Shannon

M

Mr Bush

Guest
The barriers are going up. Passes for residents etc will be issued from Monday. It looks like its going to be really inconvenient for me to go about my business on Friday and Saturday due to George Bush!
 
Re.Shannon

Or do you mean due to the D4 socialists, professional protestors, anti globalisation/anti American imports from England and the odd person who actually opposes the war in isolation from the rest of the herd, who are planning to disrupt his visit?
 
Re: Re.Shannon

and the odd person who actually opposes the war in isolation from the rest of the herd

The odd person? Are you saying that those Irish people who oppose the war are in a very small minority?
 
p is rite

I agrree with P but note that we are also put out when these races and marathons are run, etc. and we have to divert all over the place
 
Re: p is rite

So then you don't believe that people should have the right to protest because it's an inconvenience?
 
Shannon...

Interesting to note the Shannon region residents complaining about inconvenience of the Bush visit, while simultaneously arguing the case for US military planes to stop there.

Happy to take the king's shilling while it suits, apparently...

Aside: can the Shannon stopover be justified in these economic times? Won't it soon suit transatlantic carriers to overfly Ireland completely, refuelling and stopping in Britain instead?
 
Re: Re.Shannon

Or do you mean due to the D4 socialists, professional protestors, anti globalisation/anti American imports from England and the odd person who actually opposes the war in isolation from the rest of the herd

Contrary to that belief the upcoming protests are being backed by 170 Irish lawyers "including 16 of the country's most senior barristers", who are "strongly critical of what they call Mr Bush's illegal war policies."

www.rte.ie/news/2004/0621/bush.html

If I'm to be fair I sometimes cringe when I see certain war protestors on TV, as they sometimes do little for the cause.
 
anti-american

I'm sick sore and tired of people confusing "anti-American" with being against certain American policies - or even a lot of them!

Am I anti-Irish if I dislike some of our governments' policies? Am I anti-Irish if I dislike our present government's policies? What does it take to be anti-Irish? Against the Irish language? The Irish way of life? Traditional music? Temple Bar?

Get a grip. Define your terms. Even better, clarify your meaning.
 
Re: anti-american

I'm sick sore and tired of people confusing "anti-American" with being against certain American policies - or even a lot of them!

You're not the only one Bridget.
 
Re: anti-american

I'm sick sore and tired of people confusing "anti-American" with being against certain American policies - or even a lot of them!
Click to expand...
I agree as well. I often find discussions on why the US is wrong to be in Iraq moving into an anti American-anti globalisation debate. They are both legitimate things to protest about but while linked they are distinct.
If I'm to be fair I sometimes cringe when I see certain war protesters on TV, as they sometimes do little for the cause.
Click to expand...
That's the thing, it leaves the whole antiwar crowd open to the charge that they are a bunch of tree hugger's who don't understand the real world.
By the way the "anti war" movement is not an antiwar movement. It is an "anti any war the Americans are in" movement. If that is not the case please tell me of any other war that they have held street protests about.
Where were they during the Rwandan genocide?
Where were they when millions died(and are still dying) in Congo?
Where were they when the hill tribes were wiped out in Burma?
Where were they when Iraq invaded Iran?
Where were they when Russia went back in to Chechnya?
The list could go on....
And don't tell me that it is because of Irish support that they are protesting against this one, we support wars all over the world. We sell beef to armies in Africa who engage in mass murder, we sold it to Saddam's army when he invaded Iran.

We sell computer software and duel use hardware to British arms companies who sell it on to anyone with enough pillaged money to buy it.
We hid behind America and Britain for 50 years during the cold war. We have a bloody cheek to protest now because any blood on the Americans hands is on our hands. It's about the sin/crime of omission.
 
Re: anti-american

That's the thing, it leaves the whole antiwar crowd open to the charge that they are a bench of tree hugger's who don't understand the real world.

I'd agree with that. They sometimes give that impression and in-turn do themselves no favours.

By the way the "anti war" movement is not an antiwar movement. It is an "anti any war the Americans are in" movement. If that is not the case please tell me of any other war that they have held street protests about.

