Where are the Polish plumbers?

I'm sure a time served polish/german/czech plumber will be able to figure out the differences in working practices between irish installations and the ones in their home country.

How different can it be in all fairness?

'continental' style building practices are more common in these parts than they were 20 years ago so would we be reluctant to let a paddy plumber work on a 'continental' style system? Of course not.

I am talking about repairs to existing systems. If a polish plumber can't figure out how to fix an existing system with a fault he's not much of a plumber full stop.

It's different if we're talking about new installations as the pole may not be fully familiar with the building regulations (not to say he can't learn them).

In my opinion however continental building standards are WAY higher in general than here. I spoke at length with a german engineering contractor recently and he was working on a large enough project and staying in a rented apartment in Sandyford. I asked him what he thought of it and I knew what he'd say "sh!t, I can hear my neighbours". I've been in umpteen apartments in germany, most would be post war 1950's and 60's I'd say and they are clearly built more solidly than stuff we put up in the last few years! No crappy stud partition walls-all solid concrete or block work throughout. Little or no noise transmission etc. Just better built.

Even our system of Ring Main circuits (copied from Britain) is outdated and can be dangerous. It is unheard of on the continent and while we criticise their 'flimsy' plugs compared to our 3 pin ones the reason for the 13 amp fused plug is precisely because the ring main circuit can carry so much current as compared to radial distribution.

I think I'd be far more worried about an electrician from germany working in my house than a plumber from there trying to troubleshoot a problem in an existing system.
 
Couldn't agree more with Murphaph's sentiments. If overseas building sites or private customers needed a plumber would they really turn away an Irish plumber? I think not. Maybe I've just been unlucky - but I haven't met many Irish tradesmen that filled me with confidence. I have met a good few non national trademen who were very good.
 
My comments were not to knock "polish plumbers", a good trades man is good in any language, but there are some very good Irish plumbers out there. As someone who only deals with gas boiler installations when they go pear shaped, i am put in the position of having to identify installation errors, other faults and than have them rectified, so to be honest my(non national) view would be from the more technical end of things and not the day to day plumbing, i find the working practices on how a installation is fitted of some non English speaking engineers can cause me problems, probably no more so than a Irish installer, but i know when i have got my point over with an Irish installer. I do feel sorry for the Irish consumer, as when a plumber or gas man Irish or not, turns up at your door it's hard to determine there skill level, so the sooner there is a registration system like corgi the better because if your not competent you can't work, and do any work that isn't right you lose your ability to work, giving dodgy installers a incentive to be less dodgy. On the issue of pricing where do you start, when you can't trust bard Gais not to over charge(charging 880 for a job that should be 290) it's very hard for decent engineers who are going to charge the correct amount, i charge 80 an hour i could be out in 15 minutes, thats because i have been doing this for over 20 years, i am sure some people will feel a little short changed.
 
gary71 said:
My comments were not to knock "polish plumbers", a good trades man is good in any language, but there are some very good Irish plumbers out there. As someone who only deals with gas boiler installations when they go pear shape,i am put in the position of having to identify installation errors, other faults and than have them rectified, so to be honest my(non national) view would be from the more technical end of things and not the day to day plumbing, i find the working practices on how a installation is fitted of some non English speaking engineers can cause me problems, probably no more so than a Irish installer, but i know when i have got my point over with an Irish installer. I do feel sorry for the Irish consumer, as when a plumber or gas man Irish or not, turns up at your door it's hard to determine there skill level, so the sooner there is a registration system like corgi the better because if your not competent you can't work and do any work that isn't right you lose your ability to work, giving dodgy installers a incentive to be less dodgy. On the issue of pricing where do you start, when you can't trust bard Gais not to over charge(charging 880 for a job that should be 290) it's very hard for decent engineers who are going to charge the correct amount, i charge 80 an hour i could be out in 15 minutes, thats because i have been doing this for over 20 years, i am sure some people will feel a little short changed.
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Yeah I'd agree with all that. It's amazing we still don't have a CORGI style system here. In the UK it is simply illegal for a non-CORGI to do anything with gas. I feel that's the way it should be here too. Gas is just too dangerous to have amateurs tinkering with it.
 
