Kitchen extension flat roof

L

learnwell

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We have a small kitchen extension, internal dimensions 10 feet by 10 feet, with
the usual felted flat roof. As the normal life span of this type of roof is 10 to 15 years before problems arise, we recently got a quote from Global to redo the roof with their special membrane system.
The quote came to 7400 Euro. Admittedly they include some insulation under
the membrane, and a few feet of drain pipe requires boxing. They give a 15
year guarantee, altho they claim in practice a life of up to 40 years.
We are wondering is the price exorbitant, and has anyone had Global do a similar job.
 
Sounds high.
Consider a Fibreglass Roof.
If you're in South Dublin ask Irish Conservatories for a quotation.

Call Michael McWeeney 087-2558157
They did an extension for a client of mine and the roof was Fibreglass.
There may be other firms round who can do the work both in South Dublin and around the country.


ONQ.

[broken link removed]

All advice on AAM is remote from the situation and cannot be relied upon as a defence or support - in and of itself - should legal action be taken.
Competent legal and building professionals should be asked to advise in Real Life with rights to inspect and issue reports on the matter at hand.
 
Thanks onq, have not heard of fibreglass system for flat roof, will have to do some research. Am really curious about Global, wonder is there anyone out who has had them
do a home extension flat roof, how did it turn out and how expensive was it?
 
Hi learnwell,

Could you confirm for the record whether you have any connection to Global?
 
This job is very much a job for a skilled labourer, 10ft. x 10ft would require
1 roll of paralon felt 45euro
10 m2 of insulation 60 euro
10 euro of gas
1 mini skip
2 men max 2 days 600 euro
Sheet of ply 50euro
incidentals say 100euro

As I said this is a labour intensive job, if a guy is paid 1000e a week would you expect 2 men to be up on your roof for 3 weeks doing this, I don't think so.
 
Hi Robster1,

Interesting Bill.
I'd add in a few things.
Mini-Skip hire (3 day) ~ €90
(There might be additional costs for disposal of sulphur contaminated plasterboard, etc)

Then there are things I don't have costs for.

- Profit.
- Insurance.
- Scaffolding for high level work.

Allow €500 for scaffolding and builders insurances
Add in €500 for hiring equipment/depreciation/ etc.
I'd add in an extra day for the men @ €300

After that, the bill, tends to put the asking price in perspective.
45+60+10+90+600+50+100+500+500+300 = €2255 ex VAT.

Allowing for -
- head office overheads
- transportation costs (truck insurance, diesel, wear & tear and depreciation)
a reasonably fair price would seem to be around €3,000.

The OP's Bill would seem to suggest over €3,000 of it is profit.
Perhaps KKelliher or another QS could comment.
Still, its nice work if you can get it.

I've never made three grand profit for three days work, I can tell you!


ONQ.

[broken link removed]

All advice on AAM is remote from the situation and cannot be relied upon as a defence or support - in and of itself - should legal action be taken.
Competent legal and building professionals should be asked to advise in Real Life with rights to inspect and issue reports on the matters at hand.
 
Hi ONQ,

My pricing was in no way intended to be comprehensive, I'm a bit of a DIY nut and get myself into plenty of self inflicted misery tackling things I maybe shouldn't, but in general I tend to get it done eventually, if it was my flat roof of 10ftx 10ft, I reckon I would do it for less than 300euro, given I have most of the gear,and that would be me doing it twice, ie wrong the first time.
Anyway my point in posting was to highlight that in my opinion the quote seemed way way too high.
A professional would do a far better job than me of course and he/she should be paid accordingly so I respect your pricing methods totally.I respect totally your judgement on pricing as you've outlined.
 
Thanks robster1,

Your contribution is valued here on AAM.
Not everyone can afford a contractor to do the work and may want to have a go.

This is after all a sister forum to the Sites, Planning, Self-Builds and Extensions forum :)
Thus its important to have contributions from self-motivated guys like yourself who are keen to do the work.

That having been said, all I have done is comment on prices for a relatively straightforward re-roofing job on a flat roofed extension.
I didn't comment on weathering the roof to the house, insulation or ventilation in accordance with Diagram 11 P. 28, http://www.environ.ie/en/Publications/DevelopmentandHousing/BuildingStandards/FileDownLoad,1647,en.pdf (Technical Guidance Document F 2009).

The problem with simple questions about building works is that they lead to so many other issues.


ONQ.

[broken link removed]

All advice on AAM is remote from the situation and cannot be relied upon as a defence or support - in and of itself - should legal action be taken.
Competent legal and building professionals should be asked to advise in Real Life with rights to inspect and issue reports on the matters at hand.
 
