I'm not saying that's the theory but it's the reality. If it was linked to private sector pay then there would be pay freezes and pay cuts, increases in productivity with fewer employees and pay raises based on productivity based in their opposite number in China.
Civil Service is nice soft easy job, no pressure compared to the private sector
I'm not saying that's the theory but it's the reality. If it was linked to private sector pay then there would be pay freezes and pay cuts, increases in productivity with fewer employees and pay raises based on productivity based in their opposite number in China.
On a point of information, the Benchmarking process relates to the Public Service (Civil Service and Public Services such as Teachers, Guards, Health Professionals, Local Authorities). The Benchmarking process does not apply to other parts of the Public Sector notably the commercial semi state sector.
I agree. With average wages in the ESB of €80'000 a year (and over €100'000 in some stations) who are they going to be benchmarked against?
is that not an oxymoron?
I cannot believe this was a clinical service.................I have worked in both General Medicine and in Psychiatry and NOBODY would ever dream of getting away with that level of seeing patients. Psychiatrists in the public health service will see about 15 patients in a morning's clinic. Psychiatrists in the private health service will see less - more time for each patient. Consultants in general medicine will often start the day at 8am in order to fit in Ward Rounds with their other duties, and I don't think anyone takes an hours lunch break, and 5.30 would be an early finish. Can you give a little more information without identifying the place?
Article in todays independent (free registration may be required):
[FONT=Arial, Verdana, Arial]Public sector pay a big threat to nation: ISME[/FONT]
from isme.ie
Thursday 23rd November 2006
PUBLIC SECTOR PAY THREATENS ECONOMIC VIABILITY
• Public sector pay a massive 46% higher than the average industrial wage.
• Pay and pensions bill will reach €18bn next year, representing 38% of current Government expenditure. Benchmarking awards will significantly add to this figure.
• Public sector pay has more than doubled since 2000, with employment up 67,000 in the same period.
• Tax increases will be required to pay for unprecedented levels of public sector pay.
• No accountability, no action plans, no adequate services should equal no benchmarking.
• ISME calls for a complete overhaul of the public sector in order to achieve value for money.
[FONT=Arial, Verdana, Arial]Public sector pay a big threat to nation: ISME[/FONT]
from isme.ie
Thursday 23rd November 2006
PUBLIC SECTOR PAY THREATENS ECONOMIC VIABILITY
• Public sector pay a massive 46% higher than the average industrial wage.
• Pay and pensions bill will reach €18bn next year, representing 38% of current Government expenditure. Benchmarking awards will significantly add to this figure.
• Public sector pay has more than doubled since 2000, with employment up 67,000 in the same period.
• Tax increases will be required to pay for unprecedented levels of public sector pay.
• No accountability, no action plans, no adequate services should equal no benchmarking.
• ISME calls for a complete overhaul of the public sector in order to achieve value for money.
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Would that be so that they can get over to the Blackrock Clinic for their real days work before the traffic gets too bad?
It was a psychiatry service in Dublin. The clinicians would compain about 'a mountain of paperwork' to excuse the fact that they would see so few patients. The consultant was out schmoozing with Bertie a few weeks ago and said to me 'I told him about the length of the waiting list', to which I felt like replying 'and did you tell him the reason for it was because you spend more time on your private work and going to conferences than seeing children' but of course that would have been more than my job was worth........ I found the clinicians constantly whinging about the fact that 'we never get any of these bonuses they get in the private sector', it used to make me laugh to myself, they wouldn't last 6 months in the private sector without the coffee breaks and the free scones.........
Wouldn't it be nice if we could just stick to the facts. From the [broken link removed] - Section 24, employee costs
Total number of employees; 8,292
Total salary costs; €537,047k
Average salary is therefore: €64.76k, quite a distance from €80k
But let's not let the facts get in the way of a good lynching.....
D
Dipole
Guest
The Deloitte report on the ESB might be a better place to look than the company accounts. It offers a bit more insight in to the inefficiencies in the company.
[broken link removed]
payroll cost per employee was €95K per employee according to that report.
[broken link removed]
payroll cost per employee was €95K per employee according to that report.
And of course, payroll cost is a completely different metric to salary, as it includes PRSI (employee & employer) and pension contributions.
Given that about 30-35% of the payroll cost comes immediately back to the state in the form of tax/PRSI, perhaps we should show the effective total payroll cost as around €60k per employee?
D
Dipole
Guest
Rainyday, no employer in the private sector gives a damn about how much their employees take home as salary. They only care about what it costs to get a guy sitting at a desk or whatever working productively for them.
That's the reason why my last company retrenched from Ireland and the reason I was sent to India for my current company to train Indian colleagues to do the job I previously did. €95K average per employee is way too much for the ESB.
bearishbull
Registered User
- Messages
- 207
Thats an average, in the power generation part wages average 80k+. The average would include lots of lower paid contract staff and apprentice electricians etc.
THanks for highlighting my point yet again. Given that the state is the employer, and the state gets back 30%-40% of the total cost of employment through tax & PRSI, the 'what it costs to get a guy sitting at a desk' figure is much lower than the headline cost.
Source?
R
rabbit
Guest
Well said, good point. Part of the reason 5000 manufacturing jobs left Ireland in the recent past was because of uncompetitive overheads like electricity. No wonder our electricity costs so much more than most if not all other countries when ESB costs are €95K average per employee.
For the average manufacturing industry, the cost of electricity would be pretty insignificant when compared against the cost of labour. Indeed, the labour component of the cost of electricity (as opposed to the fuel component of the cost of electricity) would be even less significant than the cost of labour. Let's not fall for the IBEC/ISME scapegoating spin.