IT article: "State spending has soared by 1/3rd since 2016 with little discernible benefit"

[Marsupial]

I can say with certainty that it places no additional administrative burden or cost on us.

But a whole new Government Unit was set up to oversee it:

"Since establishment, there has been a growth in the mandate and workload of the DPC. Funding for the DPC has increased more than six-fold from its 2015 allocation of €3.647 million, to a €23.2 million Budget allocation in 2022. This has been in line with its increased functions and responsibilities. Based on current information, the DPC staffing numbers have increased from 110 in 2018 to 191 at the end of 2021 and there is provision for total staff numbers of 258 by the end of 2022, based on the sanctioned budget allocation."

And that's just one of many new bodies that have been set up to supervise something or other since the days when Bertie announced that
the then Director of Corporate Enforcement would have to "wait his turn" for extra staff.

 

[Purple]

And that's just one of many new bodies that have been set up to supervise something or other since the days when Bertie announced that
the then Director of Corporate Enforcement would have to "wait his turn" for extra staff.

Yes, layers of inefficient bureaucratic fat clogging the arteries of the State. No need for most of it if the State Sector functioned efficiently.

 

[odyssey06]

The DPC here is responsible for oversight on some of the largest tech companies in the EU, because their European headquarters are here, bringing in massive tax revenues. Of all the increases, this is one of the most understandable.

This is not something you should skimp on given our EU wide responsibilities and the stakes.

Since the introduction of the General Data Protection Regulation (GDPR) in May 2018, the DPC has imposed fines of more than €4 billion on big tech firms. Just €20 million of that has been paid, as most of the rulings are under appeal. In May 2023, the DPC imposed a record fine of €1.2bn on Meta for breaches relating to the transfer of personal data from the EU to the US.

Data protection watchdog moves to new Dublin headquarters

The Data Protection Commission has moved to new headquarters in Dublin which will bring together all of the Commission's Dublin-based staff into one office.

www.rte.ie

 

[Marsupial]

Since the introduction of the General Data Protection Regulation (GDPR) in May 2018, the DPC has imposed fines of more than €4 billion on big tech firms. Just €20 million of that has been paid, as most of the rulings are under appeal.

More money for the lawyers. And much of it coming from the Irish taxpayer. Who gets the fines at the end of the day? The Exchequer or the EU?


Incidentally, I agree with you about the importance of the DPC; it's come a long way since Bertie (yes, that man again) located it above a Centra shop in Portarlington! I quoted it simply as a convenient example of bureaucratic and budgetary growth.

In response to your link to the new DPC offices: remember this?

Department of Public Expenditure queried “exorbitant” cost of plan for new headquarters for Data Protection Commission​

 

[Purple]

Is the 1/3rd increase in state spending not just keeping in line with 8 years inflation from 2016 to 2024 in particular the high inflation experienced in 2022/23 ?

Consumer Price Inflation during that period was 20.5%.
It would be very surprising if a substantial element of that was driven by increases in Government Spending.

 

[Purple]

More money for the lawyers. And much of it coming from the Irish taxpayer. Who gets the fines at the end of the day? The Exchequer or the EU?

We get billions in taxes from the MNC's that we regulate.

 

[Marsupial]

We get billions in taxes from the MNC's that we regulate.

if they were regulated from Rome, Rodez or Riga we'd get the exact same billions.

 

[Purple]

if they were regulated from Rome, Rodez or Riga we'd get the exact same billions.

They are regulated where they are headquartered, which is where they pay their taxes so no, we wouldn't.

 

[Zenith63]

The population supported by the government has increased 7.5% over that time period and the cost of goods/services has increased 23%, so a 33% increase in spending was required for the government to deliver a similar level of service to 2016 no?

 

[odyssey06]

In response to your link to the new DPC offices: remember this?

That's on the OPW not the DPC... hammer away there!

 

[Purple]

The population supported by the government has increased 7.5% over that time period and the cost of goods/services has increased 23%, so a 33% increase in spending was required for the government to deliver a similar level of service to 2016 no?

Of course cost savings and investment in IT and better processes, as well as shared services centres, standardisation of contracts and HR function and all of the other improvements that the Public Sector engage in each year have negated the need for much of that investment... oh, wait...

 

[Itchy]

The DPC here is responsible for oversight on some of the largest tech companies in the EU, because their European headquarters are here, bringing in massive tax revenues. Of all the increases, this is one of the most understandable.

This is not something you should skimp on given our EU wide responsibilities and the stakes.

Apart from that, what have the Romans ever done for us?

