Send child to private school

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Liamos

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Would you send your child / children to private school if you could afford it? Had this discussion with a few people over the weekend who are in favour of it and can obviously afford it. My eldest is 6 so we would have a few years to save. Only problem is there are two more coming after him!

But I do wonder would it be money well spent or is it just a sign of snobbery?
 
Think the results generally speak for themselves but there are plenty of just as good non fee paying schools. I don't think it is snobbery.
 
I think you are allowed afford your child the best education you can provide. If someone wants to call that snobbery, you can call their attitude begrudgery.
 
I think a lot depends on the schools in question and the ability and apptiude of your kids.

Some kids have no interest in books/academic type activities but may be very good with their hands and a school that did more woodwork/metal work may be more benificial then one that still taught Latin.

Having gone to a boarding school myself, I also would wonder about the ethos of some of those schools. Certainly I've seen kids very into sport getting poor exam results simply because they gave their all for the school on the pitch
 
I've noticed, through observation over the years, that the best schools are the better non-fee paying schools in middle class areas. All things considered, kids from these schools seem to have the best outcome. The school league tables we see published from time to time show the % of kids who get into college. What they dont show is the % of kids who graduate from college with good degrees leading onto good jobs. During my own time in college, it was very noticeable that the highest drop out rate was with the wealthy kids from private schools. Probably a number of reasons for this including: i) were 'hot housed' to get into college in the first place, so maybe short on natural ability/aptitude, 2) they're not as motivated as other kids - sure they'll inherit daddys fortune or get a job in daddys company - college is just there to fill a few years, 3) the lack of focus - as dont 'need' to get a good degree - they tend to drift from course to course without actually finishing and because they can afford the fees etc.
 
It depends on where you live, the standard of the secondary schools and the ability and interests of your own child, as has been mentioned before. Like yourselves we could probably stretch for one child, but not for the three we have. Our oldest is 7, and I'm pretty sure we will be looking at third level fees by the time she gets to that level, if she wants to go, so that's another factor.
 
Liamos said:
Would you send your child / children to private school if you could afford it? Had this discussion with a few people over the weekend who are in favour of it and can obviously afford it. My eldest is 6 so we would have a few years to save. Only problem is there are two more coming after him!

But I do wonder would it be money well spent or is it just a sign of snobbery?
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Forget about the snobbery business.

What do you hope your children will achieve by sending them to a private school?

Marion
 
sure they'll inherit daddys fortune or get a job in daddys company
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Not that we are being in the slightest bit sexist here...


Re the school debate:

Choosing a school on the basis of whether you might pay a fee or not strikes me as being the daftest element to be making a decision on.

Start first with where you live: list the schools within your immediate travel range and which your child can get to without you having to drive (walk/bus/cycle) (3 x 6 years each is a lot of driving).

Ethos: religion / single sex / mixed - what it says, what would your preference be?

Other children in the family: if you go for a single sex school, will you have to cope with two different schools possibly in two different directions?

Feeder schools: what primary school will your child attend? It is a feeder school for your preferred secondary school?

Curricular emphasis: all schools broadly offer the same subjects but many are known for a better than average Art or Music or Sports dept. Depends on what aptitude your child has, but this may be a factor.

Enrolment criteria: a particular school might well be your preference, but are you there's? Check out the enrolment policies of your chosen schools.

If you've done all that and the best school turns out to be a fee-paying one, you have two choices:

  1. bite the bullet and do without the overseas holidays & new cars and foot the bill
  2. or find the next school on the list that isn't fee-paying and pay for 'extras' (Art/music/swimming/ grinds whatever) after school yourself.

Either way, the single most important influence in a child's education is parental support - if a child has that, they are streets ahead.
 
Thirsty said:
Either way, the single most important influence in a child's education is parental support - if a child has that, they are streets ahead.
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I agree with a lot of your post, but not with the last statement above.

IMHO the single most important influence in a childs education is his/her peer group. I didnt go to a good school but I was top of my classes with my friends, we worked in competition with each other. We pushed each other to do well. None of our parents were especially supportive. Actually my own mother wanted me to forget my 'big ideas' of college and get a job as soon as I finished school. But all my friends were set on college, so I was too. I had to fight my corner and research all the info without parental support, and I was told that not a penny could or would be contributed by them - but as my friends were in the same position, it was ok - we encouraged each other.
 
@truthseeker, you'll find the published research bears out what I've said. Teachers in the field will confirm it also, children with parental support do better.

