Is it the end of the Spanish Property boom?

Re: Is it the end of the Spanish boom.?

Like to read Auto 320's comments on this as he firmly believes from an earlier post Spain is still the best place to buy a property in Europe. Looks likes the game's up for Spain.
 
Re: Is it the end of the Spanish boom.?

I think what everyone has to look at is buy in price. No good buying a smashing place for 250,000€ and then getting low rentals and little chance of resale. Unless you have a couple of million sitting in the bank, buy low and make a tidy profit. Low price means low loss (and this is nothing to do with cheap as too often cheap is what it says on the tin!)
 
Re: Is it the end of the Spanish boom.?

Daddy said:
Like to read Auto 320's comments on this as he firmly believes from an earlier post Spain is still the best place to buy a property in Europe. Looks likes the game's up for Spain.
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Almost what I said, not quite. I think that Spain is the best place in Europe to buy a holiday home. The investment element can also be attrractive if you buy smart and don't follow the crowd into new developments with prices that are above the market and include a high commission layer to boot. Buy well and you can sell well, and enjoy a fabulous quality of life in the intervening years.
 
Re: Is it the end of the Spanish boom.?

auto320 said:
Almost what I said, not quite. I think that Spain is the best place in Europe to buy a holiday home. The investment element can also be attrractive if you buy smart and don't follow the crowd into new developments with prices that are above the market and include a high commission layer to boot. Buy well and you can sell well, and enjoy a fabulous quality of life in the intervening years.
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Fair point but that can be said of anywhere. Even Bulgaria. Of course local knowledge benefits you, just like it benefits a guy buying locally in a Cork estate.

But as an investment vehicle, Spanish property is not a wise choice. Much better risk/reward elsewhere.

As a holiday home? Better to rent for the moment.
 
Re: Is it the end of the Spanish boom.?

Amarin said:
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But as an investment vehicle, Spanish property is not a wise choice. Much better risk/reward elsewhere.

I agree that Spanish property is not the best investment in Europe but, where do you think offers better risk/reward.
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Re: Is it the end of the Spanish boom.?

Amarin said:
As a holiday home? Better to rent for the moment.
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Why do you say that?

I'm interested in reading your logic and your data sources. Remember, we're talking about a holiday / retirement home.

Is it because rental yields for when you're not using the property are already below mortgage rates?

Is it because you can invest elsewhere and can make higher returns on other asset classes to pay the rent on a Spanish house, instead of paying a mortgage that gives you capital later?

Or is it because you expect houses prices to fall in the short term, so it is simply better to wait before buying?

Or indeed something else .....
 
Re: Is it the end of the Spanish boom.?

Amarin said:
Fair point but that can be said of anywhere. Even Bulgaria.
But as an investment vehicle, Spanish property is not a wise choice. Much better risk/reward elsewhere.
As a holiday home? Better to rent for the moment.
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Spain has one of the most vibrant economies in Europe, and comparisons with Bulgaria are hardly valid on a range of fronts, not least the climate, the steady flow of inward investment over decades, an excellent infrasructure, easy accessability from the regions with highest spending power in Europe, and the fact that the market prices are primarily driven by local buyers.

While pure investment with no personal use interest may have an edge in other locations, the south coast of Spain remains the most desired holiday home destination for would-be buyers from all over Europe, and careful picking through even this main-stream market can yield excellent capital growth over the lifetime of the investment. Go deeper, and leave behind the mass-marketers and the full-priced new developments, and Spain can provide excellent investment material for the canny buyer.

It is all too easy to dismiss Spain as a "frothy" market, based on a superficial knowledge of the country and the property business there, but anyone who knows the country well can find a myriad of oportunity there. Of course there is also plenty of rubbish, or indeed lots of over-priced but nice quality property, but we are all investors here, and we know the difference.........!!
 
Re: Is it the end of the Spanish boom.?

Andrew.G said:
Amarin said:
.

But as an investment vehicle, Spanish property is not a wise choice. Much better risk/reward elsewhere.

I agree that Spanish property is not the best investment in Europe but, where do you think offers better risk/reward.
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You will have to do your own research on that one.

Martin77 said:
Why do you say that?

I'm interested in reading your logic and your data sources. Remember, we're talking about a holiday / retirement home.

Is it because rental yields for when you're not using the property are already below mortgage rates?

Is it because you can invest elsewhere and can make higher returns on other asset classes to pay the rent on a Spanish house, instead of paying a mortgage that gives you capital later?

Or is it because you expect houses prices to fall in the short term, so it is simply better to wait before buying?

Or indeed something else .....
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As a holiday home where lifestyle etc are important then capital depreciation may not really be an issue to you. I will try to return to your other questions when I have the time.
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Re: Is it the end of the Spanish boom.?

Amarin said:
As a holiday home where lifestyle etc are important then capital depreciation may not really be an issue to you. I will try to return to your other questions when I have the time.
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Thanks. I read an article in the Economist hard-copy magazine some time ago. Ref: "Still want to buy?" The Economist, March 3, 2005. Unfortunately I cannot find it published for free online so I cant post a link. But I'm sure you guys have already heard of it, as it went into the relative merits of buying and renting property for personal use in some of the major economies.

