Life as an accountant

[CCOVICH]

I also think that the big money is a myth, and that you have to work in a large company in a senior role to earn really good money. Even then, you have to work so many hours, that the pay only averages out at a reasonable amount per hour.

Can you produce any evidence that shows what a CFO or finance manager earns per hour compared to an accountants assistant? Big money is not a myth, take a look at the recruitment pages of any newspaper.

In fact trainee accountants would be as well off to work as accounts assistants while studying for exams as they would earn more money.

That's a bit of a short term view, as when you want to move up the ladder, your experience will be looked at to see if you are suitable for promotion. Taking a job on the basis of slightly better money in the early years of your career doesn't necessarliy make sense long term.

If you are motivated by money, I don't think accountancy is the profession, unless you are prepared to open up a practice.

Take a look at the composition of boards of major Irish and international plcs. You'll find a good sprinkling of accountants. These lads and ladies have done very well for themselves after qualifiying as accountants.

The money is reasonable when you are qualified as compared to a shop assistant, but not brilliant.

That depends where you work. The money on offer in the 'Big 4' and in industry for newly qualified accountants is very good compared to what many other newly qualified professionals earn.

 

[CGorman]

Take a look at the composition of boards of major Irish and international plcs. You'll find a good sprinkling of accountants. These lads and ladies have done very well for themselves after qualifiying as accountants.

This is apparently very true, i've read on countless occasions that the highest precentage of CEO's in the US hasve accountancy backgrounds (as opposed to HR, Marketing, Production, Sales etc.)

 

[WarrenBuffet]

Am really enjoying this thread i have to say - accountancy is something i am looking into at the moment as a possible career move. I qualified as an Engineer a few years ago but this academic year i began a part-time diploma in accountancy / business (dont want to get too specific for fear of recognition!).

However since so many accountants are contributing to this thread i hope you wont if i ask a few more questions!

- Is it true that the Big 4 only recruit in September for the following September? (Are there spaces still available now for next year?)
- How amenable are they to recruiting an engineer coming up on 3 years out of college? Would the fact i am doing a closely related course help me?
- Would i be considered too old (mid-twenties) to begin an apprenticeship? Would there be many other trainees in a similar situation to myself?

Thanks for any help!

 

[Winnie]

- Big 4 do a big recruitment drive in sept for the following sept (all new trainees start in sept) but it is possible to go for interview at other times of the year - expecially if you know someone within the firm who will refer you
- No prob if you don't come from non accounting discipline....although they may prefer you to do a PDA course (professional Diploma in Accountancy) which is a one year conversion course - they will pay
- Not too old.........a number of people who started with me were mid twenties.......


Don't agree with Busybee's comments about training outside a firm..................newly qualified in Big 4 are on 35k immediately after passing exams & go up to 45k 6 months later.........and again increase every year after that too.

 

[Bonafide]

This is apparently very true, i've read on countless occasions that the highest precentage of CEO's in the US hasve accountancy backgrounds (as opposed to HR, Marketing, Production, Sales etc.)

Apparently this is even more true in times of recession, I've often read that more accountants hold a seat on the boards of companies when the economy isn't performing well as to when it is performing well.

 

[Betsy Og]

I disagree with the comment about not being passionate about accountancy.

I work as an accountant in a small company, doing everything from debtors/creditors to year end accounts. I always loved figures at school. I love spotting a figure which looks unusual, then looking up transactions, finding out an explanation. I also like the debt collection most of the time. I like lodging X amount of money to the account, trying to get discounts from suppliers. I love it when the cash flow works right and there is a nice healthy bank balance.

Seek medical help urgently

While its great that you get a buzz from it, I dont think thats the reality for a lot of people. I'm not complaining (much) myself but I'm not in that particular area.

The money is definitely there if you are good enough, try to get on the highest "stream" initially at least - that probably means Dublin Big 4. It looks good on a CV. Arguably you can earn a few bob more intially by doing accounts assistant but you are not exactly staking your claim as a high flyer.

Even if the top flight or the geography of it is not for you, as long as you dont overstay then it wont harm you if you want to scale back or move out of big schmoke.

 

[Itchy]

Am really enjoying this thread i have to say - accountancy is something i am looking into at the moment as a possible career move. I qualified as an Engineer a few years ago but this academic year i began a part-time diploma in accountancy / business (dont want to get too specific for fear of recognition!).

I have to agree. I am studying engineering at the moment but I really feal accounting is for me. Thanks for all the contributions.

 

[mickeymouse]

Back to the transfer of an engineering profession to an accounting profession again. I have my own ltd. Co. and contract myself,alone, to a no. of multi national companies as a contract engineer and although am very well paid as things go (€90k turnover last year for 5 yrs experience) I don’t see this being sustained. Although I agree with other posters that the cream will always rise to the top no matter what you profession you are in I do see the days of what I am doing now limited and think I will have to take a substantial paycut eventually if I stay in this line.

I have gained some experience in doing end-of year accounts as a director of the limited company and the experience I have to date will apparently count towards some of the required experience needed. I have decided to go the ACCA route primarily because it is more flexible and allows me to continue working in the engineering area for another year to make some more money and then perhaps get my work experience in industry/ Big 4.
I hope to be finished in approx 4 years time.

