Electric Car Value Trade In. Please Help

C

Commercial

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Hi Everyone,
It has been a number of years since I have been on here as I have changed career. It is a very useful resource and fair play to Brendan for his hard work.

I am reaching out again as I have been caught up in what I believe is very unfair practice by a car dealership. My wife purchased an electric car in October 2023 (3months ago) from a local car dealership for €45,000. We were told the range would be 300km plus on a full charge.
However, this is not the case. A journey from Galway to Dublin requires a stop to charge the car and then charge again when we get to Dublin. We live in Galway.

So, we went back to the dealer in early January and explained that we were looking to change again and gave them an idea of the car we were looking for. They never came back to us. So last Saturday we went up to the show room and saw lots of cars that we had explained we were looking to purchase and were wondering why the salesman hadn't contacted us about them. Anyway, we were dodged on the Saturday and were told we would get a call on Monday.
The call came this evening, saying they could offer us €30,000 for a car we had purchased off them 3 months ago for €45,000. Surely there must be some law protecting us here, for this daylight robbery?
Thanks in advance for your replies
 
Would you consider trying to sell it privately to see what you might get for it? Have you looked at the likes of carsireland.ie to see are there any comparable cars to your own on there for sale? There are a number of articles/commentaries on the internet that suggest EV's do have a very high level of depreciation in their early years, though the figures you quote do look excessive.

https://www.independent.ie/life/mot...-electrical-vehicle-lose-15000/a51569582.html
 
What is the make and model of the EV? The manufacturers specified range should be easy to clarify. This will nearly always differ from actual range due to a number of variables but shouldn’t be hugely different.

I wouldn’t trust anything a car salesman tells be about EV range or in fact anything mechanical about a vehicle.

Have you had the vehicle checked for issues? There may be a fault with it?
 
rustbucket said:
What is the make and model of the EV? The manufacturers specified range should be easy to clarify. This will nearly always differ from actual range due to a number of variables but shouldn’t be hugely different.

I wouldn’t trust anything a car salesman tells be about EV range or in fact anything mechanical about a vehicle.

Have you had the vehicle checked for issues? There may be a fault with it?
Click to expand...
A quick google suggests the variance in stated range vs actual range can in some cases be up to 20%
 
gipimann said:
VW have just announced a €10k cut to their new EV prices to compete with the Chinese marques. This will have a big impact on 2nd hand values.
Click to expand...
This is going to be an issue to the early adopters of EVs…I’ve seen the ID-4 2024 price is being reduced by approx. 12k to compete with Tesla and BYD…hertz US took a 250million hit last quarter due to depreciation of there existing stock. Adrian Weckler Was on the radio recently talking about this very subject and the depreciation of his own EV car..I see that sellers of 1yr old EV cars pricing them at the same price as new models
 
Commercial said:
I am reaching out again as I have been caught up in what I believe is very unfair practice by a car dealership. My wife purchased an electric car in October 2023 (3months ago) from a local car dealership for €45,000. We were told the range would be 300km plus on a full charge.
However, this is not the case. A journey from Galway to Dublin requires a stop to charge the car and then charge again when we get to Dublin. We live in Galway.
Click to expand...

Range is not fixed/guaranteed. It is shorter in cold weather, at higher speeds, when using air conditioning, etc.

Driving Galway-Dublin at 100-120 kph you will have a significantly shorter range than city driving at lower speeds.

Galway-Dublin is only about 200 km so if you need to stop to charge en route then you are only getting less than 60% of what you were expecting. That is unusual.

What model EV is it and what range does the brochure say?

Commercial said:
So, we went back to the dealer in early January and explained that we were looking to change again and gave them an idea of the car we were looking for. They never came back to us. So last Saturday we went up to the show room and saw lots of cars that we had explained we were looking to purchase and were wondering why the salesman hadn't contacted us about them. Anyway, we were dodged on the Saturday and were told we would get a call on Monday.
The call came this evening, saying they could offer us €30,000 for a car we had purchased off them 3 months ago for €45,000. Surely there must be some law protecting us here, for this daylight robbery?
Thanks in advance for your replies
Click to expand...

The dealer is under no obligation to offer you anything at all for the car. The old saying about new cars losing X% of their value when you drive away from the showroom is true whether it is a petrol, diesel, or EV.

The drop from 45k to 30k is probably influenced by price drops from Tesla and VW, as @Bluefin and @gipimann mentioned, in which case it is just bad luck on the timing.
 
gipimann said:
VW have just announced a €10k cut to their new EV prices to compete with the Chinese marques. This will have a big impact on 2nd hand values.
Click to expand...

Theres a bit more to it than that.

Tesla keep dropping prices to maintain market share in the face of Chinese competition. They are trying to maintain market share to maintain their share price. What they have done is compressed the entire EV market under their prices. No one is going to buy a ID4 when the Tesla is cheaper. Same with all the other brands. VW also has other issues with debt. Hence the massive drop in prices. They were over priced.

Along side of this you have issues with rising interest rates mean even fossil fuel cars are struggling, especially used, in the UK. That will come here next. Probably slower since its captive market due to various reasons.
 
Dublin to Galway is only just over 200km. I'd be curious what EV you've got that can't do that without charging twice.

You've bought the car at the peak of the market just before the prices have been slashed. Most new cars have massive amount of depreciation in the first 2 years. Also its the wrong car if you expect to drive long distances across the country without stopping.
 
AlbacoreA said:
Theres a bit more to it than that.

Tesla keep dropping prices to maintain market share in the face of Chinese competition. They are trying to maintain market share to maintain their share price. What they have done is compressed the entire EV market under their prices. No one is going to buy a ID4 when the Tesla is cheaper. Same with all the other brands. VW also has other issues with debt. Hence the massive drop in prices. They were over priced.

