Public Jobs.ie questionaire - shameful !!!

S

Silvera

Guest
I sat an exam today for a public service job in Ireland.

After the exam had finished we were handed out two questionaires which we were requested to complete.
One of the questionaires was anonymous, which was fine - but the second questionaire required you to fill in your exam number (i.e. information can be directly linked to you) and then proceeds to ask -

What is your age group ?
What is your religion ?
What is your sexual orientation ?
etc etc etc

I could not believe what I was reading !!!

I thought that in this day and age an employer is not supposed to ask you your age - let alone your religion or sexual orienatation ???

And this was emanating from a State body !!

Opinions please ?

(I am still somewhat angry about it as I type this thread!)
 
Hi Silvera,

I know how it is to have to reply to such questionaires. Sometimes I think that no forethought or design goes into the production of thes sureveys.

As far as I know an employer can ask you all of these questions.

What the employer cannot do is use the information to discriminate against you (equality) or use the information in a way for which it was not gathered (data protection).

Did they tell you why they were collecting the information? Did you get the impression that you might be discriminated against on the basis of your reply?

ajapale
 
Silvera - I've sat those exams on 2 occasions in the past year. Each time, we were handed out the surveys, and it was stressed to us that it was purely our discretion as to whether we wanted to fill them out or not. They would not have any bearing on our exams whatsoever, and were simply to survey all the applicants for equality purposes.
If you objected to this survey so strongly, can I ask did you fill the form out and hand it in?
 
sense?

On one level I can see why they might want to do this;

Assuming the exams and survey are separate but linked only by the no. and go to separate groups, the person/group correcting the exams knows nothing about the people they are correcting, where as a separate group that is maybe monitoring equality & discrimination can see how the results link to different groups. (The survey can't be anonymous otherwise there is no way to link in the exam performance)

If the same pattern is not showing in interview/hiring decisions, then there is possible evidence of discrimination?
 
Re: sense?

How does one get to sit these exams?
 
Re: sense?

You register your interest here You are then automatically alerted when the next exam comes up
 
Re: shameful

The questions aren't shameful - they ask those questions so that they can MAKE SURE they give a chance to EVERYONE....i.e. to people that may be negatively discriminated against elsewhere. The Civil Service operates 'positive discrimination' policy. Many people don't agree with positive discrimination, and I actually don't in certain circumstances...but the majority of the time I think it's a good thing. The Civil Service aims to have at least 5% of its staff coming from backgrounds that would normally be looked on unfavourably - i.e. people of different sexualities, religions, abilities.
 
Re: shameful

What are people registering for? Is it any job in the civil service or specific areas such as Health / Tax etc?

Roy
 
Re: shameful

Like the OP, I wouldn't be happy with this. If it is purely for statistical reasons then there is no reason to tie it to an exam number. The only reason it needs to be tied to an exam number is if the answers are be used, positively or negatively, in determining whether a job is to be offered.

Someone above mentioned that the civil service tries to have a certain % of staff from backgrounds that some people few unfavourably. It's admirable that they don't want to discriminate but IMO, THAT's discrimination. Surely they want the best people for the job, regardless of their background.?

By all means collect the information randomly to ensure the jobs are attracting all types of people but it certainly shouldn't be tied to an exam number.

My 2c.
 
Re: shameful

While the questions may appear invasive, they are asked for the purposes of compiling statistical information considered relevant by the Equality Authority (although I'm not sure of the PRECISE reasons why - I think it may have something to do with understanding the constituents you serve). In its ideal world, the EA would have all organisations record similar data.

Bottom line is that the forms are in no way linked to the outcome of the CS competition and any suggestion to the effect that there is a connection is completely wide of the mark.
 
Re: shameful

Biggles,

I'm sure that is the case but why have a space on the form then for the candidate's number? I would imagine that the forms get divided and the statistical forms go to one area and the exam scripts to another.

The statistics group will compile their forms and know that candidate X is a gay orange monkey. The exams board will know that candidate X didn't make the pass mark. Rightly or wrongly all the candidate will know is that "I told them I was a gay orange monkey and I didn't get the job". If there was no number linking the two forms and all the statistical forms were collected together they would be unable to make that leap.
 
Re: shameful

I agree that the way in which the info is collected leaves them exposed to accusations of bias and that in trying to the right thing, they have, to some extent, made things worse.

However, I would be quite confident that the information is not used to any sinister effect and that any related complaint would be proved unfounded.
 
Re: shameful

I think the civil service was never done fairly. I did a secretarial course and went and did the exams for jobs. Yet my mams daughter was working for the civil service and girls would come from the country and she would be told to teach them how to use the typewriters so how did they ever get the job, obviously the now somebody which is a disgrace that this is still happening.
 
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