Sinn Féin Budget reducing the SFT to €1.5M

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AAAContributor said:
In your example, the consultant working fully public with no private pension will not have accumulated pension benefits of €2.3m as at 1 Jan 2014 and so could not apply for a PFT of €2.3m.
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But by 2023 his pension is valued at 3.2M? That seems to be a complaint lots of us would like to have.
 
Allpartied said:
But by 2023 his pension is valued at 3.2M? That seems to be a complaint lots of us would like to have.
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If they are over the threshold by €1.2m, they have a tax bill of €480,000. That's a lot in anyone's book. Yes, they can take the interest free loan but that would also mean a reduction of €24,000 in their pension. A not insignificant amount.

Pensions should not be designed that someone gets slapped with a €480,000 tax bill on retirement. At least cap their benefits at €2m so they don't get hit with a tax bill at retirement if they only have public service pensions.
 
clinteastwood said:
Indeed, but tell me if any of those who don't take the state pension despite having large pension provision..

And 12000E a year is enough 'for them' but 62000E isn't enough for others.
Lovely
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The State Pension is €14,000 a year, not €12,000.

The point, which you’ve chosen to ignore, is that for lots of people, for example those earning lower salaries, €14,000 a year, and potentially €28,000 per household, is more than adequate.

Whereas for someone earning substantially more, €62,000 might be nowhere near enough. You know, the type of person who pays a fortune in tax and actually helps to keep the show on the road for Ireland Inc.

That’s what’s so laughable about Sinn Fein’s idea of a ‘Solidarity Tax’ for high earners. They’re already showing solidarity by earning lots of money and paying truckloads of tax.
 
I love how this has degenerated into having a go at medical consultants and surgeons, and their levels of pay.

They’re literally surgeons.

Years of study, smart to begin with, crazy training, crazy working hours.

I can’t wait to see this socialist utopia where intelligent high achievers who work extraordinarily hard and earn lots of money get shafted because the lazy or the stupid think that nobody should be paid that much.
 
Steven Barrett said:
If they are over the threshold by €1.2m, they have a tax bill of €480,000. That's a lot in anyone's book. Yes, they can take the interest free loan but that would also mean a reduction of €24,000 in their pension. A not insignificant amount.

Pensions should not be designed that someone gets slapped with a €480,000 tax bill on retirement. At least cap their benefits at €2m so they don't get hit with a tax bill at retirement if they only have public service pensions.
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I've long been advocating for a limit on Public Sector pensions of 50k per annum.
If you put a 2m limit on these consultants they will still get a lower pension than if they pay the 480k tax bill on a 3.2m valued pension, so I don' think they'd be up for that.

The very well paid, those earning in the hundreds of thousands have ample opportunity to save, invest and acquire wealth ,without these additional tax breaks.
 
Gordon Gekko said:
I love how this has degenerated into having a go at medical consultants and surgeons, and their levels of pay.

They’re literally surgeons.

Years of study, smart to begin with, crazy training, crazy working hours.

I can’t wait to see this socialist utopia where intelligent high achievers who work extraordinarily hard and earn lots of money get shafted because the lazy or the stupid think that nobody should be paid that much.
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Who is having a go at them?
They get well paid, and, for the most part, do a very good job.
Their pensions are very generous. Their conditions are very generous ( with access to private patients in public hospitals) and additional earning opportunities in other sites.
Why do they, and other wealthy people, require tax breaks to enhance their wealth?
 
Allpartied said:
The very well paid, those earning in the hundreds of thousands have ample opportunity to save, invest and acquire wealth ,without these additional tax breaks.
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They also have ample opportunity to live and work almost anywhere they want in the world. Rising global prosperity is likely to see an acceleration and widening of the opportunities available globally for those with the greatest talent and most prized skills. Those countries that are uncompetitive in relation to taxes and working conditions stand to be roasted on foot of that.

Allpartied said:
Why do they, and other wealthy people, require tax breaks to enhance their wealth?
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Because they're worth it.

They literally keep people alive.
 
The point you seem to be missing is that there are already restrictions in place.

Personal contributions are limited to a % of €115k.

Someone on €500,000 is paying a huge amount of tax.

You want to stick an arbitrary €50k cap on pensions. Why?

This is a vibrant outward looking economy. People should aspire to earn lots of money.
 
What about best practice in relation to planning for retirement?

You know, targeting a percentage of your current income as your retirement income?

But, oh no, let’s just pluck a figure out of our backsides that’s the maximum people should get.

€50k? PAs get paid €50k these days!

We’re literally talking about heart and brain surgeons here, some of our smartest highest achievers who’ve studied and trained for years.
 
