Major issue with Civil Service Pension

[Shesastute]

But you're not "paying it back", you're paying it for the first time, in exchange for a future (pension) benefit!

Is your payroll now set up for the correct pension deduction, or is the problem ongoing?

I am now paying the correct contributions along with my notional service, and now need to set up some sort of repayment. I don't have a lot of faith that, even if I arrange to pay this back, and get reassurances from my pension provider and the NSSO, that I won't be dealing with further issues when I retire.

You're correct that 'paying it back' was the wrong term to use, and that according to the circulars around pensions that it is my liability to ensure my pension contributions payments are correct. However, I believe that there is, or should be, a liability with the organisations mentioned that didn't fix the problem at each opportunity the issue came to light, for example when I opened a case about it with the NSSO. I am now being asked to pay for 23 years of non-payment of contributions over the course of 8 years. Life goes on as normal for the organisations and the experts working in them, who created this mess.

This will sound harsh but you had the opportunity at any point over the last 25 years to cop the error yourself and mitigate your own liability. All you had to really do was ask the question why your pension contributions had been cut in half despite getting promoted and getting a pay bump. On top of that you haven't actually lost anything. You have in fact received an interest free loan from the taxpayer for 25 years of pension contributions, the gross of which is probably worth at least 25% over & above what you will now need to pay considering the impact of inflation. On top of that, unless you were a top rate taxpayer all the time, you're probably also benefitting from more tax relief that you would have gotten at the time the the contributions.

You are in fact well ahead of the game.

I really appreciate you taking the time to outline the options and breakdown of the missing contributions. I'll be arranging to pay some of the missing contributions now (as much as I can afford anyway).

To be fair though, I don't feel ahead of the game. There are many factors and circumstances around the time I moved to DoF, which I haven't outlined here, that lead me not to spot this error. I do intend to bring a case to the FSPO in due course.

OP must first exhaust all internal avenues of complaint before the FSPO will even look at the case. Although might we have an issue of self-investigation here, different desks in Finance as an organisation?

Amazed and disappointed at the union reps response. Try to stop paying union dues and see what happens.

To be fair to the union rep, perhaps it was too early on as I had only discovered the extent of the missing contributions. I have now contacted the head honcho for the Civil Service division, and I'll see if I get any traction there.

 

[S class]

(sent in a case under the IDR to be told 3 months later that I had no case)

@mathepac

They already seem to have exhausted all internal avenues.

 

[Dr Strangelove]

First off, don’t be stressed. There is no loan shark coming for you. This is just a bureaucratic shambles.

Second, indeed there has been huge maladministration by all concerned since 2001. There were multiple opportunities to notice this and no one did. However, the maladministration has made you better off, not worse off. You have got an interest-free loan from the Exchequer which you’ve probably used to pay off a mortgage quicker.

I know the system quite well - as do you - and I think you have no prospect of a cent being waived. Where there is management discretion, however, is on the pace of repayment.

I think you should push for as slow a pace of repayment as possible. Best of all would be the €40k deducted from your lump sum. You would have to be careful that you have headroom to ensure that this is fully relieved at marginal rate. To achieve this it might be better spaced over two or more years.

You can take the NSSO to the FPSO indeed I have myself, and won. But I doubt it will achieve much apart from a delaying tactic. Really your ultimate aim should be to leave you as well off as possible. That means leaving the €40k unpaid and interest-free as long as possible, and achieving full tax relief when it’s paid.

 

[messyleo]

If you are paying for notional service, can you pause or stop this to give you space to pay back the 40,000 instead?

 

[Marsupial]

I am now being asked to pay for 23 years of non-payment of contributions over the course of 8 years. Life goes on as normal for the organisations and the experts working in them, who created this mess.

Have you rejected my suggestion that you arrange to have the arrears deducted from your retirement lump sum? This is a regular enough procedure that even barely competent HR sections should be able to manage! Both my missus (teacher) and I (civil servant) - had arrears in our pension contributions deducted from our lump sums when we retired.

Split the issue into two bits:

1. the cockup - for which you are entitled to at the very least a written apology and even (possibly) some monetary compensation for the stress and inconvenience caused by other peoples' incompetence.

and

2. Payment of the pension arrears due, a matter that could be put to bed for the next 8 years if you and the employer can agree on (i) the figure due and (ii) that repayment will be taken from your lump sum.