I have no hidden agenda on this one. I've lived "abroad" for nearly 15 years now and I already speak 4 languages pretty well. I'm planning on retiring in the 5-10 year timeframe and am trying to find the right spot on Earth for me. This is obviously a fairly long term project. During the transition I'd certainly want to live in a holiday home for example over the Winter, and continue working at my present location in the Summer. So I thought I'd better begin looking now. Turkey is off the list as I don't think I can fit in with the culture after having had a few visits. SA is just too dangerous for me although I have a few friends who have moved to the Cape. New Zealand is a possibility although a bit cold when I visited. I'm learning Spanish and I already know people there, so it's certainly an option.

I am genuinely interested in gathering a number of views of where to look in Spain and how to go about it (e.g. try before you buy through rental, buy immediately or wait, just rent forever). If it can be an investment, even better.
 
If you want to spend the winter in your holiday home ,i think myself that you might as well buy in the canary islands as the weather is warm and sunny there in the winter.The fact is, while the south of spain is a great place for a holiday home ,in winter it is not as hot as the canaries imo .A BIT like comparing the past week of dry weather here with a weekof fine weather here in july.
 
sunrock said:
If you want to spend the winter in your holiday home ,i think myself that you might as well buy in the canary islands as the weather is warm and sunny there in the winter.The fact is, while the south of spain is a great place for a holiday home ,in winter it is not as hot as the canaries imo .A BIT like comparing the past week of dry weather here with a weekof fine weather here in july.
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You see, I am of the opinion that if you are looking for a holiday home you should look closer to Ireland. I believe Global Warming is going to have a factor in the future and if people don't believe me they should look at the market in some of the european ski slopes. They ain't getting the snow like they use to.

Actually read at the weekend some advice from property investors.(sunday indo) One said that west cork was going to be the med of the future and i 100% agree with it. Its not going to be the algave but better.

I am not saying that one should buy in west cork because the market is too high to enter. But there are other areas in the west/south west that would be a good long term bet.

Spain is only going to get hotter and they made the mistake of drilling into too much bore water. Unlike say France where there is legislation preventing this.
 
The Spanish market is in serious trouble. [A lot of the planning officials in Costa del Sol I believe are in Court! ]. Still the building goes on...still the agents hype over-priced properties and sell dreams to unsuspecting public.Who wants to live on a golf course? I have yet to meet someone who cashed their chips in and made a profit. Look at the websites....thousands of properties for sale...few if any buyers. Mortgages usually only available on new developments, where developer part underwrites it with the Bank. Caveat Emptor....
 
canny said:
The Spanish market is in serious trouble. [A lot of the planning officials in Costa del Sol I believe are in Court! ]. Still the building goes on...still the agents hype over-priced properties and sell dreams to unsuspecting public.Who wants to live on a golf course? I have yet to meet someone who cashed their chips in and made a profit. Look at the websites....thousands of properties for sale...few if any buyers. Mortgages usually only available on new developments, where developer part underwrites it with the Bank. Caveat Emptor....
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An outsider's view of the Spanish market, full of generalities but not the full picture.

The Spanish market is not in serious trouble, it has slowed from the boom days with regards to Irish and German buyers, but the British are buying strongly and the locals are buying everything in sight. A group of the previous administration in Marbella are in jail, and the council has refused to honour previously issued licenses, but in reality this is a pre-election stunt and they can not deny the rights of people who could not have known that the administration was corrupt and whose lawyers could not have been expected to go behind official permts issued by the town hall. In reality, banks are happy to provide mortages on these "suspect" properties, and buyers are happy to buy them, since if the town hall decide to demolish them they mst compensate owners at full market value. That's the realty, everything else is scaremongering.

Who wants to live on a golf course? Not me, but thousands of people would love to, and such properties sell readily every day on the Costa del Sol.

Yet to meet someone who cashed in their chips and made a profit? How do you do, pleased to meet you! I have always turned my various Spanish homes at a profit, and I expect to do the same with my current one if I ever sell it.

Few if any buyers? Not true. Thousands of homes for sale, of course, its a huge market. Some sell more slowly than others, or not at all in some cases if they are wrongly priced or in the wrong place -- the day you buy etc..

Mortgages only available on new properties? Not the case. I know of someone who sold an apartment in Marbella a few weeeks ago (yes, it was one of the ones affected by the town hall license issue), and the buyer got a local mortgage for 80% of the price. Buyer was English, for the record.

Granted, buying new in a market where beter value can be had in the resale market is not the cleverest thing to do, but the market in trouble? Not the case.
 
Look at reason for blip in stockmarkets today..Spanish Property Developers...!!! Banks will be very reluctant to lend in this scenario.
I do agree that buying older resale properties might be an option, in/or close to a town/city, where resale might be to a local. Recently drove Malaga - Sotogrande....could hardly see the sea for the concrete. Pay as little as possible, and enjoy it for yourself, without putting house at risk....
 
redo said:
http://www.rte.ie/business/2007/0424/spain.html
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Never saw the irish banks stocks getting hit because of the spanish market. That took me my surprise. Too much equity off irish property is not only in the irish market but also in the spanish market. and both are falling. not to mention the money in eastern europe.

And auto, what you say may be true but to me you are beginning to sound like travelbug and her assertions on the bulgarian market.

It says something to me and to others potential investors. Say out of both Bulgaria and Spain for the moment. I think you would have to agree.
 
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