In your case I would say the determination to succeed came from somewhere, even if the direction wasn't what your parents were keen on. As my mother would have said 'it wasn't off the grass ye licked it!' :)
 
I really think the parental involvement and the child's own motivation are the primary things to help a child achieve their potential. we've just had a daughter sit the leaving this year and her friends would be in a variety of private schools, grind schools and herself in a good middle class secondary school. The majority of friends in the grind schools did somewhere between " very well to ok". Majority in the private schools did " very well to ok" and the majority in the middle class secondary did " very well to ok". The one common dominator is that all her friends would be from families where education is valued. No major differences between them all from a results aspect but for an overall general good education with sports, extra curricular activities and good allround craic and fun, I'd stay with the normal secondary school. By the way, the only 600point pupil I've come across this year came from the secondary school but would have parents who are very involved in their child's education, the child herself was very motivated academically and in sport from a very young age. Ok, this all isn't scientifically proven, but from what I can see over the past 14 yrs of children's education, its the parental involvement combined with a child's own personal motivation.
 
Parental involvement + student's own motivation + student intelligence + facilitation by teacher.


Can't go wrong with that.

Marion
 
I think "Milieu" should be added to that list Marion.,

Reason being,if you are in school with a gang of others who are dossers ,it is very very difficult to be different,it doesn't matter if its a private or public school.

Of course there are exceptions to this.

I watched a programme with David Coleman,who took teenagers out of their normal environment and brought them to a quiet place in the country,they all seemed to excel,as there was an milieu of doing the right thing.They were "allowed " to be what they wanted to be without the pressure of the local milieu.

I felt so sorry for them,having to go back to their normal place of living.
 
Does fee private school equals better education? Absolutely not! It is like everything, it depends on the people who are running the ship really.
You could have great teachers in the public sytem alongside not so great teachers and the same in the private sector.

I suppose you would have to do your research beforehand, speak to parents who have or, better, had their children in the school to get a feel for the actual school.

Although chilldless, I have had many dealings with schools. I used to be my work environment for a few years..it was a private school with all the celebrities & so called celebrities would bring their kids. What I've found was a willingness to please the parents rather than conveying to them excatly what was going on with their kids at school, which to me was not comprehensible. This may be a slighlty different scenario/school I'll accept that.

I would personally (when I have kids) search for a public school before I take a look at anything private though.
 
Some kids may not want to go to college. This can be upsetting for parents who may have shelled out thousands for fee paying schools, in the hope of 'buying' a good leaving cert, in order to ensure a college place. As another poster mentioned, the private school kids may not need qualifications and jobs as they can go into their parents business anyway. The middle class kids in public schools know they have to get qualifications and jobs, as their parents are not wealthy.

If I were you I would try to send kids to a public school in a middle class area. If their peers 'expect' to go to college and are not dossers, then your kids are more likely to do well at school and aim for college.

I don't know if parental support is important to encourage kids to go to college. I am in similar circumstances to Truthseeker. I had a rural working class background, went to a city school. Most of my peers 'expected' to go to college. In fact one friend (farming background, eldest of 11 said that in her house it is an understood thing that everone goes to college!!!!!)

My parents discouraged me from spending time studying in secondary and felt that college was a lot of nonsense. This was in the late 80s. They had the idea that I was getting ideas above my station, aiming for college, even though I was naturally bright and got 6 honours in leaving cert. They made it crystal clear that they could or would not contribute towards college even though I was an only child and they could afford it. I had to try to get a college place in my hometown, then ensure I had my 4 honours for the grant. I would not be allowed go to college away from home, even if I applied for and got medicine, dentistry etc. (Our local college didn't offer these courses)

I really valued my college place because I knew I had to fight like mad for every single thing that contributed to it. I had to fight to be allowed study at the weekends. I had to be very strong mentally because constant fights about spending too much time on homework every evening were likely to wear me down. I had chores to do at home so between these and studying I had no free time. I feel that teenagers today are really spoilt compared to what I (and I'm sure others) had to go through.
 
buzybee said:
I had a rural working class background, went to a city school. Most of my peers 'expected' to go to college. In fact one friend (farming background, eldest of 11 said that in her house it is an understood thing that everone goes to college!!!!!)

My parents discouraged me from spending time studying in secondary and felt that college was a lot of nonsense. This was in the late 80s. They had the idea that I was getting ideas above my station, aiming for college, even though I was naturally bright and got 6 honours in leaving cert. They made it crystal clear that they could or would not contribute towards college even though I was an only child and they could afford it. I had to try to get a college place in my hometown, then ensure I had my 4 honours for the grant. I would not be allowed go to college away from home, even if I applied for and got medicine, dentistry etc. (Our local college didn't offer these courses)

I really valued my college place because I knew I had to fight like mad for every single thing that contributed to it. I had to fight to be allowed study at the weekends. I had to be very strong mentally because constant fights about spending too much time on homework every evening were likely to wear me down. I had chores to do at home so between these and studying I had no free time. I feel that teenagers today are really spoilt compared to what I (and I'm sure others) had to go through.
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Fair play to you. If you don't mind me saying it, it sounds like your parents wanted to keep you down.
 
buzybee said:
Some kids may not want to go to college. This can be upsetting for parents who may have shelled out thousands for fee paying schools, in the hope of 'buying' a good leaving cert, in order to ensure a college place.
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How can anyone "buy" a good leaving cert? I would have thought no matter what you pay or dont pay,that you cannot make a child study..
Also some parents who dont shell out thousands may also be upset if their kids dont want to go to college..


