Munich Security Conference 2026

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Ok, a bit of overlap between a trade summit in Belgium and the security conference in Munich. My bad, although trade and security are very much intertwined.

"We need to act fast and we need concrete decisions by June" is a reference to trade.

"If, in certain areas, we are not advancing as 27 we have the right to opt for reinforced cooperation (among fewer EU members) to go faster."

I can only reference from this that there is growing sentiment within the EU of how slow it is to act. The (25yr?) MERCOSUR trade deal being a case in point, now stalled once more by the EU Parliament.
It's just an observation but one of the main arguments of Brexit was the inabililty of the UK, as a sovereign nation, to make its own trade decisions whilst a member of the EU.
The quote above suggests that sentiment may be feeding into other Euro nations to some degree.

"There's so much talk and so little action, and this is a chance to at least reverse that trend," Swedish Prime Minister Ulf Kristersson said.
Czech Prime Minister Andrej Babis was even more blunt, saying: "Only words, conferences and no action".

The media focus has predominantly been on the the negative impact leaving the EU would have on the UK. With the exception being the border arrangements in Ireland, I have seen little focus on the negative impact of the UK leaving would have on EU.

As far as security goes, I would agree with the view that Ireland needs to bring its defence systems and capabililties into the 21st century. Not just because of Russia, but because of any threat.
If that is collaboration with its European partners that is all good, as long as that partnership is not subsumed into a minor partner to the USA as the way NATO is shaped.
Now would be a good time for Europe to boost its defences and diminish the US role in Europe. An opportunity for a lasting sustainable peace with Russia should be the goal.
 
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Sister Sara said:
The media focus has predominantly been on the the negative impact leaving the EU would have on the UK. With the exception being the border arrangements in Ireland, I have seen little focus on the negative impact of the UK leaving would have on EU.
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I don't think anyone thinks that on the whole the UK leaving the EU was anything other than a negative for the EU. The thing is that it has been and will continue to be massively more disadvantageous for the UK economically and socially. And they were the ones that left.
Sister Sara said:
I can only reference from this that there is growing sentiment within the EU of how slow it is to act
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Yep, but being part of a slow moving EU is massively more advantageous for us than not being a member. Even the isolationist loonies in Sinn Fein are no longer in favour of leaving.
 
Sister Sara said:
As far as security goes, I would agree with the view that Ireland needs to bring its defence systems and capabililties into the 21st century. Not just because of Russia, but because of any threat.
If that is collaboration with its European partners that is all good, as long as that partnership is not subsumed into a minor partner to the USA as the way NATO is shaped.
Now would be a good time for Europe to boost its defences and diminish the US role in Europe. An opportunity for a lasting sustainable peace with Russia should be the goal.
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I agree with that. At the moment the EU needs the USA to fight a war with Russia. We have no space program so we have no real time intel or communications without them. Ireland is in a far weaker position and is totally reliant on the USA, UK and our EU partners to come to our aid and they are, to say the least, not happy that one of the richest countries in the EU is so wilfully delinquent in relation to it's own defence and security.

At the moment Putin and Trump get to decide if we deploy our troops and Trump gets to decide if the Russians get to attack our infrastructure. I'm not satisfied with that arrangement.
 
Purple said:
Yep, but being part of a slow moving EU is massively more advantageous for us than not being a member
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The point is that there may be growing sentiment within other EU nations that being part of a slow moving EU is not more advantageous for them.

"If, in certain areas, we are not advancing as 27 we have the right to opt for reinforced cooperation (among fewer EU members) to go faster."

This sounds like a two-tier EU and not what the members States signed up to.

Purple said:
At the moment the EU needs the USA to fight a war with Russia
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Hold on a second! The EU is not at war with Russia.

Its these casual references that lead others, including me, to conclude that any build up of defence capabilities between EU members States is for purposes other than intended.
I'm happy for EU members States to collaborate and share defence responsibilities but its another leap for anyone to declare that the EU is at war, or is intending to go to war.

Indeed, there is a lot of media speculation talking up the prospects and almost inevitability of war with Russia by UK, France and Germany.

Personally, I think Ireland should stay right out of it.
 
Sister Sara said:
Personally, I think Ireland should stay right out of it.
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The Russians will make that decision for us.
Sister Sara said:
Hold on a second! The EU is not at war with Russia.
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No, but Russia is most definitely attacking the EU and it would be foolish and grossly irresponsible not to prepare for the possibility that Russia will continue to escalate its attacks.
There is some excellent reporting on this topic in the Financial Times. Well worth a subscription for international news. I don't think anyone can accuse the FT of being right wing or hawkish.
 