The figures given by Robster 1 seem to relate to a conventional flat roof felting job for
which there are many contractors. What Global are selling is a system called Sarnafil which they say requires specialised training to install. I had to search for their quotation
(which I had mislaid) in order to remember the name of the system. Seems to be marketed by a company called Sika Ireland. I dont' know the country of origen, possibly
Scandinavian. The idea of specialised training seems similar to various external insulation systems currently marketed by various companies.
 
Specialist training could also be a 1 hour on the job demo from someone who has done it before. That or just under a minute anda half on YouTube!

Why not get some quotes from some Sika-licensed contractors? List in pdf [broken link removed]. I see Global aren't among that list.
 
Leo, many thanks for list, will get some quotations. Wonder if anyone out there has had the system fitted to a flat roof extension such as ours, if so how was it, cost, overall
satisfaction, how long did it take ect.
 
Leo,

Thanks for that, but I note that the downloads section seems to have a lot of defective links.

Learnwell,

If you use a Sika membrane, be careful how you protect the membrane before and during the work and use.

Also be careful to check the small print of the guarantee for call out charges for any repairs that might be covered.


ONQ.

[broken link removed]

All advice on AAM is remote from the situation and cannot be relied upon as a defence or support - in and of itself - should legal action be taken.
Competent legal and building professionals should be asked to advise in Real Life with rights to inspect and issue reports on the matters at hand.
 
robster 1 said:
This job is very much a job for a skilled labourer, 10ft. x 10ft would require
1 roll of paralon felt 45euro
10 m2 of insulation 60 euro
10 euro of gas
1 mini skip
2 men max 2 days 600 euro
Sheet of ply 50euro
incidentals say 100euro

As I said this is a labour intensive job, if a guy is paid 1000e a week would you expect 2 men to be up on your roof for 3 weeks doing this, I don't think so.
Click to expand...

10' x 10' = 100 sq feet

Plywood 8' x 4' = 32 square feet, presuming everything lands exactly that's 3 sheets and hope the O.P has an off cut in the shed.

Paralon 10 square metres, less overlaps 100mm and end laps 150mm, upstands minimum 150mm

Also what an underlay?????

Possible facia, tilting fillet etc etc

If doing a job or trying to compare please try to get it half right, you are correct the price looks high but even with the limited information available it's obvious there are certain jobs best left to professionals.
 
Hi Peter C,

I read robster1's contribution as a rough schedule of materials and labour prices, not a schedule of works or details.
I think robster1 is covered by his suggestion of using a skilled labourer, since most of what you describe are classed as "builders details" or "roofers details".

Robster1' stated that his was only a rough guide, so lets look at what's omitted from the comments you made.
10' x 10' is the internal dimension of the space.

A flat roof will have an overhang of say 200mm 0r 8" and the walls will be 225mm or 9".
The total width of a three sided roof is 10' + 9" + 8" + 9" + 8" or 10' and 34" or 12' 10"

In addition there will be the 3 soffit boards, each 200mm or 8' wide with short sides of 10' 9"
There will also be the fascia boards to weather the top to the soffit.
Firring pieces are required to give a fall.

Even that is only part of the detailed specification.
Part of the work is demolition and carrying away - the labourers time assumes this.
Part of the spec is mechanical fixings - nails and angles- which are required to build the roof.
When you look at building works in this detail that you realize the work done by a Quantity Surveyor :)

It might be useful to see part of a redacted detail specification for a small job for one of our Quantity Surveyors.


ONQ.

[broken link removed]

All advice on AAM is remote from the situation and cannot be relied upon as a defence or support - in and of itself - should legal action be taken.
Competent legal and building professionals should be asked to advise in Real Life with rights to inspect and issue reports on the matters at hand.
 
Hi onq,

Having read my post I agree I was a bit hard on robster 1, the point I was trying to make has been well covered by your post.

The devil is in the detail :)
 
Hi PeterC

Where interested amateurs are posting advice, *gently* pulling up their socks can help both the OP and the readers of the thread. :)

As I have repeatedly learned on AAM, its important to contribute without letting it get to personal.

That having been said, you sometimes have to call a spade a spade.

Setting a higher standard is to be welcomed.



ONQ.

[broken link removed]

All advice on AAM is remote from the situation and cannot be relied upon as a defence or support - in and of itself - should legal action be taken.
Competent legal and building professionals should be asked to advise in Real Life with rights to inspect and issue reports on the matters at hand.
 
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