Along side of this you have issues with rising interest rates mean even fossil fuel cars are struggling, especially used, in the UK. That will come here next. Probably slower since its captive market due to various reasons.
Click to expand...
plenty of people will buy an id4 over a tesla to be fair but vw are just cutting back the price inflation they added over covid and the year after, when they came out first they were around the current price.
 
Commercial said:
We were told the range would be 300km plus on a full charge.
However, this is not the case. A journey from Galway to Dublin requires a stop to charge the car and then charge again when we get to Dublin. We live in Galway.
Click to expand...
Cars sold within the EU must use the WLTP methodology to arrive at a range figure. The testing is based on an average speed of 46.5km/h in summer temperatures. So in winter, and at higher speeds, you can be sure you'll get considerably less. Just like my 1.6 petrol can achieve less than 5l per 100km, it's more often over 7.

Pre-heat or cool that car while plugged in before you head off, accelerate slowly, keep speeds down, lose any unnecessary weight and you'll do better.
 
You should speak to a Solicitor with a view to suing the dealership and manufacturer based on Consumer Protection Act also lodge a complaint with CCPC

The valuation is regretabble but thats teh way EV market is going but the issue would be the misselling on range
 
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Raging Bull said:
Why if a good is misdescribed in law you have rights. Why would a car be any different.

It would be expensive to litigate so easier to go embarassment route Conor Pope etc..
Click to expand...
its not misdescribed, the range quoted will be the WLTP range, how thats calculated is very easy to ascertain and real world range for most cars is very easy to find under various conditions. See EV database:

 
I have no doubt the range will be 300km, with the wind at your back, the radio and aircon turned off, with minimal acceleration and braking, with the tire pressure correct etc etc etc. It's no different from the MPG figures quoted for petrol or diesal cars.

Good summary here

How far can an electric car go? | myenergi IE ⚡️

How far can an electric car go? In this article you will find all the bitesized information required on how vehicle range is determined.
www.myenergi.com www.myenergi.com

As for the depreciation, rule of thumb is 15% per annum and I would never expect to get the sales price back 3 months after taking delivery.
 
Raging Bull said:
Why if a good is misdescribed in law you have rights. Why would a car be any different.
Click to expand...
The only grounds they would have based on the information posted here so far would be if the 300km was well off the WLTP range quoted for the car, and I'm not aware of a €45k EV on sale here with an official range well below that.
 
Blackrock1 said:
plenty of people will buy an id4 over a tesla to be fair but vw are just cutting back the price inflation they added over covid and the year after, when they came out first they were around the current price.
Click to expand...

I think there's more to it than just "cutting back"

I went looking at ID4s a few months back was just staggered at how expensive they were, some were 60-70k. VW are carrying massive debt had all sorts of software issues.

cleantechnica.com

Volkswagen Cuts EV Production, Cancels New Wolfsburg Factory - CleanTechnica

Volkswagen announced this week a new plan for the production of electric vehicles that does not include building a new factory.
cleantechnica.com cleantechnica.com

On the back of that the have Chinese competition now and Tesla dropping prices. That's has effected everyone. Tesla owners have also been burnt by price cuts. I suspect there are further cuts to come.

When I was looking a few months back all cars seemed over priced. I decided to get a cheaper used car instead of new. I'll still lose money but far less than on a new car. I think the market will have stabilised in another 3-6 months.
 
thedaddyman said:
I have no doubt the range will be 300km, with the wind at your back, the radio and aircon turned off, with minimal acceleration and braking, with the tire pressure correct etc etc etc. It's no different from the MPG figures quoted for petrol or diesal cars.

Good summary here

How far can an electric car go? | myenergi IE ⚡️

How far can an electric car go? In this article you will find all the bitesized information required on how vehicle range is determined.
www.myenergi.com www.myenergi.com

As for the depreciation, rule of thumb is 15% per annum and I would never expect to get the sales price back 3 months after taking delivery.
Click to expand...

EVs range is more heavily affected by cold than petrol cars etc. For a variety of reasons. So the winter range is a lot less than summer range.

Petrol and diesel cars waste a lot of energy as heat. So hence heating doesn't effect range. Petrol and diesel is still more convenient for long distance driving.

EVs only suit certain types of use cases. They will work for long distance if you have destination charging and enough range to make minimal stops on route, and time to do it. Pros and cons to everything.
 
AlbacoreA said:
I think there's more to it than just "cutting back"

I went looking at ID4s a few months back was just staggered at how expensive they were, some were 60-70k. VW are carrying massive debt had all sorts of software issues.

cleantechnica.com

Volkswagen Cuts EV Production, Cancels New Wolfsburg Factory - CleanTechnica

Volkswagen announced this week a new plan for the production of electric vehicles that does not include building a new factory.
cleantechnica.com cleantechnica.com

On the back of that the have Chinese competition now and Tesla dropping prices. That's has effected everyone. Tesla owners have also been burnt by price cuts. I suspect there are further cuts to come.

When I was looking a few months back all cars seemed over priced. I decided to get a cheaper used car instead of new. I'll still lose money but far less than on a new car. I think the market will have stabilised in another 3-6 months.
Click to expand...
Im not sure thats any different to what i said, all the german manufacturers chased the demand up with their pricing, they are all cutting now, VW, Mercedes have already done it, BMW, audi and Skoda will follow. The ID4 is back at the price it was at launch, which is about right.

If you recall a few years ago Audi cancelled almost all their orders for the Q4 etron (rebadged ID4) as the chip shortages meant they couldnt meet demand, that has all normalised now, people wont pay the forthy prices
 
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