The one that probably ticks the most boxes is New Zealand because it has a similar population, 5.22 million versus 5.3 million. Both countries also have comparably sized civil services. New Zealand has almost 64,000 civil servants versus our 53,000.

The bad news is that New Zealand came joint sixth in the index and wipes our eye on all four measures, particularly in people and processes (they come second and we come 57th). The only area in which we come close is public policy (we come eighth and they come 6th). For the record, they are placed 12th for national delivery and 11th for strategy and leadership.

It’s probably a bit simplistic, but both countries seem to be equally good at coming up with policies, although we are much worse at getting them done. Could the fact that New Zealand civil servants seem a much happier bunch than our own be the reason? Could the fact that there are 10,000 more of them explain the difference?

John McManus: How many civil servants does it take to run a small country like Ireland?

We are pretty good at coming up with policies but average at implementing them compared to peers

www.irishtimes.com

 

[AlbacoreA]

I think it's the management culture. They come up with bad ideas, won't listen or learn from any criticism, double down when, as predicted, it goes wrong. There is no ownership or responsibility. So when projects fail, or have cost overrun there are no penalties. So it gets repeated over and over. They mitigate any responsibility or ownership by spreading it wide and far across outsourcing and large committees.

You see it from the smallest project to the largest one. It's a bit like yes minister.

People will say that just what it costs due to inflation. But I think the cost of things is impacted by govt policies.

DPC is Cherry picking one thing out of hundreds that perhaps was simply required.

 

[Interstellar]

Worse than that is that we are spending more than we take in tax. If it were not for corporation tax we would have run a deficit all those years. Someone said once we are living beyond our means.

 

[nest egg]

There is no ownership or responsibility.

This is the main reason our services are average at best.

From reasons I'll never understand, the politicians stand up and say they're 'responsible' for these services, despite the fact that most of the problems are deep-seated, and require solutions spanning multiple government terms to fix.

Realistically the only people who can drive the change necessary for these solutions through to completion, are the CS/PS, as they're the only ones who are certain to still be in their jobs in 5 years time. The politician needs to think about their re-election prospects, so cannot act in the long term.

The next politician who says they would lay out major initiatives, name the Sec Gens responsible for delivery, and hold them publicly to account, I would vote for. This would be meaningful public representation,. The next government could then take up the baton and do similar, and we may over time start to get some value out of the services we pay for.

 

[joe sod]

You see it from the smallest project to the largest one. It's a bit like yes minister

except the mandarins here probably not as eloquent as "Sr Humphreys" probably more like dermot morgan's "Mara" from scrap saturday?

 

[T McGibney]

PJ Mara was a government advisor, not a civil servant.

One of his skills was "persuading" civil servants to attend to the projects and objectives that his bosses had prioritised

 

[BIG-notorious]

The DPC here is responsible for oversight on some of the largest tech companies in the EU, because their European headquarters are here, bringing in massive tax revenues. Of all the increases, this is one of the most understandable.

This is not something you should skimp on given our EU wide responsibilities and the stakes.

The then DPC gave a speech at a conference i attended ahead of the coming into force of GDPR.

She used words to the effect that nobody needed to worry about GDPR being enforced in a hurry. And the institution has remained true to the spirit of her words....being under-resourced is a very credible excuse for not doing the thing your institution exists to do...

 

[joe sod]

PJ Mara was a government advisor, not a civil servant.

i know that it was dermot morgan's potrayal of him I was thinking of in terms of advising haughey, it would be difficult to find an exact analogy given that our senior civil servants are basically grey and unknown.

 

[letitroll]

They mitigate any responsibility or witnesses ownership by spreading it wide and far across outsourcing and large committees.

THIS is the way it works.........civil servants never seek the best most efficient way forward.....they seek the best way forward constrained by the double bottom line of career risk & reputational parent quango risk........it leads to circuitous and perverse incentives and therefore outcomes.....these incentives are mirrored in the private sector.....what mitigates the craziness in the private sector is the almighty P&L....without P&L discipline the former factors get out of control.

I'm not sure if there's any solution - what I do know is that in a period of surplus, like we've had for a number of years, the civil service tapeworm wii eat it..... if there isn't somebody at the very top with their foot firmly on the brakes in terms budgets & saying no....... things get out of control and quickly.....anecdotally I'm aware of outrageous expansion of headcount in various departments and quangos with not a single drop of accountability as regards increased delivery.

I guess the good news is that if/when we get in trouble from a budget point of view.......a hiring freeze and budget cuts would truly just be cutting into fat for a few years with no discernable diminution in the states capacity to provide the services it provides today.