Ripped Off By Solicitor

S

Starbright

Guest
I have just closed on the purchase of my first property, a one bedroom apartment in Dublin. I bought the property off the plans in March 2005 and when doing so I signed up for a solicitor who was recommended to me.

At the time, the solicitor quoted me an all-in price of approximately €1400, telling me that they had a policy of giving first time buyers a break on the price to retain their custom down the line.

Minutes after closing yesterday I got a call from my solicitors office stating that I owed them €2800 in fees including searches, registry fees and outlays. I claimed that was not what I was quoted as a fee originally and the solicitor (a different individual to the one I was dealing with in March 2005) asked to see documentary proof of the lower rate I was originally quoted.

I received this lower rate quote in an email from them but I can't find it in my inbox. I have contacted my company's IT section to see if it is retrievable.

Do I have a leg to stand on if I can't recover this email? I'm sure the solicitor's office have a copy of the fee basis they sent me in March 2005 but they may well conveniently "misplace" it to squeeze the higher fee out of me.

Any advice very welcome!
 
Are you sure that the all in one price wasn't just for the solicitors fee and not the extras such as land registery fees. These come to about €800 I think depending on the porperty os €1400 would seem very cheap for everything
 
Tell your solicitor that before you settle the fee, you would like a copy of the original [broken link removed] letter or e-mail, which they are obliged to provide to you at the outset.
 
Does your development have a neighbours.ie website you could pose this question to your new neighbours? No doubt some of them may have been offered the same legal package as yourself and they may be able to help you out..

I bought a one bed off plan last year and was offered a legal package of €1500.00 on the open day. I ended up going with my friend who charged me €1750.00, so was not very happy about that!

You should also ask for a breakdown of the charges, as they are very steep!
 
Hi starbright, I feel that you are definitely being overpriced. I bought a 2 bed apartment in early 06 and closed in the September of that year - fees were in the region of 1500 and I rang and got quotes from a few places and this figure seems to be around the norm. Also have friends who bought apartments recently and paid pretty much the same. Ask them to give you a complete breakdown of the 2800 fee so as to determine where the hike in price is coming from?
 
Starbright said:
I have just closed on the purchase of my first property, a one bedroom apartment in Dublin. I bought the property off the plans in March 2005 and when doing so I signed up for a solicitor who was recommended to me.

At the time, the solicitor quoted me an all-in price of approximately €1400, telling me that they had a policy of giving first time buyers a break on the price to retain their custom down the line.

Minutes after closing yesterday I got a call from my solicitors office stating that I owed them €2800 in fees including searches, registry fees and outlays. I claimed that was not what I was quoted as a fee originally and the solicitor (a different individual to the one I was dealing with in March 2005) asked to see documentary proof of the lower rate I was originally quoted.

I received this lower rate quote in an email from them but I can't find it in my inbox. I have contacted my company's IT section to see if it is retrievable.

Do I have a leg to stand on if I can't recover this email? I'm sure the solicitor's office have a copy of the fee basis they sent me in March 2005 but they may well conveniently "misplace" it to squeeze the higher fee out of me.

Any advice very welcome!
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Tell them that you will pay €1400 plus the Outlay. I can't see that €1400 would have ever been the total bill as that would be uneconomic. It is an issue that has been raised a number of times in the last few years where conveyancing is concerned as the outlays can be steep enough and they are often not spelt out to clients at the beginning.

The fact that they didn't give youa s68 letter does not preclude them from charging a fee on a quantum meruit basis but any good firm would have given you one.

Has the original solicitor left the practice?
 
You're definitely being ripped off. I recently paid my solicitor for the work needed to close on a 2 bed apt and the bill came to €1510 and im a first time buyer. He quoted me a grand at the start, but thats without VAT and a few other little things had to be added on at the end. I thought it was a reasonable price for what he did as hes based in dublin 4 so wouldve expected him to be at the higher end of the market price wise!
 
When I closed on my 2 bed apt I paid my solicitor €2k all-in, taxes and outlays. He was based in Dublin 2 (not sure if that really matters?), but anyway I reckon €2,800 is a little high. It could be that due to the length of completion on your property (3 years!) and the current downturn they are trying to hit you with current prices?

Either way, stick to your guns. If you were quoted €1,400 all-in, then pay €1,400.
 
ButtermilkJa said:
When I closed on my 2 bed apt I paid my solicitor €2k all-in, taxes and outlays. He was based in Dublin 2 (not sure if that really matters?), but anyway I reckon €2,800 is a little high. It could be that due to the length of completion on your property (3 years!) and the current downturn they are trying to hit you with current prices?

Either way, stick to your guns. If you were quoted €1,400 all-in, then pay €1,400.
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My guess is that the OP is mistaken and was quoted €1400+VAT+outlay. In my experience solicitors quote prices in this format.As for the location of the solicitor being relevant, the phrase "Dublin 2 solicitors" and "Dublin 2 prices" tends to be used to describe the big firms.My own attitude is to use smaller and cheaper solicitors for "simple" stuff and use a larger and more expensive firm for more significant matters.You do get what you pay for...
 
