What Contributory pension will we get ?

[cremeegg]

My wife and I moved to Ireland in the tax year 1999/00, I am trying to work out what contributory pension we will be entitled to.

My wife, an EU citizen who never lived in Ireland previous to 2000 has paid 52 class S PRSI Contributions every year for the last 13 years and will continue to pay for the 6 years remaining until she turns 66. Between 1999/00 and 2007 she paid the same for 4 of those years and missed 5 years. It is not clear to me now why these were not paid. Can or should they be paid now ?

I am an Irish citizen, but had no PPS number before 1999, ( I worked and had tax deducted as a teenager, but there seems to be no record of that). I have paid a myriad of PRSI contributions under multiple classes since 1999/00 but at a minimum I have 52 paid class S contributions every year since 1999/00.

I have looked in Citizens Info. but am more confused than ever. I will spare you posting the bits I have found there.

Can anyone advise what pension we can expect. Thanks in advance.

 

[jpd]

You need to get a full record of your (both) PRSI contribution record from Sligo - only then could you be given an idea

It could be anything from zero to full pension, but you need to have more information to get a better forecast

 

[cremeegg]

You need to get a full record of your (both) PRSI contribution record from Sligo - only then could you be given an idea

It could be anything from zero to full pension, but you need to have more information to get a better forecast

Thanks.

I have the full record, what more info. do I need to post.

 

[Jim2007]

Given your circumstances, it is very difficult to figure out what your final pensions will be because there are a series of rules that need to be applied in order to ensure your contributions are used to obtain the maximum pension possible by combining the contributions made, if your wife does not qualify for a full pension in either state.

I suggest you contact the pension authorities to see if they will provide you with an estimate. I got this done last year here in Switzerland and the Irish authorities did provide an estimate for the calculation. The key thing for me getting the calculation was that I was able to provide the Swiss authorities with an old Irish payslip from 40 years ago and they took it to the Irish guys. Took about three months to get it.

There is another kick to this, the country that pays the largest part of the total pension is also responsible for the healthcare. In my case that means Switzerland and the HSE have confirmed that I can't access their services unless I continue to pay Swiss health insurance.

 

[ClubMan]

Easiest way to think of it (which doesn't deal with all situations or possibilities but should suffice for many) is that 2,080 (40 years x 52 weeks) PRSI contributions/credits that count for pension purposes gets you the full contributory pension and any less than that (above 520) gets you the pro-rata amount. E.g. 1,040 would get you 50% of the full pension.

Edit: post crossed with @Jim2007's so maybe I'm being too simplistic there?

 

[jpd]

A little, as it could also depend on any PRSI contributions in other EU or associated states - and not necessarily prorata depending on when the OP is retiring

 

[Conan]

Easiest way to think of it (which doesn't deal with all situations or possibilities but should suffice for many) is that 2,080 (40 years x 52 weeks) PRSI contributions/credits that count for pension purposes gets you the full contributory pension and any less than that (above 520) gets you the pro-rata amount. E.g. 1,040 would get you 50% of the full pension.

Edit: post crossed with @Jim2007's so maybe I'm being too simplistic there?

Currently the Dept. Of Soc Prot use two calculation models to determine what State Pension you might get. And you currently get whichever calculation produces the highest figure.
The 2080 contributions will get you a full State Pension under the Total Contribution Approach. If less than 2080, then it’s reduced proportionally.
However the other model, the Totals and Average Model, might get you a higher figure. This model looks at your average number of contributions per annum over your history in the PRSI system (subject to a minimum of
at least 520 PAID contributions). If your average is 48 or more per annum, then you get a full State Pension. If the average is between 40 and 48 per annum, then you get a 98% Pension.
So it’s possible for someone with only a 10 year record (520 Paid Contributions) to get a full State Pension under this latter model if they first started paying A class contributions at say age 55.
However, the Government have announced that the intention is to phase out the Totals and Average method over the next few years and to adopt the Total Contribution Approach only. However how this will be implemented is not yet clear.
Finally, if you have the equivalent of National Insurance contributions in another country with which Ireland has a Bi Lateral Social Security Agreement (eg OECD) then such contributions can be added to your Irish record to generate a higher Irish Pension. In such a case you need to liaise with Sligo to determine what might be your best option.

 

[Groucho]

However, the Government have announced that the intention is to phase out the Totals and Average method over the next few years and to adopt the Total Contribution Approach only. However how this will be implemented is not yet clear.

My understanding - based on remarks made by Minister Humphreys in September and the Pensions Commission Report
is that the changeover will be implemented over a decade, commencing in Jan 2024, and will work as follows:-

Year 1 - total pension will be made up of 90% of amount calculated by averaging + 10% of the amount calculated under the TCA
Year 2 - total pension will be made up of 80% of amount calculated by averaging + 20% of the amount calculated under the TCA
Year 3 - total pension will be made up of 70% of amount calculated by averaging + 30% of the amount calculated under the TCA
.....................................
and so on until .........

Year 9 - total pension will be made up of 10% of amount calculated by averaging + 90% of the amount calculated under the TCA

From Year 10 (which should be 2034) onwards the Contributory State Pension will be calculated purely on the basis of TCA.

But we'd be wise to hold our breath until the legislation is published!