Private medical consultation - €250!!

[ATC110]

If you say so and can show them not fulfilling their hours. In any case, it's getting away from the original posts concern

RTE Primetime say so.

The 'original posts concern' is directly related to my point - nobody pays for a private consultation for fun, if every doctor worked the hours they are being paid for there'd be a lot less need for private consultations.

Are you a hospital consultant by any chance?

 

[fidelcastro]

I have never paid a consultant in cash or been asked to do so.

Good, modern times Gordon. But not so long ago in jolly Ireland cash was de rigueur. I speak as one with relatives in such business.
The pandemic has, fortunately forced lots of cash loving business to accepting card payments and into the loving arms of the taxman. However we have a bit to go yet. And I do not begrudge Revenue their money

No man is an island Gordon!

 

[noproblem]

RTE Primetime say so.

The 'original posts concern' is directly related to my point - nobody pays for a private consultation for fun, if every doctor worked the hours they are being paid for there'd be a lot less need for private consultations.

Are you a hospital consultant by any chance?

Afraid not, nor do I wish to be.

 

[becky]

What's really shocking is to hear that Publicly employed Consultants in Public Hospitals can high handedly declare they're not taking any new patients!!
I thought the whole point of a public health system was that it was for everyone (albeit with waiting lists) ....

I assume it's a Consultant due to retire.

 

[elcato]

RTE Primetime say so.

That's hardly an endorsement. RTE remind me of Bart Simpson's episode when he was an 'undercover' journalist.

 

[Gerryobrien]

Again, the issue of public lists being closed should be directed at the Govt, not individual consultants. There is a serious lack of consultants in Ireland. At some stage, the existing ones needs to close off their lists because it is ridiculous to expect them to accept the risk of patients waiting for 4 years to be seen for something that could be serious. There is a medicolegal burden there that needs to be discharged by the Govt establishing the necessary amount of consultant led teams and not passing the buck to waiting lists. This can only be addressed by restoring pay parity to new entrant consultants because why would they do the same job as their colleagues for less, and indeed do the same job with poorer pension entitlements than the previous generation?

 

[Rosjohn]

Do most Public Consultants only have 20 hour Public contracts?

 

[Steven Barrett]

Do most Public Consultants only have 20 hour Public contracts?

There are different contracts available to consultants, with differing salaries depending on whether they take private work or are solely doing public work. I had a quick search but couldn't see the hours required under each one.

 

[time to plan]

How does that saying go?

“If I do a complex job in 15 minutes, it’s because I spent 15 years learning how to do that job in 15 minutes. You’re paying me for those years, not for those minutes.”

It's like the mythical engineer asked to provide a breakdown of the $10,000 bill for simply pressing a button to solve an urgent production line problem:

Pressing button:	$10
Knowing which button to press	$9,900
Total	$10,000

 

[time to plan]

You can't complain about this. You want to skip the queue, so you pay for it. Like you said, you'll get money back from health insurance and tax relief.
You might complain to the Govt about public waiting lists, which is where the supply or demand issue comes into it. New entrant consultants have been on lower pay than their colleagues since austerity measures. It is very hard to attract them to fill all the vacant posts as a result. If you don't have a consultant, you don't have extra outpatient clinics.
Like another commenter said, all professionals have a fee and that's life.
The fact that they may dispense their knowledge in 5 mins is irrelevant, as it is expert knowledge, gained by many years of hard graft. I'd feel much more confident if a consultant took a few minutes to diagnose me than an hour hemming and hawing over it.

You certainly can complain about this. A properly organised health system shouldn't have the waiting lists that exist in the Irish public system. When we moved from the UK, we simply couldn't get our child seen in the public system for a life-long (but thankfully not serious) condition that needs an annual review. The UK hospital provided a handover letter for the Irish GP. The Irish GP referred to the public hospital. It was impossible to get any acknowledgement from the hospital that the referral had been received, let alone placed on a waiting list. And I've spent my life working in or with first the UK and then the Irish public health systems, so I'm fairly adept at navigating the systems. The only way to be seen was privately, adn we are lucky enough that we can afford it without hardship. But I can complain!

