Should a public servant get married before they retire to maximise pension benefits?

Brendan Burgess

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I was told yesterday of a couple who had been living together for years but got married "suddenly" because she was about to retire from the public service.

If they had got married after she had retired, he would qualify for no benefits.

Is this correct?

Brendan
 

Early Riser

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If they had got married after she had retired, he would qualify for no benefits.
I think this is true if she is a member of the "Original Scheme". Essentially these are people who joined before 1st Sept, 1984, and who did not opt to change to the Revised Scheme when it was introduced. This restriction does not apply to the Revised Scheme. However, they would still need to marry at some stage, ie, I believe "common law" marriages are excluded.
 

DK123

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Am i right in saying that if a civil servant male aged 70 years who joined the public service before 1st September 1984 marries a lady of say 30 years and he passes at age 90 and if she also lives to age 90 then the pension [widows]is extended by 40 years.Way to go perhaps!
 

dereko1969

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Am i right in saying that if a civil servant male aged 70 years who joined the public service before 1st September 1984 marries a lady of say 30 years and he passes at age 90 and if she also lives to age 90 then the pension [widows]is extended by 40 years.Way to go perhaps!
I heard of a case like that happening, except the delighted wife was a good bit younger than 30, it was a fake marriage done to put one over on "the man".
 

Early Riser

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Am i right in saying that if a civil servant male aged 70 years who joined the public service before 1st September 1984 marries a lady of say 30 years and he passes at age 90 and if she also lives to age 90 then the pension [widows]is extended by 40 years.Way to go perhaps!
I take it you are a lady of of say 30. You need to look into it a bit more carefully. You could be left with nothing.:)
 

Mrs Vimes

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An American Civil War pension was paid for 155 years after the war ended, although that was to an orphan rather than a widow.

There was also apparently a widow who would have been eligible to claim until now, although she didn't :rolleyes:.

John Tyler was US President in 1841, his grandson is still alive.
 

Leper

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A couple of things:-
1. Somebody who served in the Public/Civil Service from pre 1984 dies. The spouse of this person (no matter what age) is entitled to half the pension entitlement of the person who died.
2. I cannot categorically say if the marriage took place after retirement the same entitlements obtain, but I think they do and can see no reason why not.
 

SGWidow

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Leper,

1. What happens if a pre 1984 public servant never paid the "spouse's pension" contribution?

2. The reason "why not" is because there could be a condition that the spouse's pension death in retirement is only payable where the member was married at the point of retirement. The purpose of the thread is to find out if this condition exists or not.
 

Early Riser

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Somebody who served in the Public/Civil Service from pre 1984 dies.....

2. I cannot categorically say if the marriage took place after retirement the same entitlements obtain, but I think they do and can see no reason why not.
People who joined before 1984 would have been members of the "Original Scheme" (ie, Spouses and Children Scheme). When the Revised Scheme was introduced for all new entrants 1984 there was an option for those in the Original Scheme to transfer. Some did and some didn't. I don't know the duration of this window to transfer. There are some differences in entitlements between the two schemes, including the exclusion of a survivor's pension benefit if the marriage took place after retirement. Also, a member of the Original Scheme who remains unmarried at time of retirement is entitled to a refund of contributions paid. This does not apply to members of the Revised Scheme. See Section 16 here:


16.12 Whereas the eligibility rules set out in paragraphs 16.9 to 16.11 are common to both versions of the Scheme, the Original Scheme contains additional restrictive clauses which exclude the following categories of persons from benefit:

(a) non-marital children of members;

(b) children conceived or adopted after a member's retirement/resignation;

(c) where a member marries after retirement/resignation, the spouse (and stepchildren, if any) of that marriage;

(d) where a member is widowed before joining the Scheme, and does not remarry before retirement/resignation, the children (if any) of the original marriage. Where the deceased was a member of the original scheme and was married during scheme membership, a non-marital child may qualify for benefit in certain circumstances – the Department of Finance should be consulted for guidance in such a case.
 

SBarrett

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It is usual in defined benefit pensions that you have to be married before you draw down your pension for a spouse's pension to apply. Or if they are retained benefits i.e. you had left the scheme, you had to be married before you left employment. It would be unusual for a scheme to allow someone the spouse's pension after they had left. It will be in the scheme rules which will be available online.


Steven
www.bluewaterfp.ie
 

Early Riser

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It is usual in defined benefit pensions that you have to be married before you draw down your pension for a spouse's pension to apply. Or if they are retained benefits i.e. you had left the scheme, you had to be married before you left employment. It would be unusual for a scheme to allow someone the spouse's pension after they had left. It will be in the scheme rules which will be available online.
Spouse's (and children) pension benefits are applicable to all public servants in the Revised Scheme, including where the marriage takes place after retirement. That is all pensionable public servants who joined after 1 Sept, 1984, and members of the "Original Scheme" prior to that date who opted to transfer to the Revised Scheme. (I assume this continues to apply in the Single Scheme, but I am not sure).
 

SGWidow

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Thanks Early Riser,

You certainly know your onions and scallions!

May I ask a question please. Where a lady (pre 1981) elected not to make contributions and she is still in employment, is there an option for her to catch up on the missed contributions (in the year or so before her actual retirement)?

[If she is allowed - any sense of how costly the "payback" is?]
 

Early Riser

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May I ask a question please. Where a lady (pre 1981) elected not to make contributions and she is still in employment, is there an option for her to catch up on the missed contributions (in the year or so before her actual retirement)?
I'm afraid, SGWidow, I don't know. It would be worth checking out with HR but I suspect not. If the lady was already serving in 1981 and opted into the scheme at that time it would be possible to pay for any service prior to that date. But I would be doubtful if it applies if she didn't opt in at all. But she should ask HR.
The cost of buyback (when allowed) for a pre-1995 public servant is :

1% of retiring salary for each year of relevant service, less any years in respect of which periodic contributions (or purchase contributions) were paid; plus
(b) for members appointed before 6 April 1995, 1% of pensionable allowances (if any) (including 1% of the monetary value of pensionable emoluments in kind) for each year of relevant service
 

Early Riser

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The Survivor Pension also applies to Civil Partnerships.

I am not familiar with the arrangements for cases of divorce, remarriage, etc.
 

gipimann

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For information:
If a woman opted not to join the revised scheme and changed jobs after 1984 to another public service job where the Superannuation or CS scheme applied, she is automatically opted in to the revised scheme.

Arrears of contributions from date of first employment to the date of being opted in will be taken from the retirement lump sum.

(I was that soldier, and only avoided a big bill because I was divorced).
 
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