What I'm saying is it will only be a matter of time before there are a lot of non national tradesmen. with regard to working on gas, I was CORGI reg for four years. It cost about £3500 to train and take the exam. the exam was 1 and a half days practical and 1/2 day theory. even for the most experianced installer it is a hard two days. In the UK you have to show your CORGI card to buy gas related parts. I flew back to Dublin to BG HQ to take a conversion exam and when I moved home I was amazed when Bord Gais told me I could choose to register with them although i could work on gas regardless, It beggers belief! although they did say in the next 18 months it will be fully regulated. I doubt it!!
I also agree with Gary that people often feel short changed, but properly qualfied tradesmen are the best way to go. When you get an invoice you got a guarantee. Anyhow no matter who you use be sure that they are insured, water and gas can cause a lot of damage if installed incorrectly!
 
murphaph said:
... In the UK it is simply illegal for a non-CORGI to do anything with gas. I feel that's the way it should be here too...
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I must disagree most strenuously. In my opinion small sandy-coloured dogs shouldn't be allowed to have anything to with anything as dangerous as gas boilers.

(sorry...)
 
I was building an extention onto my cottage a few years ago and ran out of money so I had to do some work myself.

In a period of a few weeks I put in an oil heating system - toilet / shower / washhand basin and kitchen sink and layed the pipes for a new septic tank. I was amazed how straight forward it was! (I also hooked the system up to a back boiler as I was fond of lighting the fire and I had plenty of trees on my site.


I also knocked out a doorway to connect the old part of the house to the extension - this job one builder told me required a lot of skill and was therefore going to be expensive....I had to put in the windows / insulate the attic / make door frames and hang doors /tac up t&g ceiling boards and I also did the electical but I got an electrician friend to check my handywork and he put in the shower trip switch... ( I now wouldn't do electrical work myself for insurance reasons)

My key point is that tradesmen play up on the it takes years to learn ergo I can charge what I like when in fact alot of the skills could be learned over a few weeks with a good teacher and a willing learner. Did you ever notice that tradewmen like to talk up jobs by using technical lingo. I suppose other professions do this too..

By the way I am not in anyway gifted with my hands - very average but my lack of money one time had forced me to roll up my sleves. I found the DIY Digest very good I also got some advice from my local plumber supplier shop.

I personally think that many tradesmen charge too much for their services - in the good old boom times when they were in big demand they took full advantage of the situation.

I had a small problem with my gas boiler so I called a registered gas agent. The charge was €75 which would be fine if the person / engineer they sent out knew his trade. I watched him work and asked him a few questions as I was interested in the workings of the boiler. He didn't know one end of the bolier from the other. He went outside and rang his boss a few times. I asked him about his training and he told me he worked on machines in a local manufacturing company and he was new to the gas business - this was a so called engineer bord gas approved!!!! Lucky the solution was a simple one - the pressure went down and only required opening a tap to increase it.

My GP will come to my house and do an examination and write a prescription for less than I handed over to this spanner... I have no doubt that the GPs overheads with his insurance is much greater and in the it took me years to learn what I know argument he wins hands downs!!!

Fair play to the Polish plumber - the local lads are very uneasy about the new kids on the block who are making a good living and providing a first class service. A typical defence mechanism is to knock their work or qualifications...

Get real lads - you're not brain surgeons.......
 
You could be right, i think i am going to give up gas fitting and go and fly airplanes, how hard can it be, pull back to go up, push forward to go down i done it on my computer all the way to Japan and back all i need is the hat,
 
Go on lads knock me down - you are the experts after all - How dare I open a tool box and do a good job on my own house..

The house 'Jack' built was built for a fraction of the cost and there was no waiting around and the work was first class...

