Public transport in Dublin. Chaos - close to breakdown?

[Howth Head]

Is it my imagination or am I reading about major delays on trains/Luas etc on an almost daily basis? I'm hearing from friends and colleagues stuck on DARTs between stations for the last few hours this evening (Thursday 28/11) Seemed to be something similar yesterday and earlier this week.

Added to that, the M50 seems to be on a knife-edge, with almost daily incidents causing serious delays and tailbacks.

Traffic on the main routes into Dublin and even within leafy suburbia is increasingly at a standstill at junctions and crossroads (with cycle lanes and the shutting down of left turning filter lanes appearing to be the main cause.)

I'm also seeing large crowds regularly left standing at bus stops on the N11 (e.g Cornelscourt) in the mornings as packed buses go past without stopping. It seems to be just as bad at major stops towards town - Brewery Road for example always seems to have crowds waiting as busses sail past full. (Can't wait to see the confusion and chaos that'll inevitably arise when the postponed new routes kick in during January!)

Apols for the Dublin-centric focus here - I believe traffic in Galway and Cork is no picnic either.

DART, commuter disruption as signalling issue returns

DART and commuter services have resumed subject to delays after a major signalling fault was resolved.

www.rte.ie

Traffic and travel: Motorists face delays on M50 as some Irish Rail services running late

There may be delays building up to Dublin’s M50 this morning following a crash.

www.independent.ie

Traffic and travel: Crash on M50, black ice warnings and train delays at Connolly Station

Just before 8am there was a collision on M50.

www.independent.ie

 

[odyssey06]

The new Bus Connects 'network' seems more brittle than the old. Many of the busiest commuter routes have lost departures at peak hours to serve orbitals etc. The orbitals and night buses are welcome but should not have come at the expense of the core routes.

As for the DART, when I used to commute to city centre, I switched to buses in the morning. They took a few minutes longer but I avoided the once a week network crippled for reason X and being well late for work because of it. LUAS seems similar to DART in that respect.

 

[Leo]

Is it my imagination or am I reading about major delays on trains/Luas etc on an almost daily basis?

If you are reading this online then the algorithm is just feeding you what you are more likely to click on and what gets them advertising revenue. Most of the transport services publish metrics, if services were anywhere close to breakdown then it would be very easy to point to such metrics, but of course those in the business of producing click-bait aren't interested in producing articles showing performance of late is quite similar to that of recent years. There's not many clicks to be had in headlines like 'Transport system performing much as it did last year'

 

[Howth Head]

If you are reading this online then the algorithm is just feeding you what you are more likely to click on and what gets them advertising revenue. Most of the transport services publish metrics, if services were anywhere close to breakdown then it would be very easy to point to such metrics, but of course those in the business of producing click-bait aren't interested in producing articles showing performance of late is quite similar to that of recent years. There's not many clicks to be had in headlines like 'Transport system performing much as it did last year'

These are headlines in national newspapers and the national broadcaster - as well as information from friends, colleagues, family etc on their increasingly delayed commutes. Hardly just down to "clickbait."

And I'll be experiencing the gridlock around Deansgrange and Stillorgan later today while playing "spot the cyclist..."

Trains running late again this morning...

Commuters delayed after crash on Dublin’s M50 and Irish Rail delays

There has been a crash on the M50 southbound which may cause delays for commuters.

www.independent.ie

 

[Leo]

These are headlines in national newspapers and the national broadcaster - as well as information from friends, colleagues, family etc on their increasingly delayed commutes. Hardly just down to "clickbait."

So point me to some articles claiming that the transport system 'is close to breakdown' or even supporting that hypothesis?

Crashes and delays are nothing new, reporting on same is nothing new. Now, you may well be reading more about it, but that's your choice. There's nothing to suggest a deterioration in the punctuality of public transport here overall. We compare well with our European neighbours.

 

[Peanuts20]

I was at the Dublin Chamber of Commerce dinner a couple of months ago, the President of the CoC was talking about the need for more infrastrucutre investment in Dublin due to increased population etc.

My own thoughts are that the investment needs to go into other cities. For example, there is a lot of talk about the cap on Dublin Airport numbers. Rather then spend money on more runways and terminals there, perhaps there is a case for investing in perhaps Waterford Airport. If 250k people could travel out of Waterford a year instead of travellling up and down to Dublin, then that would take a 6 figure amount of car journeys a year off the M50.

I genuinely believe though there is a need for an outer outer relief road for Dublin

 

[Leo]

My own thoughts are that the investment needs to go into other cities.

Probably no surprise the Dublin Chamber wouldn't be proposing that . A longer term plan to scale significantly more employment around one or more of the other cites is needed to shift population first. Significant investment in any of the regional airports will only follow demand. Waterford airport is the wrong side of Waterford and its catchment is too small, for the vast majority, Dublin remains a more convenient location.

