Supposed to close sale, but it turns out seller hasn't bank's permission to sell

Discussion in 'Mortgages and buying and selling homes' started by jjoy80, Dec 6, 2016.

  1. jjoy80

    jjoy80 Registered User

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    Last edited: Dec 6, 2016
    Went Sale Agreed early October on a property. Supposed to close in a few days. Signed my side of things 2 weeks ago. Have been extremely prompt and organised, paid my solicitor, home insurance, life insurance, engineers report, valuation, bought all my flooring and beds (which i feel rather foolish about now) Told my excited little kids (which i feel even more foolish about) and now today have received communication from their solicitor that states that the seller can't close the deal as they have no permission from their lender to sell and no idea when they will get permission.

    I was too shocked and upset to ask any questions. I've been waiting years and years for this and my kids were so excited and i'm so emotionally invested in the whole bloody thing. I wanted to have the keys so I could work on it over the kids holidays and get them moved before school restarts. My lease is due out in a few weeks and I'm going to have to try and deal with that too. So it's a bloody mess.

    I have been told on the QT that this guy owes in the region of €30k to his bank in a residual balance is either not interested in paying it, or looking for a reduction.

    So I'm in total limbo. Do I hang on? Anyone any idea how long this could take to rectify? In the meantime I've no guarantee that the sale will go through or that this guy won't pull the plug in the future, and it's extrememly stressful. Or do I take my money and buy a house from a motivated and organised buyer?

    Surely the auctioneer shouldn't have been selling the property? They assured us everything was in order. Do I have any recourse here to recoup my outlay or do I just have to suck it up.

    I don't know if I should wait in limbo or move on. I'm gutted at the moment, and I would appreciate feedback from anyone who has been in a similar position.

    *edit called the auctioneers and they said they had no knowledge and were never informed and usually people would be upfront about it
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2016
  2. Brendan Burgess

    Brendan Burgess Founder

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    If it's any consolation, it happens all the time.

    You should have known, or your solicitor should have told you, that noting is guaranteed until you have signed contracts back from the vendor.

    You will have to move on. Banks take a long time to approve such sales and it sounds as if the seller is a messer.

    Brendan
     
  3. jjoy80

    jjoy80 Registered User

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    yes i did know...and i guess as the weeks whiled away and i got closer to the date I let excitement take over. Foolish of me. Mostly I wanted to know if it was worth holding out or if I needed to forget about it. Thanks
     
  4. Brendan Burgess

    Brendan Burgess Founder

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    You need to forget about it.

    Try to cancel the stuff you have bought.

    Don't let excitement take over.

    Brendan
     
  5. moneybox

    moneybox Frequent Poster

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    Jjoy80

    So sorry to hear this and right before Christmas too. It is awfully upsetting for you and your kids. I wonder if you have any legal recourse to try and recover your losses. Speak to your solicitor tomorrow.
     
  6. jjoy80

    jjoy80 Registered User

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    Thank you. I'm so upset. Entirely for the kids of course. We've been in 10 different rentals and my eldest is only 10! So we were too excited and lost ourselves a bit. Harsh lesson
     
    moneybox likes this.
  7. moneybox

    moneybox Frequent Poster

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    I don't know if it is the OP's first house purchase but if it is (or was) it's very hard to keep emotions in check. There are hopes, dreams and plans for the future and then it all comes crashing down. It is a regular enough occurrence but devastating for the first time buyer who may not have experience of such pitfalls.
     
  8. jjoy80

    jjoy80 Registered User

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    thanks for your kindness. Yes its our first house afer thinking we'd never get here!!! It's been a long road. I don't know why the vendor didnt disclose his circumstances to the aucioneer. The house is vacant and was previously rented. I feel like he is just using us and our offer as leverage to get the bank to reduce his debt and i'm now not even sure he wants to sell. We were told by the solicitor that he has the funds for the residual balance but is now insisting on a write down. But surely he will have to provide the bank with an affidavit of means and they won't write down if he has the cash? Surely they won't write down a debt in a rising market anyway?

    I'm gutted for our kids and feel so annoyed with myself for telling them.
     
  9. moneybox

    moneybox Frequent Poster

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    Jj89, any update in this? What is your solicitor saying about it. The seller will probably have the funds from sale of property but is banking on a write off of the residual. Sounds like a right messer.
     
  10. jjoy80

    jjoy80 Registered User

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    hi, i think messer might be putting it mildly. Contracts came out originally and said sale funds were to be used to discharge their current ptsb mortgage, followed a few weeks later by a letter from their solicitor to ours saying, actually there is a residual balance but clients have the cash and are going to lodge the money. Based on this our solicitor had us sign the contract. Vendors solicitor wrote yday and said they havent heard from their client about whether they were obtaining a consent to sell or were going to go ahead and lodge the funds to make up the residual balance (which is what they told their solicitor they were going to do). Letter also said, and i paraphrase...we deem their is no contract in place as our clients have not completed. So i take it from this that we can go and get our money back!

