What surname to give first child?

[RIAD_BSC]

Myself and my wife got married earlier this year. My wife kept her own surname - she felt very strongly about it. I never pretended to be over the moon about it, but all in all, I wasn't really that bothered and it became a non-issue.

Now, she is pregnant, and we are in dispute over what surname to give the child. I, as most fathers do, want the child to carry my name. She wants it to have her name, or a double barrel name with her name as the first barrel (for reasons I won't go into, a double barrel of our names would sound ridiculous with my name as the first barrel).

Now, I am very upset over this, and she can't understand why. She thinks I am some class of a neanderthal because I want the child to have my surname. But that isn't the case at all.

She won't listen to my arguments, which are basically:

- The woman gets to carry the child for 9 months, and to develop her bond with the child that way. For a father, passing on your family name is an important way to forge an immediate bond with the child. Women underestimate just how important this is to a man, and dismiss it all too easily. But to me, it is hugely important.

- The woman's status as mother will never be doubted by anyone - that is the way society works. But having my name is a public declaration to society that I am the child's father.... That, also, is very important to a man.

- A double barrel name sounds posh and pretentious (see Ross O'Carroll Kelly), which is anathema to our values. Also, a double barrel with my name as the second barrel would inevitably end up with my name getting dropped anyway (my surname is a christian name to most people).

- A double barrel name would mean that my wife, I and our child would all have three different surnames. Some family, eh?

- Even allowing for the above, a double-barrel of our particular surnames would sound absolutely ridiculous. I would not want to inflict that on the child, all because myself and its mother had an argument over whether or not society is "patriarchal".

- My family name, which is highly unusual, will also die out if it is not passed on by me, as none of my siblings have kids, or are likely to ever have them.

Lately, she has been suggesting that we give the child the double-barrel name, and that we all change our name to this name. I almost choked on my cornflakes when she suggested this one..... I tried to explain how emasculating this would be, but she ignored my argument and called me a neanderthal again.

Am I a neanderthal, or is she being unfair by not even entertaining the idea of allowing the child to have my name?

 

[Caveat]

Given the arrangements name wise for marriage, double barrel is the only real answer IMO. It's what I would have expected anyway if I were in your shoes.

 

[RIAD_BSC]

Why would you have expected that? Just out of curiosity.....

As I tried to say above, a double-barrel of our names sounds absolutely ridiculous anyway....

 

[Ceist Beag]

I don't think you're being a neanderthal at all here. I would feel the same way about it. I'm fortunate enough not to have this issue as Mrs B took my surname so I'm afraid I can't offer any suggestions how to win your wife over but I can certainly understand your feelings on it.

 

[pixiebean22]

You choked on your cornflakes when she suggested you all change your name but you have issues that she wouldn't change her name when you married

 

[Betsy Og]

On a practical level it probably makes sense to have the kids with the same surname as the mother - the passport checker is less likely to be suspicious if they are the same.

I'm with you on the husbands name for the kids, if its not then the assumption will probably be made that they are not your kids but are from a previous relationship of hers. If she can marry you and have your kids would it not be the most straightforward for you all to have the one surname.

 

[RIAD_BSC]

You choked on your cornflakes when she suggested you all change your name but you have issues that she wouldn't change her name when you married

I had no issue whatsoever with her not changing her name when we married. She kept her own name, and I wasn't really that bothered at all, as I said in my original post.

It is the child's name that there is an issue over here.

 

[Arabella]

I'm sure that she has given you her reason for wanting this. Just as she gave you her reason for not wanting to take on your name after marriage. The fact that if this is so important to her she should have told it to you when ye both discussed starting a family. This would normally be when you both realised that marriage was on the way. By avoiding or skirting the issue, she was not being honest with you. If she is a feminist you should have realised this before now. She may be trying you out? Who knows. Is she opinionated or contentious on lots of subjects? Regardless, I think she is being rather mean on this.

 

[lou2]

I don't think that you are being a Neanderthal but similarly I don't think that your wife is incorrect here either. The reasons you give in your original post aren't reason enough to give the child your name. The fact that the woman gets to carry the child for 9 months before its born is even more of a reason for it to take the mothers name! I'm no raging feminist but I really don't like the assumption that a woman takes her husbands name when she marries or that a child takes its fathers name when its born as this is blatantly sexist.

 

[Caveat]

Why would you have expected that? Just out of curiosity.....

Just based on your wife wanting to maintain her name after marriage - I would have thought based on that she's hardly likely to agree to using your name for the kids too easily.

 

[TreeTiger]

- The woman gets to carry the child for 9 months, and to develop her bond with the child that way. For a father, passing on your family name is an important way to forge an immediate bond with the child. Women underestimate just how important this is to a man, and dismiss it all too easily. But to me, it is hugely important.

- The woman's status as mother will never be doubted by anyone - that is the way society works. But having my name is a public declaration to society that I am the child's father.... That, also, is very important to a man.

It's not a "well, it's your turn for 9 months then it's my turn" kind of thing!
You seem to think that your child having your name is a public declaration that the child is yours, but "society" will somehow automatically know that your wife is the child's mother? Why do you need this public declaration - and why should your wife not have the same right?

- A double barrel name sounds posh and pretentious (see Ross O'Carroll Kelly), which is anathema to our values. Also, a double barrel with my name as the second barrel would inevitably end up with my name getting dropped anyway (my surname is a christian name to most people).

