When putting down floors or new plasterboard ceilngs what is the acclimatising period

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NOAH

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I keep getting conflicting advice on everything to do with renovating a house. The latest is if I decide to put down semi solid floors I should leave the wood in the house for about 6 months so it acclimatises? And for plasterbord it is said weeks is about right?

Is there any general guide anywhere that tells one about these things like,

waiting for concrete to dry, plaster to dry and anyting else I may have missed?

noah
 
Neither semi solid floor nor plaster board needs any waiting/curing time . Check any DIY literature .
 
I'm afraid I have to contradict Heinbloed here, any timber flooring product will need aclimatising, preferably in the room it is to be fitted ultimately. Timber and timber based products are naturally hygroscopic and will readily absorb moisture from the underlying subfloor and the atmosphere, resulting in swelling or cupping. Plasterboard however is not subject to the same criteria, whilst it will absorb moisture if wetted it will not shrink or swell like timber when subjected to wet/ dry cycles. Most timber floor manufactuers will recommend leaving the pack of flooring in the room for a week at least, that is if the building is properly dried out in the case of a new structure, which can take up to a year.
 
Thanks ! But as far as I know - I never laid a semi solid floor myself - semi solids are usualy fully sealed with resin and not permeable . Some are recommended for wet areas , bathrooms etc. ... Am I wrong there ? Sorry if I was wrong .
 
A semi-solid floor is usually composed of a 4mm thick hardwood veneer bonded to a plywood substrate, making it a "semi-solid" hardwood I suppose, as opposed to a floor which is solid through. Although the glue/ resin would protect such a floor somewhat from moisture the timber fibres are not completely impregnated (hardwood is more impermeable than a softwood) so the timber is relatively free to absorb moisture. You might be referring to a laminate floor which is composed of mdf and can be impregnated with resins and binders whilst the front and back face are faced in melamine; dsome of these products are suitable in wet areas, but ultimately they are wood based products and won't stand up to constant immersion.
 
thanks for replies, very helpful. As usual I have a follow up! If I was to use solid wood flooring going down on concrete and I dont want to raise floow level too much can I get away with using a damp proof menbrane and then lay wood on that? if that is the case how long would I need to leave wood to acclimatise?

And if there is a better way to lay solid wood floors on existing concrete floors I would be grateful to know what is the best option? I dont want to lay lathes and then the wood as that would mean easing doors etc.

I wish carpets would come back in fashion!!

thanks for all the help

noah
 
If you wish to lay the solid wood floor as a floating floor you will need to incorporate a resilient layer (foam) as well as a vapour barrier underneath the floor. 1000 gauge is generally recommended as a minimum for the vapour barrier. Before laying such a floor the boards should be conditioned for a minimum of two weeks I imagine, presuming the building is dry, sealed and heating is on at least intermittently. The supplier of the flooring should be able to confirm any other requirements, if in doubt the moisture content of the concrete sub floor can be measured with a moisture meter. Did the packs of flooring come with any laying instructions/ guidelines? Some types of floors can also be glued to the concrete substrate using a special panel adhesive but this will mean omitting the vapour barrier so I'm not sure what the criteria are for the moisture content in this case. Either way I'm not familiar with the technique, again your supplier should be able to advise.
 
thanks for great reply, i am not around all of the time at the moment but back again for a while. As the house is old I am conscious of the possible damp problem. The company that did the survey on damp recommended a dpc mebrane called Platon and left me a sample. When you say a resilientv layer ie foam does that go on top of the dpc membrane? Logic tells me it does but I am now at the stage that I am a bit confused.?

noah
 
The resilient foam layer goes on top of the vapour barrier (1000 guage DPM). The Platon material is good stuff and I've used it on jobs before. I see your other thread refers to floors also. In this regard there isn't much advantage in raising your floor by a couple of inches above the footpath level. The reasoning behind the 6" difference in levels is to prevent dampness and surface water getting into the house. If footpaths and internal floors are at the same level rain water can flow straight in the front door for example. However if you intend putting down flooring on battens your are only creating a small (underfloor) void where water could collect if flood situations arose. There is no real benefit in altering the floor level unless you intend doing it with concrete. IMHO I think you should engage the services of an architect or engineer and get some professional advice based on a site visit. I think it would be money well spent, particularly if you are considering making big home improvements like this. By consulting a building professional you will get an overview of the entire project instead of individual opinions on separate elements without a cohesive solution. AAM contributors like me are limited in the scope of advice they can offer given that I am not familiar with the as-built situation.
 
