save for another year, I'm sorry to be the one to break this to you, but once you get a car you no longer have any money!!!!
 
Orka: point taken. Though I dont think its easy to present a no claims bonus to one company if you have had a claim with another. In your scenario €2000 is the 'break point' needed for the insurance companies to maintain their massive profits. So set the premium at €3,000 and discount this by 50%. if theres absolutely no claims they have €1,500 profit. If half the drivers have claims you would then have half at €3,000 and the other half at say €1,200 the following year = over the average €2,000 required. if the bad drivers stop contributing for a few years so what? when they resume you start them again at full whack with a slow build up to the 50%. I am not trying to screw insurance companies, I am trying to think of a way to encourage young drivers to keep a clean record.
 
Personally I think that provisional drivers should be unable to get insurance until they name the qualified driver who will be driving with them since they are not supposed to be driving without the accompaniment of a qualified driver.

And for the record, I got my practice/learning driving by paying quite a lot of money for driving lessons, which still amounted to significantly less than the insurance would have cost me as an unqualified named driver. If you're looking for insurance in your own name as a provisional driver, I assume it is far more expensive again - so my advice is pay for a lot of lessons and pass your test. Before you complain about the waiting time, remember you shouldn't be driving on your own anyway.
 
Ok have to jump on this bandwagon. I am 23 and am driving since September last year. I also applied for my "test" last September and god knows i will be lucky if i do the exam early next year. Just got a letter stating we will let you know 6 weeks before hand.

now i have no problem with the theory of Calina's argument but what about people that need cars for there work or family life. Why should we be punished for our governments inept ability to run the driving test procedures efficiently.

I am paying €1,650 to drive a ford fiesta and then your telling me i can;t drive it alone. Its crazy... "Before you complain about the waiting time...."

this is a ridiculous comment.... for one if the waiting time was 6 weeks as they have stated is there ultimate goal then fine i would obey the law and bid my time... but you are asking me to wait over a year (remember i applied last September for this test). If i am prepared to pay an increased premium i don't see why i should not drive to work (as i need to) visit my family etc.

Its up to the government to sort out the mess, not me to say ok Bertie its grand i will just sit tight for the time been and pay a fortune on driving lessons to get my experience.

Even been named on a policy costs €500 euro so the hell to it I WILL BE DRIVING WITH OR WITHOUT FULL LICENSED DRIVER!!!
 
johnnybegood said:
Why should we be punished for our governments inept ability to run the driving test procedures efficiently.

... but you are asking me to wait over a year (remember i applied last September for this test).
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Provisional drivers themselves are very much to blame for the lengthy waiting time for tests with a fail rate of just under 50% illustrating just how ill-prepared they are.

Preparation for the driving test with a minimum number of certified hours with a qualified driving instructor, including motorway driving, should be made compulsory and anyone who fails should have the number of compulsory certified hours required increased before being allowed to apply for the test again.

The test application form should also have to be signed by the Driving School confirming that the learner is indeed ready to take the test.

The 'R' (restricted) plate system, which restricts the newly qualified driver from exceeding a safe speed, would also be a good idea.
 
Johnnybegood, you are not qualified to drive unaccompanied and as such are breaking the law.You need to do a driving test to ascertain if you are fit to be on the public road. If this test then is a long time coming you have no choice but to wait and do it. It's no wonder there are so many accidents on the roads if everyone has the same attitude as you have.
 
cuchulainn said:
Though I dont think its easy to present a no claims bonus to one company if you have had a claim with another.
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That isn't what I said - I said that they would present as a 'no previous insurance' driver with no history, good or bad.

I'm not trying to put down your suggestions cuchulainn but it's really not as simple as you're suggesting - I used to work in an insurance company and we tried to come up with ways of helping young/provisional licence drivers get affordable premiums (not out of the kindness of our hearts, higher than average premiums are attractive to insurance companies so long as the price is right!). The main problems are:
  • it's not possible to identify in advance which drivers will have claims so you have to charge evryone in a pool of similar drivers enough to cover the average cost of claims
  • similar to this first point, the drivers who have claims change from year to year - v v unusual to have a habitual claimer - so you can't identify good and bad from one years' claims - everyone needs to be charged the average, allowing for NCD as a reward for last years' no claims
  • premiums have to be charged and payable in advance - it's next to impossible to collect retrospectively
  • you can't back-collect for previous years' too-low premiums by charging higher premiums next year because the drivers with no claims will go elsewhere
  • not that many drivers claims each year - probably less than 10% - so the high premiums charged to those who do stay won't be enough to compensate
  • charging less than expected cost for young provisional licence drivers is a recipe for disaster - word will get around the market that XYZ insurance company is doing cheap insurance, all young drivers will pile in, paying less than necessary and you'd be amazed at what a HUGE loss you can rack up in just a year's worth of insurance
  • you have to question the social responsibility aspect of making insurance cheap and affordable to very young drivers - in the late 1980s, one insurance company opened up in a big way to young drivers offering cheap insurance - this enabled a lot of 17/18 year olds with provisional licences to take to the roads without too much worry about the cost of insurance - this resulted in many more accidents and deaths than would otherwise have taken place
 
Im male, 26 and recently received my first provisional licence and went looking for a quote under my parents on a ford focus 1.6litre, i was pleasently suprised to get quoted 170euro and have paid this. I have never driven on roads before and its so low. Im third named driver on this car but as my parents have two cars i can have use of the focus at any time. Maybe you could get you could get insured under a parent or something?
 
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