I agree, the location of the solicitor/firm is most likely irrelevant. In terms of the price quoted however, I can only go on what the OP states, in that the price quoted was all-in, and in which case my advice would be the same.

As for the price being a little on the low side, I seem to remember back in the hayday of 2005 when apartments were selling themselves, solicitors were advertising all-in prices as low as €999 so if this price was quoted in 2005 it would seem reasonable to me.
 
ButtermilkJa said:
I seem to remember back in the hayday of 2005 when apartments were selling themselves, solicitors were advertising all-in prices as low as €999 so if this price was quoted in 2005 it would seem reasonable to me.
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That is €999 excluding VAT + outlays

Do a search for homebuyhomesell on AAM and you'll find plenty of references to these.

eg http://www.askaboutmoney.com/showthread.php?t=9440&highlight=homebuyhomesell
try www.homebuyhomesell.ie they cost 999 plus vat and outlay.
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ButtermilkJa said:
when apartments were selling themselves, solicitors were advertising all-in prices as low as €999 so if this price was quoted in 2005 it would seem reasonable to me.
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yes, indeed. was it not REA if buyer was takig mortgage throught them? There used to be somebody from this company who was frequently posting on AAM (always good contributions BTW) , and always signing www.rea.ie (looked like advertising to me but was accepted by moderators, so it was not advertising i guess:rolleyes: ).
 
REA used to offer a legal fee of €499 plus VAT as part of their mortgage package. Maybe they still do. I understand that the €499 did not represent the actual solicitor's fee but that the fee was subsidised to some extent by the commission that REA received from the mortgage provider. Some of REA's competitors (notably www.ferga.com) offer commission refunds to clients in lieu of discounts on legal fees.
 
hi there,

I used to work in a legal office as a law clerk - I'd say the all in fee your solicitor was referring to was his base fee of E1400 including vat. The addition fees could be stamp duy for the deeds depending on the price of your property, land registry fees and lastely search fees and then there could be outlay. But if you are still not happy ask for an invoice which breaks down the costs - this shouldn't be a problem to get. I've learned one thing always over budget when purchasing a property rather than under budget - most solicitors charge about .75% to 1% of the purchase price for their fees and add on all the outlay.
 
The Bottom line for everybody -- get all Quotes and Prices in writing before you commence business. {People believe that as its a solicitor they couldn't be ripped off -Wake up and smell the coffee
 
Buttermilk said:

I seem to remember back in the hayday of 2005 when apartments were selling themselves, solicitors were advertising all-in prices as low as €999
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They may well have been selling themselves, but they were not conveyancing themselves.

Brendan
 
Outlay may well be around €800-€1,000, so that is €1,800-€2,000 including VAT. That is a fee to the solicitor of something like €1,400-€1,600. Hardly a rip-off for ensuring that a property worth 100 or 200 times that is properly registered in your name.

The flippant use of rip-off really annoys me (in relation to all services/goods), you weren't cheated, you weren't deceived. It was probably not explained clearly.

And you know well who made the real profit on that transaction!
 
That's a bit coarse. According to the original post he said that he was quoted €1400.00 and charged a far higher amount without an explanation. Surely if, as in most cases a detailed bill was forthcoming, an analysis could be made and then the matter could be determined. But at this moment in time it seems somewhat out of order. Personally on first hand I have seen Solicitors trying to rip off clients on many numerous occasions. So it does happen and will continue to do so. It really is very simple, a person's Solicitor is dealing with the most private of persons affairs. If they don't feel comfortable they should move to one they do feel comfortable with. If you pay peanuts you will get a monkey.
 


"At the time, the solicitor quoted me an all-in price of approximately €1400, telling me that they had a policy of giving first time buyers a break on the price to retain their custom down the line."​

How about you ask them for a detailed Invoice in order that we can have an orderly debate about the matter
 
mercman said:
That's a bit coarse. According to the original post he said that he was quoted €1400.00 and charged a far higher amount without an explanation. Surely if, as in most cases a detailed bill was forthcoming, an analysis could be made and then the matter could be determined. But at this moment in time it seems somewhat out of order. Personally on first hand I have seen Solicitors trying to rip off clients on many numerous occasions. So it does happen and will continue to do so. It really is very simple, a person's Solicitor is dealing with the most private of persons affairs. If they don't feel comfortable they should move to one they do feel comfortable with. If you pay peanuts you will get a monkey.
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I'm not sure where i posted that no solicitor has ever ripped off a client... I just don't believe that this is a rip-off if you consider the definition rather than the "EddieHobbsian" use of it.

Neither did i say that the OP should just cave in either. There is a problem.
 
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