Whose values is this anathema to? You say "our values", but if your wife is suggesting a double barrel it's hardly anathema to her. Or are you suggesting that it's anathema to yourself and whatever "society" you association yourself with? I occasionally work in schools and to be honest I think double barrel surnames are very common nowadays.

- A double barrel name would mean that my wife, I and our child would all have three different surnames. Some family, eh?

Having different last names doesn't make you less of a family! I didn't change my name when I got married but my husband wanted our kids to have his last name. I didn't feel strongly at the time but now feel a bit of regret that my kids don't have my name in their last name, so I can understand how your wife feels. However, the fact that my kids have a different last name to me has not made us less of a family and was never an issue for them. In any case schools etc. are used to dealing with single/divorced parents where children have different last names.
By the way, in Spain it's commonplace for women to keep their name and for children to be given both parents' last names.

- My family name, which is highly unusual, will also die out if it is not passed on by me, as none of my siblings have kids, or are likely to ever have them.

My kids are the last of my branch of my family, so not having my name is a bit saddening, but I still don't think it's right to force a parent to not give their child their name if they want to, as I said, I didn't feel strongly about it but your wife obviously does.

Lately, she has been suggesting that we give the child the double-barrel name, and that we all change our name to this name. I almost choked on my cornflakes when she suggested this one..... I tried to explain how emasculating this would be, but she ignored my argument and called me a neanderthal again.

Am I a neanderthal, or is she being unfair by not even entertaining the idea of allowing the child to have my name?

Yes, in my opinion, you are being a neanderthal. You say your wife won't listen to your arguments but it doesn't seem like you are listening to hers.

You want your child to have your name (which you say is a Christian name to most people) but not hers.
You say the second barrel (yours) would be dropped because of it being a christian name to most people. I can't see how this makes sense.
You argue that your child needs the same name as you for you to be a family , your wife suggests that all three of you could have the same double barrel name, you say this is emasculating.

So you want to deny your wife's name from your child. She's not trying to do that to you, she's trying to compromise.
But you don't want to compromise. You want it all your way.

 

[circle]

If your surname is a more common first name, you could use that for the baby's first name and then your wife's surname as the baby's surname. It'd have to work with the baby's gender but could be an option for you?

To be honest, I think most double-barrels sound weird to each of the people involved, but not to other people. You could use a double-barrel and then let the first name in the surname become a middle name if you didn't like it after a while.

 

[Ceist Beag]

TreeTiger the problem with double barrel surnames is what happens when your child (with a double barrel surname) marries another person with a double barrel surname and they have children - do their children take on a quadruple barrel surname?! Or do two of the parent's barrels get dropped - in which case you have exactly the same problem of agreeing which two to drop!

 

[truthseeker]

I got married last year and took my husbands name, it was never an issue at all for me - I dont identify myself as a 'name' - I am who I am regardless of whether you call me Truthseeker, Arthur or Mary. Im not particular about names so long as I know what I should be calling someone.

The OP has a situation where he wants his child to have his surname, and his wife wants the child to have her surname. I also laughed at the choke on the cornflakes comment because perhaps the OPs wife choked on her own cornflakes when she realised that the OP would want her to change her name upon marriage? Anyway, the only option here is compromise.

• Give the child a double barrelled name.
• Give the child the OPs surname as a christian name and the wifes name as a surname (if gender suits for the christian name).
• Give the child whatever christian name, and either the OPs or the wifes surname as the middle name, and the other surname as the surname.
• Give the child a christian name, the OPs surname, the wifes surname and when the child is old enough allow them to choose whichever surname they prefer and use that as the legal name.
• Give male children your surname and female children your wifes surname or vice versa.

OP - what are you going to do if you have a girl, and you get to give her your surname, will you be upset if she goes on to get married and take her husbands surname? Unless its a male child chances are the name is not going to carry on anyway.

I dont think your arguments on surname hold much water, and any argument you have - your wife will have the same one right back at you.

 

[PaddyW]

First off, he is not being a neanderthal for wanting what most people see as normal. Secondly, he never once objected to his wife not taking his name when they got married, as he pointed out!

It's a tough one really, hopefully you can both come to some solution on it that suits you both, although it's hard to see where.

 

[bren1916]

Hope you work it out mate....for what it's worth, I think your wife should show a little more understanding of how this is affecting you and how it may affect your relationship going forward..

 

[Purple]

Just based on your wife wanting to maintain her name after marriage - I would have thought based on that she's hardly likely to agree to using your name for the kids too easily.

My wife kept her name when we got married, though she uses my name as well, but the kids all have my name.

 

[foxylady]

i don't think that you are being a neanderthal but similarly i don't think that your wife is incorrect here either. The reasons you give in your original post aren't reason enough to give the child your name. The fact that the woman gets to carry the child for 9 months before its born is even more of a reason for it to take the mothers name! I'm no raging feminist but i really don't like the assumption that a woman takes her husbands name when she marries or that a child takes its fathers name when its born as this is blatantly sexist.

+1

 

[foxylady]

Hope you work it out mate....for what it's worth, I think your wife should show a little more understanding of how this is affecting you and how it may affect your relationship going forward..

And would it not affect their relationship if she just gave into everything all the time to save his ego???

 

[bren1916]

And would it not affect their relationship if she just gave into everything all the time to save his ego???

He 'gave in' as you put it, when she kept her maiden name after they married..it ought not be about giving in anyway, rather compromise.

Marraige is a constant work in progress between people who respect each other's wishes and feelings and after reading the OP it looks to me like the wife is the one who gets her own way here...