Tenant overcrowding rented house what to do

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Susie2017

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Best friend has three bed semi rented out in a Kildare town. Long term tenant in place for around 8 years. Wife husband and two teenage sons on original tenancy agreement. Anyway sons now grown up and one has married, moved in his wife and baby. House is packed to rafters with clothes, possessions and baby stuff. She walked through today and place is very tight on space and upkeep has greatly disimproved! Looks like something on that programme hoarders. New wife is unemployed and son in low paid employment, no transport and absolutely no hope of renting another place on own without getting financial support from state. Town has three houses or apts to rent on daft, years ago would be dozens to choose from. She has asked them ( son, wife and baby ) to leave and get their own place. Insurance would only cover one family ( I think) . Should she go to prtb ? Wife and child not on tenancy agreement so what can prtb do .. .? How much notice is the original tenant entitled to if she decides she wants entire house back to refurbish ?
 
Six people in a three-bed semi is not overcrowding (once upon a time in Ireland it would been considered ample) or in breach of insurance ... so I wouldn't shout about that aspect but focus strictly on breach of tenancy agreement.
 
Yes rent always on time. Well below market rate but as tenant was reliable and had periods of unemployment she didn't increase it in in line with market price. She has asked extra individuals to vacate. Perhaps she should put it in writing ? She thought insurance was for one family only but are open to correction on that as they are extended family. No trouble from them as such. There are no wild parties or complaints from neighbours.
 
If the rent is below market rate: is it an option to revisit the contract

Create a new contract and add the new people to the contract?

The new contract can use the market rate?
 
This situation does not sit well with me from a moral perspective. The family in question have lived there for many years; it's their home. They pay the rent on time and have been good tenants. We are in the middle of a housing crisis and the next generation have moved back to the family home which is not unusual. The setup, whilst not how many of us would live, is fine and is hardly the Calcutta slums. I believe that the OP is being overzealous.
 
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I agree with the last op re the moral issue and dilemma. Very difficult issue and hard for the family.

Would be careful with overdoing the moral aspects though. The banks are not exactly focused on moral issues when it comes to repaying the mortgage. Neither is the govt in its treatment of landlords or the sector.

It's a societal issue and govt issue to solve the housing crisis not a private landlords. I don't see any support for landlords who are decent and trying to help tenants.

The landlord needs to protect the property and if it is being well looked after and the family are being respectful then perhaps leave well enough alone. At the same time the wear and tear on a house with that many people is much greater so there may be a reason to seek some modest rent increase.

Depends on circumcumstances of the OP. At a minimum the family should hav discussed this and agreed an approach with the landlord, not simply going ahead behind ones back.
 
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The tenants did not discuss the moving in of daughter in law and child with owner. She found out when calling in with some items they had asked for. Im not sure the owner is being overzealous. This is her investment and if there is an insurance issue eg a fire then she may not be covered. She pays tax, PRSI and USC as well as rental insurance out of rental income, not to mention mortgage. There is no profit even as things stand. She repairs all items as and when they do arise. Anyone any experience of what the definiton of a family is in a rental property policy ? does it cover in laws or five adults under one roof ? Im sure overcrowding must be happening all over the country but this doesnt mean landlords can ignore it or just ask for another another rent increase. What if they invite more in laws to stay ?
 
Not sure if this is of any use, but when the tenancy was registered with the then PRTB, and then latterly the Part 4 renewal, names of all adults living in the house were required. Has the family not contravened the registered tenancy by inviting "visitors" to reside in the house on a somewhat permanent basis? I totally agree that it sounds as if there could be an insurance issue as RSI always ask for number of tenants etc..
This is a sticky issue as I am sure your friend will lose them as tenants if they are approached with a rent increase to cover the extra occupants etc... That said it might put her in a slightly better position moving forward. Now that they have been asked to vacate (and yes I would put it in writing), relationships have probably broken down a bit anyway. Highlighting insurance issues and original RTB lease might be the way to go.

I'm sure if the shoe was on the other foot the tenant would not be too worried about the landlords situation. If they were, all this would have been discussed and she would not have found herself in this situation now. Sometimes, good landlords can be totally taken for granted.
 
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Are you sure about that?

I've rented in the past and I'm a landlord, and nobody has ever asked me who lives in a property.

In any event, what is unreasonable about parents letting their kids/grandkids stay with them?
 
No sure on the legalities but if the rent is being paid I don't think she should be kicking up too much. Maybe if she can have a rent review & increase it she might be better off. You have to look at the hassle of evicting paying tenants, who may get someone like threshold involved & how long that may go on. Once that happens then they usually become non paying tenants as there's a dispute. The other thing is that if they do leave the op's friend will have to cleanup & paint the house again to get it rentable so that's another cost she needs to factor in.
If it was me I'd be inclined to leave them alone as long as they pay the rent & don't cause trouble.
 
The RTB always requires, names and even PPS numbers when you register a tenancy. The insurance company on setting up the policy, always require the relationship of tenants, ie: a family unit, couple, or just room mates (and I have been asked for numbers) and the policy is priced on whichever basis, normally the family is cheaper. That's my experience anyway.
We actually have a special condition in our lease now to restrict any permanent visitors without prior agreement. Visiting members of family on a transient basis is a completely different scenario.
 
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