General view of the four year plan?
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Ceist Beag
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Is the 4 year plan up for voting? I didn't think it was - it will just be used to form the budgets over the next four years I thought? That said, given the lack of any detail to start with themselves in terms of reducing expenditure I now sincerely hope the budget is not passed.
The_Banker
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Regardless of how people feel about it I would prefer if we, the Irish people had a choice on voting for it by way of general election rather than have it foisted on us by the worst government in the history of the state.
The_Banker
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Its much too late and not drastic enough up front. We have a hole in our finances for past 2 years in which time we have added 30-40bn to national debt. We've waffled about fixing this hole for 2 years and now we have another 4 year plan. I would rather a few sharp quick cuts than death by a thousand cuts over 4 years.
I would prefer that option as well.At the very least FG and FF should have both put forward a budget and we could have then given a mandate based on that.
Do we have any choice now?
rustbucket
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Is anyone else getting sick to the teeth of the Unions. I am (and Im a public servant)
Cant abide them, dont agree with them. Nothing but trouble
Cant abide them, dont agree with them. Nothing but trouble
And the relevance of this to the thread is ?
Let's look at the reality of things to come:-
1. 24000 Public Servants to be made unemployed. Therefore, millions worth of disposable income not available to the Private Sector (supermarkets, shops, restaurants etc).
2. Minimum Wage to be reduced. Great, more disposable income not in circulation.
3. Lower Paid to be introduced to the PAYE, again more disposable income not available.
4 Water Charges to be introduced, great for the county councils and useless for everybody else.
5. Site Tax, furtive little tax which will be increased yearly, any disposable left from foregoing to be retained for this.
6. Anybody being employed in the Public Service (e.g teachers) to be employed @ 10% less than their colleagues who have already accepted at least 14% reduction in wages. Of course it's more money that wont be available to the entrepreneurs.
7. Social Welfare Entitlements to be means tested. Do I see the chance of new civil servants being recruited, consequently? And what about the new devices to detect that mobile phones of some non Irish claimants are still in the country? The latter is as inspiring as the unused and expensive voting machines.
8. Still nothing on the reduction of the amount of TDs. It's the same story with the Senate.
9. Still no chance of seeing crooked politicians, incompetent bankers in jail. Compound this with students being hammered while protesting and the dreadful manhandling of a single protester standing in front of a politician's car last Sunday. I wont even mention the people who cannot pay their mortgages and about to be evicted.
10. Not to be forgotten . . . less disposable income plus negative equity will put pressure on many many marriages leading to divorce/separation which leads to more Social Welfare payouts.
And the furtive taxes to follow. Our nationhood has been compromised. There's only one thing left - - - EMIGRATE.
1. 24000 Public Servants to be made unemployed. Therefore, millions worth of disposable income not available to the Private Sector (supermarkets, shops, restaurants etc).
2. Minimum Wage to be reduced. Great, more disposable income not in circulation.
3. Lower Paid to be introduced to the PAYE, again more disposable income not available.
4 Water Charges to be introduced, great for the county councils and useless for everybody else.
5. Site Tax, furtive little tax which will be increased yearly, any disposable left from foregoing to be retained for this.
6. Anybody being employed in the Public Service (e.g teachers) to be employed @ 10% less than their colleagues who have already accepted at least 14% reduction in wages. Of course it's more money that wont be available to the entrepreneurs.
7. Social Welfare Entitlements to be means tested. Do I see the chance of new civil servants being recruited, consequently? And what about the new devices to detect that mobile phones of some non Irish claimants are still in the country? The latter is as inspiring as the unused and expensive voting machines.
8. Still nothing on the reduction of the amount of TDs. It's the same story with the Senate.
9. Still no chance of seeing crooked politicians, incompetent bankers in jail. Compound this with students being hammered while protesting and the dreadful manhandling of a single protester standing in front of a politician's car last Sunday. I wont even mention the people who cannot pay their mortgages and about to be evicted.
10. Not to be forgotten . . . less disposable income plus negative equity will put pressure on many many marriages leading to divorce/separation which leads to more Social Welfare payouts.
And the furtive taxes to follow. Our nationhood has been compromised. There's only one thing left - - - EMIGRATE.
What it actually is, in effect, is the FF economic manifesto for the next General election in the New Year. What I personally would like to see, is for each of the other political parties to come up with their own version of a 4 year plan, so people could easily compare and contrast and make a rational and informed decision as to what to do when they vote.
edit in bold above
I think the plan is an assault on young people - why didn't they just include a one way plane ticket and be done with it.
No reductions of politicians pay, expense regime, no tackling tax fugitives
.
Even symbolically, I expected Cowan to take a pay cut but no, minimum wage cut first. Absolute obscenity.
No reductions of politicians pay, expense regime, no tackling tax fugitives
.
Even symbolically, I expected Cowan to take a pay cut but no, minimum wage cut first. Absolute obscenity.
You are missing one very important thing about reality here. There is no net loss to the economy in this instance. In order to keep these people employed their salaries will have to be taxed out of the economy. The productive economy is better off the less people are employed in the public sector, and it is a boost to employment in the productive economy that is needed most.
This on the other hand is a way of increasing taxation and this is negative on the economy. Now I do believe that everybody should be paying income tax, regardless of their income, but this is simply a measure to increase the overall tax take.
When there is high unemployment it means there is an imbalance of supply of and demand for labour. Usually when supply and demand are off balance, prices adjust up or down. But when prices are not allowed to go down beyond a set amount, then no balance will be achieved, in this case unemployment will remain high. Lowering the minimum wage will have a positive effect on increased job opportunities.
I am glad they have at least given some details over where the cuts will come. I always thought it was a mistake to plan cuts over a 5 year period but not to give details. This leads to uncertainty as a lot of people are afriad to spend money.
It will be interesting to see how much of it will be implemented.
It will be interesting to see how much of it will be implemented.