The Anglo Tapes. Does anyone have any sympathy for the two guys?

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ajapale

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I listened to the tapes today and was as shocked and outraged by the contents as everyone else.

However I though the "nervous laughter" and "gallows humour" showed two very frightened individuals coming to grips with the enormity of what was coming down the tracks.
 
No sympathy, but sounded like a couple of guys completely out of their depth. The real ringmasters will not have been stupid enough to discuss anything remotely incriminating over the phone or by mail.
 
They seemed to know exactly what they were doing, I hope the expleters get everything that is coming to them, if that's not treason then what is?? The thing they wanted to save was themselves, they knew the bank was a lost cause - then lies and half-truths hooked the taxpayer. FUMING :mad:
 
Heard the tapes this eve--no sympathy for them at all. Where did the tapes come from? How did they become public? I never caught that bit.
 
mugga said:
Heard the tapes this eve--no sympathy for them at all. Where did the tapes come from? How did they become public? I never caught that bit.
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All landline calls to and from Anglo offices were taped as a matter of course. I'm sure there's a lot more where they came from. Not sure how the Indo got their hands on them though - perhaps an insider as sick as we are of no inquiry to date
 
No sympathy. The bit that really sticks in my craw is where they look forward to being civil servants under nationalisation - "can't lose our jobs". Did you know that we paid these two goons €300k per annum each for 4 years as civil servants.

But let's not overplay the "we were duped" angle. The ploy to sucker the CBI in for €7bn and then get more on the drip didn't actually work - though they are damned for even plotting it.

The official side were not stupid - they knew it was far worse than a mere €7bn ELA. They saw the abyss - 100s of billions in wholesale money that would flee the Irish banking system not to mention the ordinary depositors bank run. This was Armageddon and throwing a few bob at Anglo wasn't going to help. It needed the Master Stroke. They may even have suspected and glimpsed at the possibility of an enormous solvency hole. But as Antion Murphy and Donal Donovan argue, even if they knew then what we know now the Guarantee was the only move - it bought time.

The tapes display deeply cynical and arrogant attitudes at the top in Anglo but they do not prove we were duped into the blanket guarantee. These people had wreaked their havoc over the previous 5 years, it was too late for the Irish citizen to escape the holocaust which was being visited on them.
 
The tapes are indicative of the contempt that bankers in general hold for the public though to have such a conversation knowing it's on tape is extraordinary. That said you will not find a more arrogant and smug bunch of people. It beggars belief that Bowe was head of corporate development with the IBRC until April last year. And it's even more unbelievable that Neary walked off with a golden handshake of €630000 and a pension of €142000 per year, for a job well done :rolleyes:.
 
No sympathy whatsoever,these incompetent donkeys have ruined the State,not just in the short term,their greed have cost incalculable pain to many.

I have heard the phrase Masters of the Universe used to describe them which is just utterly tremendously laughable,my over riding memory of Drummer will be of a man trying to hide behind a sofa in his living room,while Charlie Bird stood outside his front door with a camera crew at his American mansion.

"have some respect Charlie" he bleated several times.

Wonder what his Wife and Kids made of it.

Yeah real master of the universe alright.
 
Knuttell said:
No sympathy whatsoever,these incompetent donkeys have ruined the State,not just in the short term,their greed have cost incalculable pain to many.

I have heard the phrase Masters of the Universe used to describe them which is just utterly tremendously laughable,my over riding memory of Drummer will be of a man trying to hide behind a sofa in his living room,while Charlie Bird stood outside his front door with a camera crew at his American mansion.

"have some respect Charlie" he bleated several times.

Wonder what his Wife and Kids made of it.

Yeah real master of the universe alright.
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That's the most damning thing you can say about anyone; you make Charlie Bird look good.
 
demoivre said:
... It beggars belief that Bowe was head of corporate development with the IBRC until April last year....
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that needs answering by the current Govt...why were these sort of people let stay in their jobs? And Anglo was immune from PS paycuts too if I recall correctly
 
Delboy said:
that needs answering by the current Govt...why were these sort of people let stay in their jobs? And Anglo was immune from PS paycuts too if I recall correctly
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I think that the Dept. Of Finance, Regulator and Central Bank have many serious questions to answer.
 
What i cant understand is why this kind of debacle did not happen sooner. We constantly hear that banking is very complex and the need for experts
to deal with the issues. I disagree. I worked in a bank for over 45 years and in my view the basic problem is simple. Banks borrow money and then lend some of it on. In the fifties i often heard that when banks borrowed funds they lent one third, kept another third in cash and invested remainder in very short dated safe government stocks. This of course limited the amount they could lend but it also protected banks from a "run on their deposits" as they could handle such a situation. Memories of such "runs" were familiar to older customers. Overtime banks began to borrow from large institutions and the make up of their funding made them much more vulnerable and they also increased the level of their lending vis a vis deposits. Apologies for the ramble but in my view it was waiting to happen.
 
Will we ever reach a 'tipping point' where enough people will say enough is enough and something will be done/change or will we forever be 'outraged' for a few days, do nothing and then wait for the next revelation?
 
ajapale said:
I listened to the tapes today and was as shocked and outraged by the contents as everyone else.

.
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Absolutely no sympathy, and am not able to read the article nor listen to the tapes as it would be bad for my health. No doubt here on LOS my seriously negative thoughts are documented on this a few years ago, since then I've been trying to get over it.

David Drumm is an odious man. I'll leave it at that for today.
 
Duke of Marmalade said:
But let's not overplay the "we were duped" angle. The ploy to sucker the CBI in for €7bn and then get more on the drip didn't actually work - though they are damned for even plotting it.

The official side were not stupid - they knew it was far worse than a mere €7bn ELA. They saw the abyss - 100s of billions in wholesale money that would flee the Irish banking system not to mention the ordinary depositors bank run. This was Armageddon and throwing a few bob at Anglo wasn't going to help. It needed the Master Stroke.
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I think the only point most people make is that Anglo was not crucial to the functioning of the Irish economy and if only BOI and AIB were covered by the guarantee we'd have avoided a fair slice of misery.
 
A lot done more to do.

More revelations to appear tomorrow and into the weekend according to Paul Williams.

Marion
 
Betsy Og said:
I think the only point most people make is that Anglo was not crucial to the functioning of the Irish economy and if only BOI and AIB were covered by the guarantee we'd have avoided a fair slice of misery.
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We would have avoided 50%. The other 50% is HUGE , we have I think lost perspective on just HOW much a billion is: AIB so far has cost us 20 Billion, from watching AIB,s business antics over the years I await their whistleblowers.
Boi appear to have been the (least) worst.
Irish Nationwide, makes me shudder.
Ptsb, I think there is a lot to be asked in their Mortgage sales.

On the initial thread;

No sympathy, with Power and High Wages comes Responsibility.
I believe Bankers as a General Body acted incompetently but @ all times with MALICE AFORETHOUGHT !!
 
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