As another poster mentioned, the private school kids may not need qualifications and jobs as they can go into their parents business anyway. The middle class kids in public schools know they have to get qualifications and jobs, as their parents are not wealthy.
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One would think that all kids who go to fee paying schools have parents who are very wealthy,this is not the case..
Do you really think that only middle class kids in public schools know they have to get qualifications and jobs because their parents are not wealthy?
The logic of that is very condescending to all those who are working hard to get a qualification no matter what type of school they are in..it smacks of the green eyed monster..

If I were you I would try to send kids to a public school in a middle class area. If their peers 'expect' to go to college and are not dossers, then your kids are more likely to do well at school and aim for college.
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Its not like this is a choice for all parents..if you live in an area which isnt middle class,how do you suggest the child gets to go to school in an area,which may be a long way away,and may have feeder schools in the immediate area?
I don't know if parental support is important to encourage kids to go to college. I am in similar circumstances to Truthseeker. I had a rural working class background, went to a city school. Most of my peers 'expected' to go to college. In fact one friend (farming background, eldest of 11 said that in her house it is an understood thing that everone goes to college!!!!!)
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Parental support is vital,it is expected in my home and all of my friends and family that the kids will go to college..why would anyone actively discourage them from educating themselves?

My parents discouraged me from spending time studying in secondary and felt that college was a lot of nonsense. This was in the late 80s. They had the idea that I was getting ideas above my station, aiming for college, even though I was naturally bright and got 6 honours in leaving cert. They made it crystal clear that they could or would not contribute towards college even though I was an only child and they could afford it. I had to try to get a college place in my hometown, then ensure I had my 4 honours for the grant. I would not be allowed go to college away from home, even if I applied for and got medicine, dentistry etc. (Our local college didn't offer these courses)
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This is why most parents now encourage kids to go to college,times have moved on,and we are all more educated now..

I really valued my college place because I knew I had to fight like mad for every single thing that contributed to it. I had to fight to be allowed study at the weekends. I had to be very strong mentally because constant fights about spending too much time on homework every evening were likely to wear me down. I had chores to do at home so between these and studying I had no free time. I feel that teenagers today are really spoilt compared to what I (and I'm sure others) had to go through
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Well believe it or not,I also valued my college place as do my kids,most kids dont have a free ride through college,a lot of them have to work part time,and have to do chores..
Its all about bringing your kids up properly and the impression I get from your post is that anyone who has money to send their kids to a private school is rich and therefore the kids dont have to study,dont have to work ,dont have to do chores etc,I dont know where you are getting your information from,but these type of people are in the minority.you view is very extreme.
 
Working your way through college isn't easy but why should it be made harder than it has to be?

Working part-time is all good and well but really why do it if you don't need to? Your time would be much better spent concentrating on your studies.

For mainly financial reasons, I didn't even contemplate college directly after school but I would certainly have welcomed the opportunity to study without having to be concerned about my financial well being whilst doing so. A rich daddy would have been very nice, thank you very much and good luck to any student who has one. It doesn't make them lazy or disintersted - just privileged (and of course there's no harm to remind them of such).

IMHO, working part-time can be a major distraction for students. The relatively good earnings (relative to pocket money anyway) facilitate a reasonably good lifestyle (by student standards) to the detriment of study. If I had a child of college-going age, I'd like to think I could assist him to study without any such distraction.
 
buzybee said:
They made it crystal clear that they could or would not contribute towards college even though I was an only child and they could afford it.
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Yes, my parents also made it clear they would not contribute financially. Luckily I lived in Dublin so got to go to the college of my choice and was eligible for a small grant and the fees were free. Although I still had to work to earn enough to pay for buses, books, clothes, lunches etc...

In my case it wasnt that my parents wanted to keep me down, they simply had no conception of a university education and the word 'degree' conjured up notions of something 'a doctor or solicitor would have'. Both of them had left school very young and the mindset was that once you finished school - you got a job. My sibling was doing an apprenticeship for a manual trade and was viewed as the paragon of virtue whereas I was the waster who just wanted to read my book :)

They refused to pay for any grinds coming up to leaving cert even though the entire honours maths class bar me was doing grinds because the teacher was so bad. They just didnt see education as important, and considered it some kind of luxury that only rich people would indulge in.

Well done buzybee - you did it though eh?
 
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