 

[ATC110]

I assume it's a Consultant due to retire.

No. The one who said it to me is middle-aged.
They're accountable to no one so can do what they like.

 

[ATC110]

That's hardly an endorsement. RTE remind me of Bart Simpson's episode when he was an 'undercover' journalist.

I'm no apologist for RTE but it's impossible to fault the findings of this investigation.

Several consultants were trailed for 13 weeks to provide an accurate average number of hours worked.

All fell short of their contracted 39 hours, the worst offender being an opthamologist who did an average of 13/39 hours a week.

Patients urgently requiring laser eye surgery-to the point of losing their ability to live independently-were interviewed and they had been waiting years for what was initially a minor and routine procedure.

No amount of undermining the source or excuse making justifies these people's behaviour. They should be criminally charged with theft and struck off the register.

What part of the hippocratic oath states to leave patients languishing while you steal from the public purse and simultaneously earn a private income.

The consultants who do this couldn't care less about the health of their patients; they're only interested in making money.

 

[noproblem]

It's like the mythical engineer asked to provide a breakdown of the $10,000 bill for simply pressing a button to solve an urgent production line problem:

Pressing button:	$10
Knowing which button to press	$9,900
Total	$10,000

Hmm, that engineer wasn't great at his maths tables as there's $90 not accounted for

 

[time to plan]

Hmm, that engineer wasn't great at his maths tables as there's $90 not accounted for

That's the client's problem.

 

[becky]

Do most Public Consultants only have 20 hour Public contracts?

No, they are 39 hours. Contract type B allows 30% private. A timetable of the 39 hrs should be agreed.

No. The one who said it to me is middle-aged.
They're accountable to no one so can do what they like.

What's middle aged? He may be allowed to retire at 60.

 

[ATC110]

No, they are 39 hours. Contract type B allows 30% private. A timetable of how these

What's middle aged? He may be allowed to retire at 60.

Circa 40 (life expectancy is not 120)

 

[Gerryobrien]

I was referring to the original query about being able to complain about what the private consultant is charging. I don't think there are grounds for complaint there, but there certainly are regarding the wider issue of waiting lists, having to go private, etc and I do think all these issues which do boil down to supply and demand go back to the Govt inability to administer proper consultant led care publicly.

 

[ATC110]

I was referring to the original query about being able to complain about what the private consultant is charging. I don't think there are grounds for complaint there, but there certainly are regarding the wider issue of waiting lists, having to go private, etc and I do think all these issues which do boil down to supply and demand go back to the Govt inability to administer proper consultant led care publicly.

Consultants being unaccountable, out of control and not working the hours they're paid for is a large part of the problem

 

[roker]

Yes, they are expensive but that is the cost you are paying for expertise. A doctor usually gets to the level of consultant about the age of 35. Considering they started that journey at 18, that's a lot of work and study to get there and they charge accordingly. If they have a huge demand for patients (a consultant client of mine is taking 2023 appointments at the moment), they charge more. It is no different to anyone else. Look at the price of builders and tradesmen at the moment. Look at the price of accommodation in Ireland over the summer. Supply and demand.

the consultant earns that €250 in about 15 minutes, he may have taken years to get to that position but so do a lot of other specialised professions. a few years ago, I once attended a consultant and I was with him about 2 minutes enough for him to say my test were clear, this could have been done with a phone call and save me losing work, but he was after another fee which I refused to pay

 

[Steven Barrett]

the consultant earns that €250 in about 15 minutes, he may have taken years to get to that position but so do a lot of other specialised professions. a few years ago, I once attended a consultant and I was with him about 2 minutes enough for him to say my test were clear, this could have been done with a phone call and save me losing work, but he was after another fee which I refused to pay

In that situation, you shouldn't have been charged the fee to tell you the tests were clear. I had tests recently myself and got a letter confirming they were clear. No fee. Let's not pretend that every consultant does this. Like in every walk of life, you will get some who are greedy and will charge you for anything.