T McGibney said:
They also have ample opportunity to live and work almost anywhere they want in the world. Rising global prosperity is likely to see an acceleration and widening of the opportunities available globally for those with the greatest talent and most prized skills. Those countries that are uncompetitive in relation to taxes and working conditions stand to be roasted on foot of that.
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Irish hospital consultants are among the best paid in the world. What more do you want?
www.irishtimes.com

Irish hospital consultants among highest paid in the world

Ireland spends less on health than other western European countries as proportion of GDP
www.irishtimes.com www.irishtimes.com


T McGibney said:
Because they're worth it.

They literally keep people alive.
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So do nurses, and fire fighters, and paramedics and a host of emergency workers. Hospital Consultants are part of highly skilled, highly complex teams and, on their own, they can't do anything.
Again, I have no objection to high salaries, for high skills, but shouldn't that be enough? They still get all the tax benefits, for pension purposes, up to the SFT. I don't see why it needs to be as high as it is.
 
Gordon Gekko said:
What about best practice in relation to planning for retirement?

You know, targeting a percentage of your current income as your retirement income?

But, oh no, let’s just pluck a figure out of our backsides that’s the maximum people should get.

€50k? PAs get paid €50k these days!

We’re literally talking about heart and brain surgeons here, some of our smartest highest achievers who’ve studied and trained for years.
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Its a retirement income, guaranteed by the state, increasing with inflation and payable for life.
If high earners have managed to squander the 13k a month they get, after tax, then maybe they're not as bright as you claim and deserve to be living on the average working wage, when they retire.
 
T McGibney said:
The guts of 20 years ago, my fit and healthy father suffered a rare illness that is on average contracted by one person a year in Ireland. It isn't normally fatal but the treatment he underwent ended up killing him, basically because Irish-based hospital consultants lacked collective expertise on the condition and how best to treat it. Had the country not undergone a pretty much continuous, and still continuing, brain drain of hospital consultants in the years and decades previously, it's quite likely he would have fully recovered.

By all means, welcome the hammering of hospital consultants if you're so ideologically inclined. But don't be surprised some day if the consequences of that comes back to badly bite you or a member of your family.
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The hammering was
Gordon Gekko said:
The State Pension is €14,000 a year, not €12,000.

The point, which you’ve chosen to ignore, is that for lots of people, for example those earning lower salaries, €14,000 a year, and potentially €28,000 per household, is more than adequate.

Whereas for someone earning substantially more, €62,000 might be nowhere near enough. You know, the type of person who pays a fortune in tax and actually helps to keep the show on the road for Ireland Inc.

That’s what’s so laughable about Sinn Fein’s idea of a ‘Solidarity Tax’ for high earners. They’re already showing solidarity by earning lots of money and paying truckloads of tax.
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Gordon, if thats the case, they dont need to rely on the public purse for subsidies. They are self-sufficient. If you are earning 300k, well good luck, what do you want ?...if you dont like the music, leave the band.

Re:14k, sorry , can't spend all day on this forum. Have a day job to maintain and all that. What about it - do you want a medal?
And if an OAP can't survive on 62k a year, well, I suggest they downsize.

Cut your cloth according to your measure, or switch golf clubs to somewhere cheaper. There are 1000's out there with nothing, living in sheds/tents/sofas - switch yacht clubs from the RCYC to Passage or shop in Lidl if you need to stretch your largesse.
 
T McGibney said:
The guts of 20 years ago, my fit and healthy father suffered a rare illness that is on average contracted by one person a year in Ireland. It isn't normally fatal but the treatment he underwent ended up killing him, basically because Irish-based hospital consultants lacked collective expertise on the condition and how best to treat it. Had the country not undergone a pretty much continuous, and still continuing, brain drain of hospital consultants in the years and decades previously, it's quite likely he would have fully recovered.

By all means, welcome the hammering of hospital consultants if you're so ideologically inclined. But don't be surprised some day if the consequences of that comes back to badly bite you or a member of your family.
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I mean't , if you have already a pot of 1.5Million, that I'm sure you can manage.

I dont need a lecture regarding the merits or otherwise of the HSE, Dr's Nurses, Surgeons, we have ALL experiences of it.
 
clinteastwood said:
I mean't , if you have already a pot of 1.5Million, that I'm sure you can manage.

I dont need a lecture regarding the merits or otherwise of the HSE, Dr's Nurses, Surgeons, we have ALL experiences of it.
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Last time I checked Mr.Eastwood had a networth of €375M. Wouldn't want him operating on me though.
 
Gordon Gekko said:
Same.

It was there in the past, but there’s just a generic reference in this year’s document to ‘ending gold plated pensions’.

I don’t really get the point of the proposed increase in the Dividend Withholding Tax rate to 33%. It just creates admin for companies and for people to either top-up their tax payment or to get a refund of the tax.

Not much to cheer about in the Gekko household though. €520 extra per year in Child Benefit for the three monkeys on the plus side, devastating changes on the other.
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You should be paying Income Tax on child benefit .
 
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