Why Sinn Fein will never make it into power

Whenever I hear a Shinner politician speak I could swear I can just hear the faint echo of jack-boots in the background.
 
room305 said:
Not a question of "feeling it is okay" more a question of recognising that other countries are free to vote in whatever group of ex-terrorist scum they wish.
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But the weren't. We, in GB and in Ireland, imposed a system of government upon the people of Northern Ireland that meant that terrorists and the murderers behind Enniskillen were guaranteed a position in government. Why is that acceptable for us to impose it on them, while not accepting it here?
 
On RTE news last night Thoireasa Ferris disregarded the suggestion that Sinn Fein has too many N.I. people in it's senior ranks for it to be successful in the rest of Ireland. She said that the senior ranks were split 50:50.

Her answer suggests that the penny hasnt dropped with them on this issue. If the senior ranks were pro rata to the populations, the split would be closer to 75:25. So she essentially admitted that the party's N.I. wing has more influence that the rest of Ireland.
 
BeanPole said:
Why is that acceptable for us to impose it on them, while not accepting it here?
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Because NI was/is a dysfunctional jurisdiction whereby one party rule could not be trusted, therefore you needed the "forced coalition" that was the formula included in the Belfast Agreement (Good Friday Agreement if you like). And a darn fine agreement it was/is IMHO (Sunningdale for slow learners).

While unpalatable to unionists (to varying degrees) it was justifyable as a means to remove the causes of conflict (someone inserted a SF cassette into me). The other basic point is that people vote for SF and why should those people be disenfranchised (sp?), we might not agree with them but that doesnt mean their vote shouldnt count as much as our own.

Finally, for now, all 3 jurisdictions voted by majority to accept it so in what sense was it imposed on anyone?
 
Finally, for now, all 3 jurisdictions voted by majority to accept it so in what sense was it imposed on anyone?
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This isnt true - only Ireland and Northern Ireland voted to accept the Good Friday Agreement. The British werent given a vote. Guess why? Because if they were allowed to vote on Northern Ireland, they'd want to get rid of it ASAP.

Going off point, but I've always wondered if it was a mistake not having a referendum on Northern Ireland in the UK at some point. It would have been very constructive having the British send a message to the unionists that they dont consider them as British and dont want them.
 
Going off point, but I've always wondered if it was a mistake not having a referendum on Northern Ireland in the UK at some point. It would have been very constructive having the British send a message to the unionists that they dont consider them as British and dont want them
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The fallout would have been horrific. God only knows what the Unionists would do.
 
csirl said:
This isnt true - only Ireland and Northern Ireland voted to accept the Good Friday Agreement. The British werent given a vote. Guess why? Because if they were allowed to vote on Northern Ireland, they'd want to get rid of it ASAP.
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I agree that the Brits would probably want Northern Ireland out of the union if they got the chance but there is no legal reason to have a referendum in the UK as the people are not sovereign (the Queen in Parliament is) .
 
mea culpa - I'm sure the queen and the House of Commons/Lords nodded in its direction and wasnt that sufficient guidance for the queen's loyal subjects !!:D Anyway, 2 out of 3 aint bad.
 
Betsy Og said:
The other basic point is that people vote for SF and why should those people be disenfranchised (sp?), we might not agree with them but that doesnt mean their vote shouldnt count as much as our own.
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Thankfully, if the constitutional parties stick to their guns (pardon the metaphor), SF will never share power in the Free State until "themselves alone" achieve the mandate to seize that power. And to answer OP, they will never achieve that by such unpopular shows of defiance as was referred to in OP.

The real hypocrites here are the SDLP, who align themselves with the likes of FF and regard themselves as constitutional. Without the SDLP, SF would never be in power in the six counties. It appears SDLP prefer to side with terrorists than fellow constitutional Unionists.

In their defence, I suppose, if there had been a "consensus of the constitutional" to keep SF out of power there would never have been a peace process. The only difference between Sunningdale and Good Friday is that in the former the IRA had no political platform whereas 25 years later they effectively held sway over the nationalist franchise.
 
BeanPole said:
But the weren't. We, in GB and in Ireland, imposed a system of government upon the people of Northern Ireland that meant that terrorists and the murderers behind Enniskillen were guaranteed a position in government. Why is that acceptable for us to impose it on them, while not accepting it here?
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In NI something had to be done to finally turn all parties to an exclusive peacefull means. To achieve this and given the background in NI, the Du Hondt method gave everyone some share in the political process. The fact that this system was used in the North does not mean we have to accept SF in Government here, apart from the fact that they must elected first.
 
Duke of Marmalade said:
The real hypocrites here are the SDLP, who align themselves with the likes of FF and regard themselves as constitutional. Without the SDLP, SF would never be in power in the six counties. It appears SDLP prefer to side with terrorists than fellow constitutional Unionists.
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Thats a very harsh, bordering on bovine or equine excrement, view. SDLP were the one consistent voice of sanity from 1969 (or whenever they technically formed) to date. Hume was pilloried for the Hume Adams talks, without the SDLP there defo would have been no peace process in our time, sure the Belfast Agreement is practically an SDLP manifesto.

Siding with terrorists?? I dont follow the voting patterns of the assembly, but they both represent broadly the same community so on many day to day matters you'd expect their views to be broadly at one. Should they cosy up to Unionists just to make everyone clappy happy??, hasnt the electoral wipe out (probably an overstatement) been enough of a price to pay?? Basically they brought SF in from the cold for the good of the people of the 6 counties but paradoxically have effectively been punished for it by losing ground to SF.

Do we have to wait for Hume & Mallon to pass on before we put them on the Padre Pio fasttrack to sainthood !! ;)
 
Thankfully, if the constitutional parties stick to their guns (pardon the metaphor), SF will never share power in the Free State until "themselves alone"
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"themselves alone" is poor translation of Sinn Fein - it's the literal translation of the 2 words. The proper translation is "Independence". Though, it should be asked, who are the "Independence" Party in the Dail looking for independence from? Surely the name is inappropriate?
 
Okay, Betsy, sorry for the manure;) I still think if we do get a SDLP/FF link up they are going to find it vary hard to justify different attitudes to sharing power with SF on either side of the border.
 
Duke of Marmalade said:
Okay, Betsy, sorry for the manure;) I still think if we do get a SDLP/FF link up they are going to find it vary hard to justify different attitudes to sharing power with SF on either side of the border.
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Always though that a SDLP/FF link up was strange. Arent the SDLP allied to the Labour Party in the UK and part of the same European Party as he Labour Party in Ireland? Surely a link-up between the SDLP and the Labour Party in Ireland would be more logical?
 
Glad to see that the Shinners are giving up the appartments in London that they were renting off an Irish landlord and claiming the expenses back even though they have never set foot in the House of Commons. That exposed them as a bunch of bare faced hypocrits
 
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