I am just back from France and the flight cost me the same amount as the glorious gas engineer charged me for ten minutes of fumbling around - so don't give up the gas fitting business just yet...
 
sidzer, what you do in your own home is your business, and self praise,well you know. what puts me out is people who have experianced an under par tradesperson and then tars all tradespeople with the same brush. If you went to a bad doctor would you say all docters were quacks? or a hotel etc. there are loads of good tradepeople who employ staff, pay tax and insurance and guarantee their work. next time you want a skilled person get a recommendention. Or just use a lot of the spare time you seem to have and take a year to learn all the trades!
 
Mr Sidzer, i am only an "expert" because i have made lots of mistakes, but learned from them, luckily for me it was in a controlled environment where my work was checked, till i got to the stage where i didn't make so many mistakes and i started to fix more than i broke(4 years). The problem with taking on any trade is you don't know, what you don't know, but you will carry on regardless, good luck to you and if you haven't noticed, i post on here to help people with the odd query, so i can't be very anti diy now can i. To bore you i could go on and on with story's about people who have had a go at my trade and got it wrong and some have killed people, it happens and i have had to deal with it afterwards, so forgive me for getting a bit arsey when the old "how hard can it be" routine comes out, but obviously as you proved it's all very easy, and i must be over priced, so i should just post out DIY Digest and a spanner and charge maybe 10 euro plus p+p.
 
A friends' mother was recently charged €800 for a days work by a gas fitter to change a gas burner (labour cost). This is what I have an issue with. I know there are many honest people out there who charge a fair rate fot their skills. And I have no problem paying a professional fee for a professional service........
 
Hi Sidzer,
I'm just wondering about your insurance. You said you did the electrics yourself and your friend checked it out. If, God forbid, anything like a fire occurred would the Insurance Company look for proof that the electrics were installed by a qualified electrician?

My brother was going to have a go at the lights in his new house but was told not to, as it would nullify his insurance if he had a fire. Is this correct?
 
sidzer said:
A friends' mother was recently charged €800 for a days work by a gas fitter to change a gas burner (labour cost). This is what I have an issue with. I know there are many honest people out there who charge a fair rate fot their skills. And I have no problem paying a professional fee for a professional service........
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€800 per day (or approx €100 per hour plus VAT) is not cheap but would not be exception for any sort of professional or technical trade service. This would be not a million miles away from the average labour rate charged on a car service for example.
 
DavyJones said:
sidzer, what you do in your own home is your business, and self praise,well you know. what puts me out is people who have experianced an under par tradesperson and then tars all tradespeople with the same brush. If you went to a bad doctor would you say all docters were quacks? or a hotel etc. there are loads of good tradepeople who employ staff, pay tax and insurance and guarantee their work. next time you want a skilled person get a recommendention. Or just use a lot of the spare time you seem to have and take a year to learn all the trades!
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You may have read my previous post bemoaning the unreliability of a succession of amiable and recommended plumbers. They just wouldn't keep appointments or return calls and had no interest in finishing the job. To your point, if a doctor is unreliable and uninterested in their patient and their patient's distress then they may as well be a quack.

I actually got a pm reply to my previous post looking for a reliable plumber in South county Dublin/Wicklow and two more amiable chaps whiled away a hour of their time and ours on a Saturday, talked about the problem and then never kept the appointments or returned calls. Which, given that this was the same behaviour that led to the post to which they responded in the first place was ironic (not to mention exasperating).

As for the previous poster who was concerned about how it might be hard to get a point across to an Eastern European plumber... well, we never seem to have got our point over to Irish plumbers (that we needed expert plumbing help and soon- and maybe a gnat's of customer service in the form of keeping appointments and using the phone like a professional).
 
To be fair 800 euro to change a burner is madness, thats a 90min job max. I can't say all plumbers/ gas installers are great tradesmen or businessman for that matter. try and get one thats recommended.
 
Gatherer said:
You may have read my previous post bemoaning the unreliability of a succession of amiable and recommended plumbers. They just wouldn't keep appointments or return calls and had no interest in finishing the job.
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Out of interest what is the job? sounds like it's a bit of a nightmare and the tradesmen don't want to get involved. they should just come out and say that, if thats the case.
 
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