While I get the point you're making I don't necessarily agree. I've heard this argument before. I agree that there is a certain amount of hypocrisy. That's not to say that there aren't a lot of people out there trying to make a difference in those wars that don't get mentioned so much.

Bear in mind that with this particular war (Iraq) and the "War on Terror" more people are out protesting that would never have done so before.
The significance with this war (and this President) over others is pretty obvious. That's why it gets so much more 'air time'.
 
Re: anti-american

Interesting to note the Shannon region residents complaining about inconvenience of the Bush visit, while simultaneously arguing the case for US military planes to stop there.
Click to expand...

How do you know you are talking about the same people? Surely all sectors of society (national and local) are divided on this, and other current affairs questions?
 
American foreign policy

Bridget made the following statement:


"Am I anti-Irish if I dislike some of our governments' policies? Am I anti-Irish if I dislike our present government's policies? What does it take to be anti-Irish? Against the Irish language? The Irish way of life? Traditional music? Temple Bar?"

Fair enough. So let me ask this: would it be anti-Irish if an American(or anyone for that matter) strongly opposed Irish pressure via Brian Cowen and/or the many other Oirish lobby groups here and in the States to "regularise" the thousands of "undocumented" (not illegal, of course!) Irish persons there on the grounds that it's bad foreign policy?
 
Re: American foreign policy

Zeus,

I think when people object to this American governments 'foreign policy' they are generally referring to it in terms of its military decisions.

I doubt very much anyone (be they American or otherwise) would be called anti-Irish if they opposed what you wrote.
 
Irish Illegals and American foreign policy

I'm not so sure, Piggy. If Bush were to say something along the lines of, "I have no plans to give the Irish here illegally an amnesty" do you really accept he would not be called anti-Irish by the Bush-baiting media? It would make the front page of the Irish Times and plenty of hot air would be spewed out on Joe Duffy the following day. And what if America decided to enforce its laws as a matter of foreign policy and the tens of thousands of Irish illegals currently there were deported on planes as were the Nigerians and Romanians here illegally were recently? Would that provoke a Bush-hates-Irish backlash?

We amend our constitution to block citizenship to some BORN here and in the same breath attempt to pressurize America to grant legal status to Irish lawbreakers who think it's a rite of passage to gatecrash America to make a few bob supported by phony documents and we expect to be taken seriously?? Hypocrisy, my friend!
 
Re: Irish Illegals and American foreign policy

I'm not so sure, Piggy. If Bush were to say something along the lines of, "I have no plans to give the Irish here illegally an amnesty" do you really accept he would not be called anti-Irish by the Bush-baiting media?

I agree. He might very well be called anti-Irish. That doesn't necessarily make him anti-Irish though. I think that's the point Bridget was making about the use of the term here on AAM. Calling someone anti-American doesn't make them so and it's used all too often.

We amend our constitution to block citizenship to some BORN here and in the same breath attempt to pressurize America to grant legal status to Irish lawbreakers who think it's a rite of passage to gatecrash America to make a few bob supported by phony documents and we expect to be taken seriously??

Without knowing much about the pressure you're referring to I'd agree with you. It doesn't sound right. I'll have to read up on that subject.
 
Bush

I suppose the mobile phone network will be off for a time on Friday?
 
anti-irish

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would it be anti-Irish if an American(or anyone for that matter) strongly opposed Irish pressure via Brian Cowen and/or the many other Oirish lobby groups here and in the States to "regularise" the thousands of "undocumented" (not illegal, of course!) Irish persons there
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no of course it wouldn't be 'anti-Irish'. Plenty of people would call it so in order to drum up the emotions, but that doesn't make them rational or right. In fact I'm astonished that illegal immigration is able to make such a case for itself - but it's usually a 'human' reason.

Compassion isn't always the same as the law. We do need both, but most of the illegals knew what they were getting into, so I find it quite hard to be as 'compassionate' as the lobby groups seem to think they deserve.... It's not like they were fleeing persecution.
 
antiwar protests

PS anyone know of anti war protests planned for Dublin?
 
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