However maybe someone could answer the following

*Assuming my experience to date will count for 1 year experience of the 3.5years total, and that I will have completed (and passed!) 60% of the ACCA exams would I be going in very junior to the Big 4 or industry?

*Has anyone gone down this route from engineer to accountant and if so how did it work out, what route was taken etc

 

[dam099]

I have gained some experience in doing end-of year accounts as a director of the limited company and the experience I have to date will apparently count towards some of the required experience needed.


*Assuming my experience to date will count for 1 year experience of the 3.5years total, and that I will have completed (and passed!) 60% of the ACCA exams would I be going in very junior to the Big 4 or industry?

Have you had an indication from ACCA that they might give you 1 years credit for this experience? I don't know much about how they award for experience (I did Chartered) but I am a little suprised that they would give this much credit for doing your own accounts. For a contractors own company turning over E90K I can't think you would have spent anywhere near the equivalent of a years time doing your own accounts (even if I assume that your entire 5 years engineering experience were using this company). There is also the fact that this was possibly ad hoc and unstructured and unsupervised training (with maybe some assistance from your accountant?)

I think in Big 4 you would still be relatively junior especially in Audit as you probably have no audit experience.

 

[BarryAsh]

Hi guys,

I'm an acca finalist earning peanuts at the minute in a small practice. not being looked after in a training/development way either. nobody ever has much time for that stuff.

looking for a change, a step away from accounts prep and company secretarial, although I do want to stay in a practice environment so i can get my PC (didn't do college and preofessional exams to not be able to sign off on a set of accounts)

I want a bigger kind of a position, ideally one that's project based.

Does anyone have any suggestions? Big 4 or top 20? one things for sure I aint stickin around where I am!

 

[Bonafide]

If you want to get your PC then accounts preparation and company secretarial is the line of work you are pursuing, isn't it? If you want to move to project work, why are you hanging around waiting to get your PC?

 

[BarryAsh]

maybe i don't know as much as I thought I did about practice and how to get the PC. when i say project work I mean stuff like insolvency and business turnaround, done on a project basis. it might be wishful thinking on my part but as I say, I like project based work and want to work towards my PC while doing this project based work.

am I fooling myself?

 

[Winnie]

Big 4 seem to be recruiting a lot of qualified staff & it is good to go on your cv......stay a couple of years. if you know someone in one of the companies you can share a nice hefy referal fee!

Would be good to get experience in larger clients if you already have smal client experience.

 

[BarryAsh]

Sorry Winnie, I don't know if your post was for me or not. do you mean stay where I am? if so - can't do it!

 

[Bonafide]

I think Winnie meant stay a couple of years with one of the big 4 - then your cv will show a few years small practice and a few years big 4. Would make you quite employable.

 

[BarryAsh]

Thanks Bonafide,

but as for big 4, am I likely to be stuck doing the same type of job day in day out? once I'm qualified of course

personally I'd prefer a more varied and interesting workload - would a top 20 be more like it do you think?

 

[Bonafide]

Well, if you have a PC and want to work in insolvency and business turnaround the big 4 won't necessarily give you that experience and neither will top 20. I would think big 4 would have closer ties to your future career aspirations.

 

[BarryAsh]

not to mention my salary aspirations! Thanks again Bonafide, much appreciated.

But as a matter of interest, how coud I get into insolvency & business turnaround?

 

[Kiddo]

I have gained some experience in doing end-of year accounts as a director of the limited company and the experience I have to date will apparently count towards some of the required experience needed.

I doubt that you will be allowed count your experiance of preparing year end accounts for your own company towards membership as it would largely be unsupervised. I would check this with the ACCA but I would be shocked if they accept this experiance.

BarryAsh

I have worked in a few small practices' and its my experiance that its usually the partners or senior staff that would be mostly involved in any project work with trainees or newly quals helping out with the donkey work. In the last practice I was at manager level and would have been involved in some projects such as Revenue Audits, setting up & assisting clients with implementing new accounts packages, assisting other accountacy firms performing due diligance on our clients and preparing files for liqidations. But the bones of my job was accounts prep & audit...though in a more supervisory capacity. The partner would have dealt with any refinancing/restructuring, tax planning, efficient running of client business, advising client re new business ventures/business expansion etc.

I'd advise you to discuss the type of work you are interested in with a recruitement agency and also ask at interveiws if there is much scope for you to get involved in project work, what type of work this would be, how often it arises. I don't know what the set up is in Big 4...maybe someone else could advise you.

Wherever you end up be aware that you will need to ensure that the practise is an ACCA approved training practice as your 3 years (at least 2 post qual) experiance towards your p.c. must be obtained in an approved practice.

See here for more details

[broken link removed]

AFAIK the market is quite good at the moment (in Dublin anyhow) A friend recently moved jobs an the agency had over 100 jobs in practice.

 

[BarryAsh]

thanks Kiddo,

sounds like good advice. next stop - a good recruitment consultancy.