Thanks again. By way of explanation of my plight. I am new to the area so I have to go on names passed on, the initial survey was done by a chartered architect who is also a town planner!! I then got a damp survey done by protim. The plans that I have drawn up were done by an architect, I got plans for submission to planning dept, and I got construction plans. I also got the original plans from planning office as otherwise architect would have to re-draw existing and add to cost.. I paid a lot for these plans and waited quite a while.. I told architect what my budget was for the renovation and we then agreed on final layout. It is only when seeking quotes for work that I am finding out the drawbacks or the extra work that needs to be done or is suggested needs doing and the quotes so far are 40 - 50% above the architects estimate!! I had a builder round yesterday who is now keen to do the work, I had spoken to him 31 August and heard nothing, he now wants to do work so gave me a quote within 9 hours of seeing me. It is too much but he insisted that I re-plaster all of the interior walls, I am going to replace some of the ceilings but he suggests I replace all of them, as well as doing the building work. The quote was 110k for the lot but excluded, wiring, plumbing, decorating, floor covering, kitchen/bathroom/shower fittings, double glazing etc. All I am doing is extending a bungalow by 12 feet at rear to create a bigger bedroom with a walk in wardrobe, put a bay window in another bedroom that loses its window because of walk in wardrobe, then at front demolish existing flat roof structure, architect reccommnerds I demolish it for a better finish and replace it with a room and integral garage with a pitched roof. Do a few interior changes eg turn bathroom into utility and make the smallest bedroom into a bathroom, knock down wall between kitchen/dining, put ensuite in enlarged bedroom and put and en suite at end of new garage. The work may be labour intensive but I keep getting conficting advice hence posts. It is pointless quoting me for extra work as I dont have the money. I have been back to house today and to my eyes the walls are adequate ie smooth, the floors are about 3 inches above outside footpath, may be more so should be ok for me to lay solid wood with dpm and lay tiles as necessary etc. I am going to ring an engineer today and get him involved but the engineer is recommended by architect.

I get the impression that some of the suggestions are a bit of a try on so I am progressing slowly. If push comes to shove I will just downscale my requirements.

I like your answers as they put into perspective what I want to know, ie I can understand what you are saying.

noah
 
Ok Noah, from what you say floors sound acceptable, in terms of level. Presuming they are reasonably dry you could proceed with your flooring option. But could I suggest a product that would suit. Kingspan do a composite insulation flooring product which consists of plywood bonded to insulation. This will give you a finished floor (ready for timber flooring/ carpet/ lino etc) whilst improving your insulation and sound levels. I know there are other comparable products by other manufacturers. This product wouldn't be cheap but it's quick and easy to lay and gives you enhanced comfort levels. Be sure to lay a DPM underneath the panels anyway, I'd go for a 1200 guage in this instance.
 
ok, but what do I ask for? Had a look on the kingspan site and lost as usual. I take it I can use my platon 1st and then the kingspan and then the wood. It sounds good but what do I get. 1200 gauge is double dutch to me.

NOAH
 
I'll check out the product manuals for you tomorrow in the office. 1200 is a measurement of the thickness, it's standard DPM, grey in colour- any builders merchant will stock it and a big roll will cost less than €80. You won't need the Platon under this floor- Platon is only designed for use under a concrete slab/ screed. If you prefer ring Kingspans Technical department in Cavan and ask for Andrea, she deals with the insulation products. I find Kingspan to be very good on their technical back up-and I don't work for them!
 
As promised, the product you need is Kingspan Thermafloor TF 73 Zero ODP. This product comprises a high performance rigid extruded polystyrene insulation bonded to a Chipboard panel (not ply as I suggested earlier). They state that no vapour barrier is required but I'd put one in anyway. You must use treated timber grounds under any loadbearing elements and under kitchen units, door saddles etc. All joints in panels are T&G which should be glued. I think this product would be a good remedy for your situation, whatcha think??
 
thanks for reply. I looked on web and got a leaflet. I opened a trade account with a builders merchant today and may even have got an engineer. see other posts. I will use that platon membrane with it.

NOAH
 
I really don't see any benefit in using the platon membrane in this situation. It's designed to allow rising moisture to drain away- but then again I don't know your situation. Best of luck with it.
 
carpenter, I am banjaxed now as u mention a vapour barrier earlier!! I thought that platon was that!! I am a bit confused but I will get the hang eventually.

noah
 
Well just to clarify- the vapour barrier/ dpm I refer to is only heavy guage builders polythene whereas Platon is a semi-rigid moulded plastic membrane, costing a multiple of the ordinary vapour barrier.
 
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