NoRegretsCoyote
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No, they are just not.
The CSO publishes statistics on this. Last time I checked they are between 35% and 15% of the peak depending on type of dwelling and location.
You are just making stuff up.
"Let's demolish the four great myths of housing"- Conor Skehan
- Thread starter Brendan Burgess
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The CSO publishes statistics on this. Last time I checked they are between 35% and 15% of the peak depending on type of dwelling and location.
You are just making stuff up.
Property price in Leitrim might be 35% off the boom but in expensive parts of Dublin, Cork, Galway and Limerick they are within 10-15% and closing fast.
Again, you are adding nothing to the discussion, rather you have taken it off on a tangent.
I wonder is that true.
The median house price to median household income ratio is currently around 4.7. I don’t know what the comparable ratio was in 2001 but I doubt it was much lower than 4.7.
And mortgage rates were obviously much higher back in 2001.
The average price nationally in 2000 was £125,000. I can’t find the link to the 2001 price but yes, it’s correct.
The median house price to household income ratio 10 years ago was under 3.5. I can’t be bothered looking up the exact figure but I’m sure NoRegrets, or anything better to do with their time, will look it up for me.
I’m of the opinion that returning to the same prices and ratios as the last boom is not a good thing, especially with no real income growth (worth talking about).
in the last decade, since the low point of the property crash, prices have increased by over 80% and real incomes are up by around 6%.
I’m tired of listening to people saying that it was harder years ago, it was harder in the 80’s or 90’s, people have it easy now days etc. I was around in the 80’s and 90’s. I bought my first property in the 90’s. I’m well within the top 1% of earners and if I was buying my first home now in South Dublin I’d be looking at a modest enough 4 bed semi.
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To the Sunday Indo's article point about Ireland converging on Europe with more prevalence of renting - this is fine if you're young and want to or need to keep your options open. I bet the author of the article is not renting if he's in his 40s/50s. And I doubt if (m)any 40 + somethings on AAM are renters.A thought-provoking article here
Think you can handle the truth? Let’s demolish the four great myths of housing
Many myths and unrealistic expectations have arisen around housing and accommodation that need to be examined because these are the real drivers of affordability.www.independent.ie
1) The First Time Buyer
The First-Time Buyer’ is a myth that needs to be put into perspective as the ultimate tiny tail that is wagging a very big dog. There are about two million houses and apartments in Ireland. Out of about 24,000 annual house purchases, only around 6,000 are first-time buyers.
This means that national policy is driven by the needs of one third of one percent of all homeowners, and one quarter of annual sales.
2) Generation Rent
‘Generation Rent’ is a myth-making trope that is used to persuade people that they are victims. Through boom and bust, for over 50 years Irish people have been increasingly choosing to rent rather than to buy. Today 30pc of us rent — a sign that Ireland is maturing to align with the European norm in advanced economies.
3) Rent is Dead Money
"
Dead Money’ is another phrase that is used to create a myth of victimhood among renters. It implies that rent money only serves immediate needs, unlike a mortgage repayment that is a form or saving or investment.
This is the equivalent of saying that food money is a waste because you’ll be hungry again tomorrow — so buy a cow, a chicken, an orchard instead.
4) The Housing Crisis
‘The Housing Crisis’ is the greatest myth of all. Readers are invited to google the words ‘Housing Crisis’ followed by a country of their choice. For starters, try Australia, Canada, New Zealand, Israel, Norway, France and the Netherlands.
Your research will tell you that there is hardly a country in the world that does not have headlines about rising rents and house prices, lack of supply, affordability, homelessness, price inflation — to name but a few ills.
...
We have more than 200,000 vacant homes across Ireland. When we encourage or allow the Government to support new-build housing instead of refurbishing then we are choosing to move away from availability and affordability.
If you have the means or had the foresight to buy young why would any sane person with a choice rent after mid 30s if they didnt have to? Its miserable dealing with letting agents/ landlords in Ireland.. humiliating actually. In Europe it's grand to rent but not in a slapdash & pricey rental environment such as in Ireland. And you're buggered in old age by renting unless you want to have a very precarious time in your final years.
Well, I’m afraid you would lose that bet (although I suspect the author is in his 60’s).
"I would never buy a property again," says Government's top housing adviser. "I rent"
Conor Skehan says Irish people must stop thinking of renting as ‘dead money’.
So it would be reasonable to believe that he most likely doesn't have school age children? Moving every few years isn't an issue then.
I think Conor Skehan is talking through his hat. He's entitled to his opinion but he's wrong.Well, I’m afraid you would lose that bet (although I suspect the author is in his 60’s).
"I would never buy a property again," says Government's top housing adviser. "I rent"
Conor Skehan says Irish people must stop thinking of renting as ‘dead money’.www.google.ie
Not feasible to rent e.g. with kids/ schools and not a great scene generally for renters with the prevailing attitude of society looking down on renters. Not nice to say it but that's my take on it.
That’s nothing wrong with renting as long as suitable stock is available and suitable leases can be agreed. The problem is the issues around the supply of property as that’s the driver of price in both the purchase and rental markets.
... and you are prepared to move every few years and don't mind the fact that when you retire on a pension of (say) 50% of your salary you will be paying the same rent as when you had 100% of your salary.
I think everyone posting here who thinks "renting for a lifetime is grand" should nail their colours to the mast and say if they are renting long term.
Thirsty (Homeowner!)
That’s why I said “as long as suitable leases are available”. As things are currently structured renting is totally unsuitable. The solution is not for everyone to buy, it’s a different rental structure.
it all comes down to the cost and time it takes to deliver housing.
Why isn't it feasible to rent with kids? I know many people who do it very successfully. If you believe society looks down on renters it may be your own prejudices clouding that judgement.
Outside of social housing (be that Local Authority or Housing association) there is no guarantee of tenure.
It is generally considered beneficial if a child does not have to change schools frequently; so if you have to leave your rented accomodation, you are limited to where you can find a new property to rent, if you want your child(ren) to stay in the same school.
I have 2 kids at secondary - I know that I'll be in the same house until they finish. How can you "do it very successfully" if you are bricking it that your landlord will move you on next year or the one after that? And rents fluctuate ? Maybe their/ your definition of success is different to mine. Stability, peace of mind and being able to plan 3-5-7 years out for my kids is my definition of success in terms of where we live.
I agree with that. The lack of certainty, or certainly relative to home ownership, when renting is a major issue when children are involved.
It might be a surprise to you, but the majority of landlords don't want the hassle and expense of turfing out good tenants only to find new ones every couple of years.
NoRegretsCoyote
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AFAIK about 5% of landlords leave the market every year. Over a decade that's a very high probability that you will have to move. It'd be a hassle even with the six months' notice that is required after being six years in place.
Find a similar priced property in the same area that suits your needs as a family is not going to be easy.
Remember, 5% of landlords don't control 5% of rental properties with many of those leaving being the reluctant landlords of single properties. If you're looking for stability in rental accommodation you avoid the bit players.
NoRegretsCoyote
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Even if there's a 5% chance that in any given year you'll have to move, pay higher rent, move your kids schools etc it's still a major worry for people. We need long term leases.
I'm in the unusual position of being a home owner, a landlord and a tenant all at the same time. I've an excellent Landlord and I'm an excellent tenant. Hopefully I'll soon just be a home owner again.