    We tried to contact ptsb directly to see if they intend to sell but could get no info over the phone. Friends of ours know the vendor, insist they are wealthy, showed us their recently built palatial home, a monstrous country house, and although they won't put it in writing, their solicitor has said to ours on the qt, that they have the cash to pay the residual but now want a deal from the bank. So, if they are as well off as they appear, I cannot for the life of me work out how they think the bank will give them a deal? But you wouldnt know what way they have their assets divvied up. Rents have never been higher and yet the house we wanted to buy is sitting vacant for 9 months at least, but if they had tenants, they could be coining it in, so I don't understand it. I can't think what the issue might be. Maybe they are stringing the bank along until prices rise and they come out of negative equity, who knows. The EA said they were filling in a progress report for the bank because the vendor now wants a deal...but have since not taken our calls or offered any further info. I still don't know if they knew or not.

    Personally, i've dusted myself off and started viewing again. Havent had the heart to tell the kids yet. I've heard of a number of people that this has happened to in recent times. Buyer Beware!
     
  11. moneybox

    moneybox Frequent Poster

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    Awful story dreadful. Absolutely no protection at all here for the purchaser. The vender deliberately led you on knowing he had no intention of paying the residual debt. As you say it's anyone's guess as to what exactly his financial position is although the palatial house in the country sounds very suspicious.

    I doubt your solicitor will charge you any legal fees as the contract was not completed.
     
  12. Lane One

    Lane One New Member

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    Im sorry that this has happended to you , unfortunatly some ( small percentage ) of people behave poorly in these matters where there is no protection for the buyer .Great advice given above.From the work & efforts you have already inputted, I am certain the experience will pay off long term.You might find that some of the sellers of the goods & policies etc such as life insurance etc may give you a refund.Can i suggest a letter sent directly to any insurance company/s would be a good step . Indeed flooring companies etc should also be understanding , in the hope you will return again in the future , but always best bring or send a written letter .In the past this happened me also when buying , the only option open , was that i put a time limit on my offer as it was difficult to know how many moving parts are on the sellers side of the deal.Check & double check everything & get it in writing .Again the best advice is above , try to not become emotionally involved & the right house will come along. Best of luck .
     
  13. LS400

    LS400 Frequent Poster

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    Ahh, been there on 2 occasions this year alone.
    It's quite surprising the amount of properties out there which shouldn't be on the market for one reason or another.

    It would help a lot if Estate Agents could verify to a reasonable extent if a property is marketable, as it's also a waste of their time and good name when it all inevitably falls apart.

    I believe there should be a financial penalty in certain cases like yours.

    I know in my scenario the response I received from them was that, they take instructions from the vendor, and that's it. Computer says No.. and that's it as far as they are concerned, as they sail into the sunset leaving a trail of financial destruction behind.

    In my opinion, if you commit to sell a property, a questionnaire should be filled out by the vendors which is legally binding to a financial amount which should be deposited by the vendor to the estate agent prior to the sale agreement price.
    That alone would remove an incredible amount of emotional misery.

    It's one sector, I would love to grab by the wats it and make it a more pleasant experience to operate in.
     
  14. elcato

    elcato Moderator

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    I doubt this is true. Not the solicitors fault and he will recoup some costs. I speak from experience.
     
  15. jjoy80

    jjoy80 Registered User

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    AMAZING UPDATE!!

    So I cancelled the house insurances and returned items to ikea, viewed other properties and even bid on one. Went to reapply for a higher mortgage in case we needed it. In a last ditch effort we bought the folio information from landdirect.ie and went into our local branch of their mortgage company to say we were going to pull out of sale. They didnt give us any info obviously and to be honest I don't know if it had any sway at all but out of the blue on monday evening we got a call from our solicitor to say the sale was going ahead. Apparently the vendor decided to lodge the funds to clear the residual balance.

    To say we were amazed is putting it mildly. We closed this evening. Of course Estate Agents fecked off on their Christmas Holidays early today and the keys were in their office. So we paid a locksmith to get us in. Just didnt care at that stage.

    Right upto the last second I didnt know which way it was going to go. We cannot believe our luck. Things just turned around for us out of the blue. Kind of feel bad now for hating so much on the vendors last week (but i was so angry!!). Miracles do happen!!
     
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  16. PaddyBloggit

    PaddyBloggit Frequent Poster

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    Enjoy!
     
  17. jjoy80

    jjoy80 Registered User

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    Thank you! I'm not sure its quite sank in yet! So grateful we are one of the lucky ones!!
     
  18. XMarks

    XMarks Registered User

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    What a nice update. Well done you. Best wishes for you and your family in your new home.
     
  19. jjoy80

    jjoy80 Registered User

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    Thank you so much!
     
  20. moneybox

    moneybox Frequent Poster

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    Congratulations, that's great news. Wishing you and your family all the best in your new home. Have a jolly good Christmas, really glad to see it all worked out for you :)