Lower (PAYE) tax countries

A

Alistair

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Hi,
We are currently in the process of selling up our buy-2-lets and once done (in the next 12 months realistically) are planning to move abroad (for a number of years) to work. I currently work in the private sector in FinTech as a PAYE employee and my wife is self employed. While completing our 2017 tax returns we are disheartened so see the large amount of tax and levies we contribute each year for such poor services in return. We have been in the same position for a number of years and have finally taken the decision to take action and to relocate to a lower tax jurisdiction.

We want to weigh up the pros and cons involved and would very much appreciate to hear of others experience or knowledge of this undertaking. In particular we would like to understand the effective tax rates and cost of living (incl. school fees) in Singapore and the middle east.

Thanks.
 
Alistair said:
Hi,
We are currently in the process of selling up our buy-2-lets and once done (in the next 12 months realistically) are planning to move abroad (for a number of years) to work. I currently work in the private sector in FinTech as a PAYE employee and my wife is self employed. While completing our 2017 tax returns we are disheartened so see the large amount of tax and levies we contribute each year for such poor services in return. We have been in the same position for a number of years and have finally taken the decision to take action and to relocate to a lower tax jurisdiction.

We want to weigh up the pros and cons involved and would very much appreciate to hear of others experience or knowledge of this undertaking. In particular we would like to understand the effective tax rates and cost of living (incl. school fees) in Singapore and the middle east.

Thanks.
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In most other countries in the EU your wife will be paying a lot more daughter self employed in Austria paying 26.5 in levies before income tax ,Come back and update us on the Countries you find good and bad it will be very Interesting,
 
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PRSI contributions do not equate to dental or medical benefits in any meaningful way.
Property levy does not include refuse collections (as is the case mainland European countries).
Lack of adequate police resources both in terms of manpower and equipment.
Lack of any form of reliable and frequent public transport infrastructure outside of Dublin.
A dysfunctional public health service.
Increasing state pension qualification age (currently 68 years in our case).
USC charged on turnover (as opposed to profits after all expenses and contributions) for landlords....

to list but a few...
 
Ireland has low to average direct taxes.

One million earners pay ZERO direct income taxes.

My parents pay less than 10% income tax on 49-50k income, and get:
  • two medical cards
  • two travel passes
  • free TV licence
  • 35 pm off elec
Nearly half the population are on welfare.

Not many countries are as generous.
 
Alistair said:
PRSI contributions do not equate to dental or medical benefits in any meaningful way.
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Are they supposed to? Doesn't everyone get a free check-up now? PRSI is used for a lot of things.

Alistair said:
Property levy does not include refuse collections (as is the case mainland European countries).
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I would agree with that. It seems a no-brainer that a tax levied on property for the purposes of funding the services of that property would include a waste management service in the tax.
Having said that, depending on where you live, a cost of €100 to €350 falls someway short of making me want to up sticks and emigrate.

Alistair said:
Lack of adequate police resources both in terms of manpower and equipment.
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I can only assume you rely of policing services regularly? And that you consider them inadequate? That is what the private security industry is for.

Alistair said:
Lack of any form of reliable and frequent public transport infrastructure outside of Dublin.
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I assume you live outside Dublin? As do I. I don't use public transport too often

Alistair said:
A dysfunctional public health service.
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I would have to sit on the fence on this one. I know the Health Service is costing far more than it should, but my experience of it is that the quality of treatment is generally excellent. For sure, the horror stories are all there for us to read, but as most don't impact me directly I would not even consider this a factor for me wanting to emigrate.

Alistair said:
Increasing state pension qualification age (currently 68 years in our case).
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Again, hardly a cause to emigrate, in my opinion.

Alistair said:
USC charged on turnover (as opposed to profits after all expenses and contributions) for landlords....
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This is not actually a service, it is a charge. A hefty one at that for sure.
 
Getting back on track to my original post as we have made the decision to emigrate to a lower tax jurisdiction, I would appreciate views/experience from those who have lived and worked in jurisdictions where direct taxes are significantly lower than Ireland. In particular, which of these countries offer a decent lifestyle (weather, commuting, living costs etc) coupled with lower direct taxes on income.

Thanks
 
I lived in Australia many moons ago on a work/travel visa. As I understand it today, direct taxes are a lot lower. Outdoor lifestyle is par the course. Education facilities are among best in the world. Wages are good too for professional and trade classes.
However, property prices have gone into orbit. Homelessness is an issue in Sydney and Melbourne, just like here.
Private health insurance is (apparently) getting more and more expensive.

Swings and roundabouts as they say.
 
That's a useful site as it's really hard to do side by side tax comparisons. .

If you go to the 167% of average earnings no-child, 60,000 euro . (There's a limited number of example earnings, this is the closest to figuring out at what levels higher than average earnings will be taxed.)

https://stats.oecd.org/Index.aspx?DataSetCode=AWCOMP

The OECD Average tax take then is 21.49% - in Ireland it's 27.26%

Some specific examples Sweden is 31.63%, Norway 25.94%, UK 22.29, Switzerland 15.55%, Germany 27.64%, Belgium 34.22 etc..

So at 60k according to the OECD we're quite close to Scandi levels of taxation,

Once we go to higher that 167% it'll be worse for Irish taxes
some of these countries will cap their PRSI contributions - we don't
you'll relatively have less of your income taxed at the levels where we pay less tax

So if we say at best our taxes for higher paid people are similar to Scandi countries, then you've to look at the social benefits a country provides, state pensions, healthcare, childcare, education. I don't think we're quite matching Sweden.

Protocol said:
You will struggle to find lower direct taxes in a modern country in the EU.

Check here:

https://stats.oecd.org/Index.aspx?DataSetCode=AWCOMP


DE, FR, BEL, - all higher direct taxes

Scan - way higher direct taxes.

The USA has lower direct taxes, but much higher property taxes.
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TheBigShort said:
I lived in Australia many moons ago on a work/travel visa. As I understand it today, direct taxes are a lot lower. Outdoor lifestyle is par the course. Education facilities are among best in the world. Wages are good too for professional and trade classes.
However, property prices have gone into orbit. Homelessness is an issue in Sydney and Melbourne, just like here.
Private health insurance is (apparently) getting more and more expensive.

Swings and roundabouts as they say.
Click to expand...

Similar experience for me. I found my pay rate in Australia was cheaper than in Ireland but my standard of living down there was comparable to Ireland. My taxes were lower as I was contracting and non resident in Australia and I had a good accountant.

The people who worked in my company tended to live about an hour by train outside of the city as living closer was unaffordable.
 
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