Purple said:
Russia is most definitely attacking the EU and it would be foolish and grossly irresponsible not to prepare for the possibility that Russia will continue to escalate its attacks.
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Russia is attacking European States with cyber, drone etc. Do you not think the those European States are engaged in counter-measures of covert nature? I'd be amazed if not.

Car bombs in Moscow, high-ranking generals being assassinated, drone attacks. It's very much tit-for-tat.

With the US backing away from NATO now is the time for Europeans to move to de-escalate the situation and find ways of co-operation and mutual interest between Europe and Russia. Unfortunately all I hear is the prospect of more war and more death.
 
Sister Sara said:
now is the time for Europeans to move to de-escalate the situation and find ways of co-operation and mutual interest between Europe and Russia. Unfortunately all I hear is the prospect of more war and more death.
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now is the time for Russia to move to de-escalate the situation and find ways of co-operation and mutual interest between Europe and Russia. Unfortunately all I hear is the prospect of more war and more death.
 
Sister Sara said:
The point is that there may be growing sentiment within other EU nations that being part of a slow moving EU is not more advantageous for them.
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I think you'd love nothing more than the break-up of the EU & the West, so your beloved Russia can expand. But, I've bad news for you....since Russia invaded Ukraine, NATO has added Finland & Sweden (both with formidable defences), EU defence spending is way up, Anti-EU sentiment is waning and the UK & EU have become a lot closer - no more bickering about Brexit. In fact, I think the UK will be back in the EU at some stage, largely thanks to baby-face.
 
Sister Sara said:
Do you not think the those European States are engaged in counter-measures of covert nature? I'd be amazed if not.
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European government have been implicated in the use of surveillance tools, but there has never been the suggestion of attribution of an attack on the infrastructure of Russia or its allies. Were there the slightest hint, they wouldn't be shy about saying so, the fact they haven't says it all.
 
Firefly said:
now is the time for Russia to move to de-escalate the situation and find ways of co-operation and mutual interest between Europe and Russia.
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Indeed, that would be helpful too. With the US backing away from NATO lets hope there are those within the Putin regime that may thinking along similar lines.
Firefly said:
It's certainly not tit-for-tat. Russia has caused widespread bombings & deaths of innocent civilians in Ukraine.
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The reference was to European countries within the EU as that was what we were talking about, the EU - at/not at - war with Russia
Firefly said:
I think you'd love nothing more than the break-up of the EU & the West, so your beloved Russia can expand
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I have quoted you views of the French President, the Swedish Prime Minister and the Czech Prime Minister that all point to some level of discontent within those governments as to how the EU operates its trade. In case you weren't aware, similar tones of discontent were regularly expressed in the UK for a long period culminating in their eventual departure from the EU.

I personally don't think it was good for UK or EU. In my view, if any of the remaining 27 countries were to leave the EU it would herald an existential crisis for the EU.

Thankfully, no-one is suggesting that.

However, that fact that some EU leaders are openly expressing a prospective two-tier trading bloc (my interpretation of the above comments) should be of concern for anyone who wants the EU to work.
Perhaps you'd care to share your own views on what those comments from EU leaders may mean to you instead of attacking posters for views you think they hold?
 
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Leo said:
Were there the slightest hint, they wouldn't be shy about saying so, the fact they haven't says it all.
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I would suggest that a lot of activity happens covertly and it is unlikely that we will ever hear about it at this time.
 
I don't think I've ever agreed more with Fintan O'Toole than I do with his article in todays Irish Times.
He points out that Sinn Sein is proud of their opposition to the Fascists in Spain during their Civil War, and of the members of the old IRA who they erroneously claim as their own who died fighting there but how they are now on the other side in the War in Ukraine, effectively supporting the fascists against democracy.

This is a theme in the pro-Russian EU member States, most notably Hungary but to a lesser extent the Czech Republic and Slovakia. Sinn Fein wants Ireland to align itself with those countries by appeasing Russian fascism. The hypocrisy is staggering and the lack of morality is revolting but completely consistent with how they operate.
 
Yes, there were fascists in Ukraine too (most of them are dead now).

Does that excuse the invasion of Ukraine by the totalitarian fascist Russian government?

Does it justify the breaking of a treaty signed by Russia a couple of decades earlier which guaranteed the integrity of Ukraine?

Does it excuse the false flag operation by Russia used as a pretext to invade Ukraine? A method copied directly from the German Nazi playbook (Operation Konserve), when they did the same thing to invade Poland in 1939 (They left his involvement in that out of Schindler's List).

Back on topic: Russia in a totalitarian dictatorship and the greatest threat to peace in Europe since the Second World War. Thankfully the grown-ups in the rest of Europe are willing to defend themselves, and us.
 
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