 

[Peanuts20]

Probably no surprise the Dublin Chamber wouldn't be proposing that . A longer term plan to scale significantly more employment around one or more of the other cites is needed to shift population first. Significant investment in any of the regional airports will only follow demand. Waterford airport is the wrong side of Waterford and its catchment is too small, for the vast majority, Dublin remains a more convenient location.

And yet Dublin airport is the wrong side of Dublin for anyone coming from Cork, Waterford or the South in general.

It doesn't need to be a massive airport, 1 million passengers a year in and out is only around 1 return flight to somewhere an hr after all.

 

[Leo]

And yet Dublin airport is the wrong side of Dublin for anyone coming from Cork, Waterford or the South in general.

Yeah, and yet it's still more convenient for 90-95% of the population to travel to Dublin. That's just a factor of our population distribution and Dublin-centric transport routes. Shannon airport would make more sense for a lot more people, but it would still take a significant shift of population westwards to attract such investment.

 

[Howth Head]

I fear that I'll be returning to this issue again this year...all it takes is a couple of bad experiences (e.g missed appointments, flights, concerts etc) for people to return to their cars. The headlong rush into "Green" energy seems to be part of the problem - see also the fleet of battery-powered buses in mothballs due to poor infrastructure, mechanical breakdowns etc.

Irish Rail reliability falls significantly in 2024 after breakdown and maintenance issues

‘Hybrid-ready power packs’ built by Rolls-Royce have created some difficulties where introduced

www.irishtimes.com

However, by Period 10, the four weeks to October 1st, the numbers of lost minutes in four weeks had increased to 10,039 – almost tripling the amount of time lost to delays.

The amount of time lost relates to fleet issues only, and is separate to figures for delays caused by changes to the Irish Rail timetable that were introduced in August and later reversed.

 

[Peanuts20]

I could be wrong but I thought the NTA went out to tender last year for new timetable planning software but I'm not clear if the new timetables were are as a result of that or are something that the new software would cover in the future. regardless, they made a clueless mess of it.

Having said that, the new traffic restrictions in the city centre have improved bus times, Irish times reporting travel times are down 30%

 

[Purple]

Having said that, the new traffic restrictions in the city centre have improved bus times, Irish times reporting travel times are down 30%

I was in Dublin City Centre a few times before and after Christmas and it was striking how empty the place was. My daughter worked in a Jewellery shop in Dundrum last Christmas and worked in their branch in the city centre this Christmas. She said that the Dundrum branch was more than twice as busy. If we want the city centre to be a place of culture (pubs, restaurants etc) then fine but if we want it to be a shopping destination then we need to accommodate cars.

 

[Leo]

If we want the city centre to be a place of culture (pubs, restaurants etc) then fine but if we want it to be a shopping destination then we need to accommodate cars.

I don't think Dublin will make a come back as a shopping destination unless there are significant changes that concentrate the shops closer together. People are a lot more lazy these days, they are not prepared to walk any significant distance from shop to shop, and certainly don't want to spend so long waiting for pedestrian lights to allow them a dash across busy streets.

Dublin was never shopper friendly, the spread means longer walks between shops along narrow footpaths along busy streets, it was always a far cry from the pedestrianised zones in many European capitals that have underground or multi-story car parks on the periphery along routes the give easy access in and out.

 

[Salvadore]

If the S6 route in Dublin is typical of the bus network generally then we really do have a crisis.

My son relies on it to get to UCD but it leaves a lot to be desired. The route planner gives a countdown to buses arriving but they mysteriously disappear. When the next one eventually arrives, it can’t accommodate all passengers. As a service, it’s worse than the number 17 it was supposed to improve upon.

 

[Purple]

My son goes to UCD. It's a 5.2Km commute. He walks as, at a little under an hour, it's slightly faster than taking the bus, costs nothing and is good exercise.

 

[Leo]

The route planner gives a countdown to buses arriving but they mysteriously disappear.

Ghost busses, due to a disconnect between the real time information system and Dublin Bus data. A contract for the replacement of that system to address that and other issues was awarded last year, you might have to wait another year or more for that to be rolled out though.

 

[odyssey06]

The 'ghost' buses are scheduled buses. If I see a bus in the TFI tracker app as 'scheduled' when it should be on the road, 90% of the time it means it won't arrive.

 

[Purple]

The 'ghost' buses are scheduled buses. If I see a bus in the TFI tracker app as 'scheduled' when it should be on the road, 90% of the time it means it won't arrive.

Does Google Maps tracking busses in real time?
I thought it had been integrated a while ago.

 

[odyssey06]

Does Google Maps tracking busses in real time?

Not sure about that, whether it is using user data or working from the same feed as the 'official' apps.

 

[Salvadore]

Even if the data issue is sorted and the ghost buses are removed from the app, there still remains a severe lack of capacity on what was supposed to be a revolutionary approach to the provision of public transport.